Monsanto cannabis yes or no? The DNA Protection Act of 2013

[Harrekin]

To all the Pro-GM crowd, please eat GMO's to your hearts content... Obamacares on the way in so at least treatment won't cost so much when cancers eating the arse out of you or you're showing signs of chronic organ disease or allergies... As far as population control goes, this is a great test to see if you're worth keeping around.

Show me ONE document from the big 3 in the GM field that PROVES GMO's are safe for human consumption without adverse or unwanted side effects...

Not some bullshit Monsanto, DuPont, Syngenta or their FDA lapdogs deem safe without any testing, review, independent auditing or oversight...

Give me evidence that they are harmful.

You don't try disprove something without an indication it exists first.

Put your thinking cap on next time.

 

[Dr Kynes]

DDT? Don't look at the headline, look at where they suspend the rules.

In Europe, the interaction of the phenomenon of "dying bees" with imidacloprid has been discussed for quite some time now.[SUP][52][/SUP][SUP][53][/SUP][SUP][54][/SUP] It was a study from the "Comité Scientifique et Technique (CST)" which was in the center of discussion, which led to a partial ban of imidacloprid in France. The imidacloprid pesticide Gaucho was banned, in 1999 by the French Minister of Agriculture Jean Glavany, primarily due to concern over potential effects on honey bees.[SUP][55][/SUP][SUP][56][/SUP][SUP][57][/SUP] Consequently when fipronil, a phenylpyrazole insecticide and in Europe mainly labeled "Regent", was used as a replacement, it was also found to be toxic to bees, and banned partially in France in 2004.[SUP][58][/SUP]
In February 2007, about forty French deputies, led by UMP member Jacques Remiller, requested the creation of a Parliamentary Investigation Commission on Overmortality of Bees, underlining that honey production was decreasing by 1,000 tons a year for a decade. As of August 2007, no investigations were yet opened.[SUP][59][/SUP] Five other insecticides based on fipronil were also accused of killing bees. However, the scientific committees of the European Union are still of the opinion "that the available monitoring studies were mainly performed in France and EU-member-states should consider the relevance of these studies for the circumstances in their country".[SUP][60][/SUP]
Around the same time French beekeepers succeeded in banning neonicotinoids, the Clinton administration permitted pesticides which were previously banned,[SUP][61][/SUP] including imidacloprid. In 2004, the Bush Administration reduced regulations further and pesticide applications increased.[SUP][62][/SUP][SUP][63][/SUP]

ohh what fresh hell is this?

this is some new shit. it has no relation to your old shit.

sorry bro, but this is the citation you provided, it has nothing to do with any of the shit youre talking about.

i dont know where you found this NEW shit, but this NEW shit also doesnt have shit about the FDA unbanning a pesticide. the closest it comes is the stattement: "Around the same time French beekeepers succeeded in banning neonicotinoids, the Clinton administration permitted pesticides which were previously banned,[61] " but inline citation [61][SUP][/SUP] goes right back to your old shit which makes no such claim. welcome to wikipedia. it's written by dolts who dont know what theyre talking about.

i was in the pesticide game for more than a decade, and i cant think of a single case of the FDA or EPA unbanning a controlled use pesticide once they banned it.

im not sayin youre lying, im saying show me which pesticide got unbanned and when.

	[h=2]RE-REGULATION OF PESTICIDES[/h] Fall '96

"Without chemicals, so went the television commercial, life would be impossible. But some chemicals do more harm than good.

Some 850 million pounds of chemicals are used each year to produce the nation's food supply. These are pesticides, the chemicals that allow farmers to combat insects, weeds, rodents and mold that threaten their fruits and vegetables.

Outside Links[SIZE=-1][HR][/HR] [HR][/HR] HR1627: A bill to amend the Federal Insecticide, Fungicide, and Rodenticide Act and the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, and for other purposes, signed into law, August 1996. [HR][/HR] [/SIZE]

Widespread use of pesticides began shortly after World War II. But in 1962, when Rachel Carson's Silent Spring linked pesticides to problems with human health and the environment, Americans started to become more concerned about how their food was processed, and years of debate ensued. "Along with the possibility of the extinction of mankind by nuclear war," Carson wrote, "the central problem of our age has become the contamination of man's total environment with such substances -- substances that accumulate in the tissues of plants and animals and alter the very material of heredity upon which the shape of the future depends.''

A decade later, one of the best known of these pesticides, DDT, was banned in the United States. As technology improved, it became easier to find minute traces of carcinogens in processed food. Since new traces were now constantly being discovered, the question soon became, how far should regulation attempt to go, before regulation became counter productive?
For two decades, Congress has tried to pass a bill to improve pesticides regulation, split between those who wanted the Environmental Protection Agency to speed up approval of pesticides, and those who were concerned that any change would threaten the public's health.
The 104th Congress finally rewrote a version of federal pesticide regulation that could satisfy itself and a president, and on August 3, 1996, President Clinton signed their efforts into law.
Although the measure does away with the Delaney Clause of the 1958 Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act which prohibited processed foods with any trace of any chemical that was proven to cause cancer, it still imposes a very strict standard that many opponents had hoped would not pass. The new provision says the EPA must ensure that pesticide residues on both processed and raw food do not pose more than a one in a million chance of causing cancer. The EPA would have to review the standards within 10 years.
In addition, the EPA could set more stringent standards for foods that are eaten by children, who are more susceptible to pesticide poisoning. The agency will, nonetheless, be allowed to use its discretion to admit slightly higher pesticide residues, if to do otherwise would force certain fruits and vegetables off the market.
Moreover, the EPA will publish a pamphlet listing the advantages and disadvantages of pesticides, letting consumers know which foods had pesticide residue in excess of the new one in a million standard. The pamphlet will be available in supermarkets.
Other highlights:
CHILDREN: In addition to the EPA setting more stringent standards for foods that are eaten by children, the departments of Agriculture, and Health and Human Services were instructed to study children's eating habits and pesticide exposure.
STATES: The legislation prevents individual states from passing tougher pesticide regulations than the federal rules, unless a state petitions the EPA for permission and the EPA does not reject the application.
PESTICIDE REVIEW: The EPA was told to speed up the its review of pesticides used on fruits and vegetables. Generally, the agency would have one year to act on requests to use a particular pesticide. The EPA also would have to speed up the procedures for registering pesticides used for disinfecting and sanitizing.
LEGISLATIVE PROCESS:
The EPA's huge backlog on reviewing pesticides and recent court cases that threatened to force some common chemicals off the market, spurred Congress into final action. Aides to House Commerce Committee Chairman Thomas J. Bliley, Jr. (R-VA), and Democrat Henry Waxman D-CA), a leading environmentalist, wrote a bill in mid-July behind closed doors.
The greatest bone of contention came over the Delaney Clause - Republicans wanted to impose more relaxed standards than did the Democrats. But since GOP lawmakers were anxious for an election year environmental bill, and lobbyists were just plain tired of fighting, the House, on July 23, unanimously passed the bill by an expedited procedure known as suspension of the rules.
The Senate passed the identical measure a day later without debate nor a dissenting vote."



none of that shit is in your citation.
bring up even more DIFFERENT unrelated shit still leaves your initial claim of some particular pesticide being un-banned swinging in the breeze.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Your skilled in debate, good for you, that doesnt make you right

thats not debate skill, nor is it trickery it's how you make a claim and back it up.

if you make a claim, and cannot back it up your claim is UNSUPPORTED.

unsupported claims dont mean shit.

if you want to make a claim that monsanto is plotting to steal your weed, or murder your cat, or touch your dick, all you gotta do is provide a little proof.

when monsanto is the accused, you dont even need too much proof, since they really are bastards, but you need SOMETHING or your just pissing all over your giant floppy squeaky multicoloured shoes.

 

[Grandpapy]

ohh what fresh hell is this?

this is some new shit. it has no relation to your old shit.

sorry bro, but this is the citation you provided, it has nothing to do with any of the shit youre talking about.



none of that shit is in your citation.
bring up even more DIFFERENT unrelated shit still leaves your initial claim of some particular pesticide being un-banned swinging in the breeze.

emm, yes. my first post #1168

I believe I stated it required "careful reading".

 

[Dr Kynes]

emm, yes. my first post #1168

I believe I stated it required "careful reading".

the wikipedia link features an inline citation (number 61) which goes to a PBS newshour story from 1996 which does not have any relation to the line it purports to be the source authority for.

lets recap: "Around the same time French beekeepers succeeded in banning neonicotinoids, the Clinton administration permitted pesticides which were previously banned,[61] "

but [61] leads to: http://www.pbs.org/newshour/backgrounders/pesticides.html

which in no way supports the claim that the FDA (or the EPA even) has unbanned a pesticide EVER, but instead discusses a relaxing of the impossible pesticide residue standards which made all pesticide use on food crops impossible, and was never actually enforced since the regulations were idiotic.

and still doesnt explain how the wiki-author gets "the Clinton administration permitted pesticides which were previously banned" from the citation listed.

it just doesnt work.

you may recall the Alar scare, when local news broadcasts were awash with "pesticide residue on our apples!!!" stories, which resulted in multiple scientific facepalms.

the Alar residue was NOT NEW, but the testing methods which detected the residue were. Alar was a shockingly safe product, and the only way to get the levels of Alar required for their 5 per million lifetime cancer risk claims was to guzzle 5000 gallons of apple juice a day.

pesticides are not "poisons" like arsenic or hydrogen cyanide, farmers do not gas their crops with Zyklon B and the mad claims of the anti-GMO crowd are still just farts in a hurricane.

 

[UncleBuck]

thats not debate skill, nor is it trickery it's how you make a claim and back it up.

if you make a claim, and cannot back it up your claim is UNSUPPORTED.

unsupported claims dont mean shit.

if you want to make a claim that monsanto is plotting to steal your weed, or murder your cat, or touch your dick, all you gotta do is provide a little proof.

when monsanto is the accused, you dont even need too much proof, since they really are bastards, but you need SOMETHING or your just pissing all over your giant floppy squeaky multicoloured shoes.

you supported your claim with a single dentist and an alarmist website. you had to stay away from the actual science of it because it turns out that when diluted to parts per million, fluoride is harmless. despite all your protestations.

that's what happens when you decide first and justify later, kynes. you get stuck defending these silly bircher conspiracies. aren't there any other groups that you can join who oppose multiculturalism and all the nasty shit that comes out of non-anglo cultures yet who don't espouse ridiculous commie conspiracy theories?

 

[Dr Kynes]

fluoride is not poisonous when diluted to parts per million. might as well argue against water chlorination, despite all of its very positive benefits.

or do you like cholera?

even when diluted to the recommended 5 PPM, sodium fluoride is still toxic, because it's still sodium fluoride. at 5 ppm arsenic wont kill you, but at 5 ppm hydrogen cyanide sure will. both are still poisonous.

if i piss in a swiming pool my piss is now highly dilute. but will you take a drink? it is after all still piss. and i eat a lot of asparagus.

 

[Harrekin]

you supported your claim with a single dentist and an alarmist website. you had to stay away from the actual science of it because it turns out that when diluted to parts per million, fluoride is harmless. despite all your protestations.

that's what happens when you decide first and justify later, kynes. you get stuck defending these silly bircher conspiracies. aren't there any other groups that you can join who oppose multiculturalism and all the nasty shit that comes out of non-anglo cultures yet who don't espouse ridiculous commie conspiracy theories?

^^^

???

 

[Dr Kynes]

you supported your claim with a single dentist and an alarmist website. you had to stay away from the actual science of it because it turns out that when diluted to parts per million, fluoride is harmless. despite all your protestations.

that's what happens when you decide first and justify later, kynes. you get stuck defending these silly bircher conspiracies. aren't there any other groups that you can join who oppose multiculturalism and all the nasty shit that comes out of non-anglo cultures yet who don't espouse ridiculous commie conspiracy theories?

i didnt say i was winning he fluoride argument, but i am actually providing evidence for my claims.

my claims and assertions regarding fluoride have SOME substance. and SOME is orders of magnitude better then NONE.

also, its not just that one dentist, theres LOTS of dentists opposed to fluoridation, and the national kidney foundation has now gone from Pro-fluoride to Nuetral, which means in about 150 years maybe we might end this boondoggle.

slow gradual change. and when fluoride is gone, you wont even miss it. unlike the right to keep and bear arms. we'll have sellers remorse on that issue within weeks of our submission.

 

[UncleBuck]

even when diluted to the recommended 5 PPM, sodium fluoride is still toxic, because it's still sodium fluoride. at 5 ppm arsenic wont kill you, but at 5 ppm hydrogen cyanide sure will. both are still poisonous.

if i piss in a swiming pool my piss is now highly dilute. but will you take a drink? it is after all still piss. and i eat a lot of asparagus.

oh noes!

fluoride! commies are coming to make us effeminate and gay and take us over!

fluoride is not poisonous when diluted to parts per million. the worst that can happen is fluorosis, which is the equivalent of taking a rough crap.*

oh noes! fluorosis! look how horrible (and rare) it is!

DAMN YOU COMMUNIST RUSSIA! LEAVE OUR TEETH ALONE AND STOP MAKING OUR BABIES GHAY AND MULTICULTURAL!

 

[UncleBuck]

i didnt say i was winning he fluoride argument, but i am actually providing evidence for my claims.

my claims and assertions regarding fluoride have SOME substance. and SOME is orders of magnitude better then NONE.

also, its not just that one dentist, theres LOTS of dentists opposed to fluoridation, and the national kidney foundation has now gone from Pro-fluoride to Nuetral, which means in about 150 years maybe we might end this boondoggle.

slow gradual change. and when fluoride is gone, you wont even miss it. unlike the right to keep and bear arms. we'll have sellers remorse on that issue within weeks of our submission.

yep, because water fluoridation and gun bans that no one is proposing is the same damn thing.

you have lost your goddamn mind, kynes.

 

[Harrekin]

yep, because water fluoridation and gun bans that no one is proposing is the same damn thing.

you have lost your goddamn mind, kynes.

Lets not forget how the CIA engineered "the AIDs" to kill the gays and the blacks.

Your tin-foil won't protect you now!

 

[Dr Kynes]

yep, because water fluoridation and gun bans that no one is proposing is the same damn thing.

you have lost your goddamn mind, kynes.

and yet, the fluoride thing, and the "kynes is a bircher" bullshit are your pathetic strawmen. my choosing to indulge your pathology is entirely separate from your ignorant assumptions.

you can call me a "bircher" all you like, your words disturb only the air, and while i dont particularly fancy fluoride in my water, i dont actually worry about it.

these little games are your only recourse to distract and evade when confronted with facts, such as :

Sodium Fluoride has a Lethal Dosage of 5-10 grams.
there is no known Lethal Dosage for BT corn, roundup ready tofu or Flav-R-Savr tomatoes.

even that silly frenchman and his silly "experiment" with mice genetically engingeered to get cvancer was unable to determine a Lethal Dosage for roundup ready corn.

he did however "prove" that spiking a mouse's water with Roundup will make it live longer and healtheir than mice denied the health benefits of Roundup, so thats something.

Monsanto.
We Make The Things That Make Rodents Healthier.

 

[UncleBuck]

and yet, the fluoride thing, and the "kynes is a bircher" bullshit are your pathetic strawmen. my choosing to indulge your pathology is entirely separate from your ignorant assumptions.

you can call me a "bircher" all you like, your words disturb only the air, and while i dont particularly fancy fluoride in my water, i dont actually worry about it.

these little games are your only recourse to distract and evade when confronted with facts, such as :

Sodium Fluoride has a Lethal Dosage of 5-10 grams.
there is no known Lethal Dosage for BT corn, roundup ready tofu or Flav-R-Savr tomatoes.

even that silly frenchman and his silly "experiment" with mice genetically engingeered to get cvancer was unable to determine a Lethal Dosage for roundup ready corn.

he did however "prove" that spiking a mouse's water with Roundup will make it live longer and healtheir than mice denied the health benefits of Roundup, so thats something.

Monsanto.
We Make The Things That Make Rodents Healthier.

not a distraction or evasion at all, it's an indictment of what you let pass for science. it's extremely selective.

 

[Dr Kynes]

not a distraction or evasion at all, it's an indictment of what you let pass for science. it's extremely selective.

and the attempted distraction continues.

despite your obvious inability to provide the Lethal Dose for roundup ready corn, and your inability to find any statement in which i declare myself a member of the John Birch Society you maintain the fiction.

i am NOT a member of the John Birch Society, i have never been a member, and will never be a member.

i have never espoused any of the claims the John Birch Society makes, nor have i ever cited their sources for any reason.

just the fact that is am not a fan of fluoride (which many people oppose, not just the John Birch Society) and think multicutluralism is crap (which many other people also oppose, besides the John Birch Society) is not evidence that i secretly take my marching orders from the JBS website or whatever claim you come up with next.

you are playing the same pointless ad hominem game that "newworldimbecile" indulges in when he calls me a "Zionist Piggie Jew" for darinng to hold a different opinion on israel, or "diverseasylum" "dnainmymouth" and that fat fuck "ninjablower" play at when they accuse me of being paid by monsanto.

when you cant prove your own claims, distract with a new, and even more outrageous claim...

drop your supreme knowledge on us master uncleduckfucker. whats the lethal dosage for GMO wheat?

if you cant provide an answer, then go with ninjablower to the airport men's room and start working the glory hole.

nobody want to answer your foot tapping in this giant public toilet of a thread.

 

[Harrekin]

and the attempted distraction continues.

despite your obvious inability to provide the Lethal Dose for roundup ready corn, and your inability to find any statement in which i declare myself a member of the John Birch Society you maintain the fiction.

i am NOT a member of the John Birch Society, i have never been a member, and will never be a member.

i have never espoused any of the claims the John Birch Society makes, nor have i ever cited their sources for any reason.

just the fact that is am not a fan of fluoride (which many people oppose, not just the John Birch Society) and think multicutluralism is crap (which many other people also oppose, besides the John Birch Society) is not evidence that i secretly take my marching orders from the JBS website or whatever claim you come up with next.

you are playing the same pointless ad hominem game that "newworldimbecile" indulges in when he calls me a "Zionist Piggie Jew" for darinng to hold a different opinion on israel, or "diverseasylum" "dnainmymouth" and that fat fuck "ninjablower" play at when they accuse me of being paid by monsanto.

when you cant prove your own claims, distract with a new, and even more outrageous claim...

drop your supreme knowledge on us master uncleduckfucker. whats the lethal dosage for GMO wheat?

if you cant provide an answer, then go with ninjablower to the airport men's room and start working the glory hole.

nobody want to answer your foot tapping in this giant public toilet of a thread.

Between 2 - 5% of the population can't eat any wheat...so theres that just to muddy the water for you guys further.

Please tho, continue.

 

[nitro harley]

oh noes!

fluoride! commies are coming to make us effeminate and gay and take us over!

fluoride is not poisonous when diluted to parts per million. the worst that can happen is fluorosis, which is the equivalent of taking a rough crap.*

oh noes! fluorosis! look how horrible (and rare) it is!

DAMN YOU COMMUNIST RUSSIA! LEAVE OUR TEETH ALONE AND STOP MAKING OUR BABIES GHAY AND MULTICULTURAL!

I hope you went in and got that looked at..............nitro..

 

[UncleBuck]

i have never espoused any of the claims the John Birch Society makes, nor have i ever cited their sources for any reason.*

i never said GMOs were lethal, dipshit.

too bad you can't erase history, either. dumbass.

lets all run away from the facts and truths exposed by the John Birch Society, and the wisdom of their founders and leaders. if we call them racist then we can burn them at the stake right? lets call them crazy too, then we can piss on the ashes! lets say they are conspiracy nuts, then we can put the piss soaked ashes into a lead lined urn and dispose of it with our spent nuclear fuel rods! Brilliant!

the John Birch Society has the desire to defend REAL AMERICA from the multicultural wasteland of bullshit, limp dicked liberals, and mindless drones of the leftist establishment. claiming the John Birch Society is made up of out of touch octogenarians with racist tendencies and a pathological fear of everything that they oppose is absolute crap. if the John Birch Society is wrong, then please explain:

the trilateral commission*
the council on foreign relations
the bildeberger group
the federal reserve's creation on jekyll island in georgia
the 1968 "crime bill" that banned sawed off shotguns, machine guns and grenades in response to the assasinations of JF and RF Kennedy, and mlk
legislation against thought and opinion (hate crime laws) rather than deeds.*
use of eminent domain to profit private interests
the new york times' "man in moskow" Walter Duranty selling stalin as the greatest leader since moses while he murdered half the nation.
chris "Tingles" mathews publicly admitting he gets thrill up hius leg every time he sees The Immaculate One
rachel maddow and ed schultz having "news and opinion" shows
"the young turks" who are even named after a genocidal marxist movement in the ottoman empire.*


all in all the John Birch Society has more shit right than they have wrong, and they have a way better track record than the new york times for truth, and are much more accepting of diverse opinions than the leftist press or leftists in general.*

slinging all this vitriol at the Koch family is unwarranted, and duplicitous when you realize it's coming from the same bunch who still applaud and revere henry kissinger and the rockerfellers

 

[Dr Kynes]

i never said GMOs were lethal, dipshit.

too bad you can't erase history, either. dumbass.

too bad that was all in response to your allegation that im a member of the john birch society (which is as untrue now as it was then) and none of those statements are an admission of membership (cuz i aint one) nor an invocation of their crazy theories.

"they are not nazis" is not "i love them and believe all the shit they believe"

just like "israel has the right to defend itself" does not equate to "im a zionist piggie jew who wants to murder every palestinian and steal their land"

those statements above are still true, and your assertions that im a "bircher" are still 100% false.

sorry dumbass.

and you still havent provided the Lethal Dosage information for Starlink corn.

 

[echelon1k1]

Give me evidence that they are harmful.

You don't try disprove something without an indication it exists first.

Put your thinking cap on next time.

Actually after reading through this thread, I do support GMO for those who are stupid enough to ingest it...

We need to get rid of the useless eaters and current control measures are not working fast enough...