wyteberrywidow
Global
Thank you as that's my only point 400 watts or lower LEDs will rock but for a larger scale bid
Which is better hid or led?
- Thread starter halfbaked90
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hyroot
Well-Known Member
If you have enough leds you can do a perpetual. Instead of asking every 3 weeks or month. How about per batch? Some people dont have a perpetual. Or like me I do a perpetual. But never have enough money at the right time to get more soil for next batch. Due to other bills.. Get at me in oct. Ill have 2 led and my t5 doing a qper per plant main line method. my 1 led and my t5 cover 4x4. Not enough light for a perpetual. But I have 16 3 footers in 2 gal air root bags. they are 2 weeks in. I have 15 in veg in 2 gal. But im vegging these for 8 weeks instead of the usual 4 weeks. Going to transplant into 5 gal at week 5 of veg.
Also yield mostly depends on strain. Sativas yield the most. Sativa dominant hybrids yield more than indica dominant hybrids. Pure indicas veg very slow and yield the least. I do pure indicas. I estimate pulling a little over a pound under 702 watts at the end of august. If I was doing hybrids I would get twice as much.
Also yield mostly depends on strain. Sativas yield the most. Sativa dominant hybrids yield more than indica dominant hybrids. Pure indicas veg very slow and yield the least. I do pure indicas. I estimate pulling a little over a pound under 702 watts at the end of august. If I was doing hybrids I would get twice as much.
Ahh k. So which LED company you working for?? *jks*
My unit suppose to have the 3w Cree chip. So what your saying is that my unit is some cheap ass useless grow light. F@CK!
That Ben guy from hydroponics hut had falsely advertise his units. F@cken prick! He should be shot dammit!
You mentioned that Epistar and bridgelux are all Chinese made. Isn't everything else made from there..
Anyways my opinion on LEDs is still the same. They still suck ass!
There must be a grow journal out there that is genuine.
Most LED grow journals are very weak and there is no way that I'll drop 2k on something that probably
wont do the job. Also I hate it when people post there journals on grow sites and mention that there not affiliated with the company from which they bought there led panels from.
tenthirty
Well-Known Member
Better is a relative term.
Everybody's situation is different.
Here are a few observations from my situation.
I have 2 3x3 ebb and flow tables side by side. A 600 hps on one side to finish and a pro-gro 180 and 260 for the first month of 12/12.
With questionable led quality, the 400 watts of led is about equal to the 600 hps as far as I can tell.
What the problem is with my setup is the led coverage is not enough for the whole 3x3 table. Good thing the hps bleeds over to help cover the closest plants.
With these panels I would need about 600 watts of these leds to give the proper coverage in the 3x3 space, if they came in the appropriate sized enclosure.
What I have noticed is that the leds do tend to yield better quality for any given strain, and all the other good stuff with cooling, etc that you read in grow journals.
Now if good leds can be 50% more efficient than cheap Chinese, this means that the 600 watts of cheap leds could be replaced by 300 watts of the good stuff. Only problem is that this is probably a do it yourself kind of thing and it's not going to be cheap or easy.
So which is better?
Everybody's situation is different.
Here are a few observations from my situation.
I have 2 3x3 ebb and flow tables side by side. A 600 hps on one side to finish and a pro-gro 180 and 260 for the first month of 12/12.
With questionable led quality, the 400 watts of led is about equal to the 600 hps as far as I can tell.
What the problem is with my setup is the led coverage is not enough for the whole 3x3 table. Good thing the hps bleeds over to help cover the closest plants.
With these panels I would need about 600 watts of these leds to give the proper coverage in the 3x3 space, if they came in the appropriate sized enclosure.
What I have noticed is that the leds do tend to yield better quality for any given strain, and all the other good stuff with cooling, etc that you read in grow journals.
Now if good leds can be 50% more efficient than cheap Chinese, this means that the 600 watts of cheap leds could be replaced by 300 watts of the good stuff. Only problem is that this is probably a do it yourself kind of thing and it's not going to be cheap or easy.
So which is better?
I second this also... BUT! i think they wouldn´t be the best for larger scale grows, not because they can't catch up with the performance... it's just that it would be just tooooo way too expensive to fill a big room with HIGH QUALITY leds. I still belive, you could get better yields though, comparing a 1000W HPS VS 1000W CREE, Osram or Lumileds... the thing is... to fill that room with 650 diodes... man.. we are talking several thousands... so.. in that case, better to have a decent amount of herb at a more accesible price. Because other thing is happening... this is like computers... you buy a pentium 4 today and they release the pentium 5 tomorrow. If you spend 5 thousand dollars on leds... you'll regret it 2 years from now, when you see leds pulling twice your yields and maybe even at a lower cost. So, for me, it is better to keep LEDs for home personal consumption set ups, where, i belive, you will get a lot of benefits, at a higher price, but mostly, the much longer lifespan, makes it a good investment in the long term. But then again, and a repeat it for the 100 time... you'll only see that benefit, if you go for the correct leds.
Peace man.
tenthirty
Well-Known Member
Just look at the price and specs of the new lumi-grow lights.
http://www.lumigrow.com/products/pro-series-greenhouse-lights/
Hand made with the best leds, cost would be comparable.
http://www.lumigrow.com/products/pro-series-greenhouse-lights/
Hand made with the best leds, cost would be comparable.
That's an EXCELENT point you brought up... it all depends on your set up. For example. I built my closet. It is a 75cm X 75cm space (2,5 X 2,5) and i intend to use that for a long long time. I have two rooms in it. On the top, my veg room, and on the botom my flowering room, runing a perpetual.
For my flowering room, a 400W in that space, would have been just to difficult to manage, and even impossible in full summer. Besides, i didn´t want to spend that much in electric bill since i already had a 400 HPS and know how much raises my bill... now, add to that my veg room, it would have been just too much. And also, having a perpetual, made me think i wouldn´t depend on extreme yields every 3 months, since i could be harvesting every 2, 3 weeks. So, my first option was a 250W HPS. Then, a friend got me into the led thing, and seeing the false promises, i went for a 200W Chinese last generation panel expecting maybe same results as with my ex 400W HPS and making it easy to use in my definitive 2,5 X 2,5 space. Expectations were high and the panel just couldnt do it. Sold it at the same price i got it. USD300. Then, i went digging more on leds, not worrying about price, since i just wanted the best i could get for my 2,5 X 2,5 space. After a lot of research, i found the panels i have now. I have 4 panels inside my 2,5 X 2,5 room. Each one of 56W led consumption, 224W total led power, 240W total power consumption. SO, my idea, was, if i could get, the same amount of herb i was getting from my ex 400W, using less space and less wattage. PLEASE COME ALONG!...
I put a container in the flowering room with 7 clones in it, which was intended to show the room potential. This container, uses exactly 1/4 of my space... having 4 panels inside, and considering i could put 4 of this same containers inside, that result would have given me an idea of how much the complete room could yield.
That container, is the one i've showed here. If i could get 50 grams out of it, i would be happy, since it would mean i could be getting at least, 200 grams out of my flowering room, having the chance to beat that results over time. The way i see it, it will come to be more than 50 grams, so i'm very pleased, knowing there still much to improve in my set up and i can still get better results.
Other thing i liked, the panels cover my space completely... it's like a wall of light over the plants. Never again will have to worry abaout shadows and stuff... i don´t depend any more on a central light that loses penetration when it hits solid stuff on the way. Now, almost each bud inside, has it's own light source right on top of it. So, i just throw the girls inside, and no matter how i put them, no matter if they are taller, thiner fater, i know they are getting the light they need, since i have several light spots all over the surface.
Other thing i liked, is that if for some reason, some plants get too stretched... i can lift or downlift each panel separetly, so that way i can have the light close to every sector inside no matter if some plant got crazy and went up out of control. In a traditional light source, this is a big problem, since you have to lift the light only for that stretched plant, and the rest are left to far away from the light. Or you would have to bend or invent something. That stuff, is old news for me, i can adjust the distance of the panels for each sector separetly.
Other thing i liked. Is that if i had a 200W light, or a 250W light. I would always have to run that amount of power, no matter if i wanted more or less, i would always have to stick to that power. Now, if i want, for some reason, use just 2 panels and reduce my power consumption i can just light 2 of them and use half the power. Obviusly half the yield also.. but i liked having this option of using all of them or only one if i wanted.
These many reasons made me go for led, because it was for me, the best option i could get for my 2,5 X 2,5 closet. Plus all this benefits, if they were high quality leds that would bring me better results... i was sold, and here i am with my led flowering room runing at full capacity.
I have now my first plants harvested, which represents, exactly 1/4 of my room potential. So far, liking very much the results i'm seeing, tho i have to wait till it gets dry to make my conclusions.
That's why, i think your opinion is very accurate, you have to see what's better for your set ups. Maybe, for bigger set ups, would be better to combine high power HPS with better distribution of light LEDs.. that way, you'll get the benefit of both.
If you want, i can show pictures of what i cut today, and also my closet so you can see it... i don't know if anyone is interested.
And Wordtz... i dont have dry buds yet, only wet... in a week or so, i can start showing them dried.
Peace out everyone.
well i can show some resin development of some i have inside... take a look.
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Endur0xX
Well-Known Member
This thread is Classic!!!
my first successful LED run (I had 2 going at once and the other went to shit because of lack of experience) 135 watts light but that was the only plant under it that did well...Now this was about 6-7 months ago
Here is what my room looked like with HIDs: (12/12 from seed)
Here is what it looks like now ... you say more than 400W LED is a waste of time? I disagree... I was barely home for this grow and it looks like its going to be by far my biggest harvest, using 800watts compared to 1100 in my previous setup (also 12/12 from seed)
my first successful LED run (I had 2 going at once and the other went to shit because of lack of experience) 135 watts light but that was the only plant under it that did well...Now this was about 6-7 months ago
Here is what my room looked like with HIDs: (12/12 from seed)
Here is what it looks like now ... you say more than 400W LED is a waste of time? I disagree... I was barely home for this grow and it looks like its going to be by far my biggest harvest, using 800watts compared to 1100 in my previous setup (also 12/12 from seed)
Endur0xX
Well-Known Member
I wish there was a way to hit the like button more than once!!
haha you liked it?
Yours is looking great, good big buds. Nice what can be done dooing higher wattages. But for me, little rotative set ups is what im trying to pull of and try to keep the jars continuoslly filling up. I'm trying to make it soi can be harvesting every 2 weeks. That would be very nice if i can get to bring the results i'm expecting, i will be just fine to keep mi supply always filled.
Cheers man, wish you all the success in your grow... post results when you have them
Endur0xX
Well-Known Member
yeah I got a tent going now because I kept running out of weed and I still had to buy it... so I set up a tent but now it starting to look like that one room might be enough for me!! You cant tell on the pics but if you look at my journal the last update you will see that I have 2 plants that are 2 weeks behind, 2-3 plants that are 3ish weeks behind and 6 (3 REG and 3 FEM) that have not shown their sex yet ... they should be ready to repot as soon as I harvest 1-2 plants in a couple weeks. I kept going back and forth between having a perpetual or just starting a batch all at once, ... so I am doing a mix of both, trying to always have a few plants to harvest here in there but the bulk of it all at once.
Endur0xX
Well-Known Member
Yes, because you like it. I love both of them, currently i am running two CFL in my veg room and three LED lamps in the flower room. Both of them are working fine and helpful.no no !! LEDs are better!!!
I also belive arguing is unworthy, yet, from all the discussion, some interesting things rise up, and in the end, everyone should just try to get all the info they could from every discussion... the arguing and stuff.. should be left aside... but there is worthy information always coming up in every discussion that will always help everybody expand their knowledge.
But in this discussion, i must say i belive, LEDs are indeed more eficient lights... but as stated many times before, not any led, just the good high quality ones will deliver the higher performance. Nevertheless, the goal here, is to grow nice weed and keep your jars filled up. No matter if with HID or LEDs, Mj will be always nice and well received and will most certainly give us those high experiences we look for. But in this matter, discussing wether HID lamps or LEDs can bring up bigger yields at same power consumption, i would have to say, that i'm on the LED side... not saying HPS are bad, in fact, those are excelent lamps, that you can feel certain they will perform excelent. LEDs are a more risky option right now, but i belive if you find the right one, you can hit the jackpot.
But as i said, this are only details. The main thing is to get nice tasty smelly mind blowing marihuana... and that can be done with both lights pretty well. But, in this matter, HID is a more secure option, since if you go for a bad choice in leds, it is possible you end up with a panel uncapable of delivering flowers worth all the effort. With HID no matter wich lamp you choose, it's performance is like more "standard" like... it always does it's job. Leds as i said, can be a little more risky and maybe you could end with a low performing panel. It is all about doing a good and deep research and not fall for exagerated promises. There is science behind everything. I always try to get to were the scientific backup is. Not wanting to belive something just cause i read it somewere or heard it from someone. I like to know. WHY! is that different things happen in plants, what happens inside them, what makes a light more efficient than other in terms of specs, raw data!.... in everything i try to go for the bases of the information i receive and try to dig into it to get a clear idea of what it really means.
Understanding something, does not mean to just memorize the formula... it's about knowing what you are doing, and not just doing it.
Peace brothas
Endur0xX
Well-Known Member
I was just putting fire to the conversation 
Personally I was too fkin paranoid about burning down my house with 2 HIDs in such a small room... So I was hoping that LEDs would cut it because I wasnt too keen on going back with the HIDs , well it turns out that was the best move for me ... more buds, more peace of mind
I dont need to hear HIDs are safe when they are set properly ... I was paranoid, nothing you can do about it
Personally I was too fkin paranoid about burning down my house with 2 HIDs in such a small room... So I was hoping that LEDs would cut it because I wasnt too keen on going back with the HIDs , well it turns out that was the best move for me ... more buds, more peace of mindI dont need to hear HIDs are safe when they are set properly ... I was paranoid, nothing you can do about it