Even the socialists hate Obamacare

[ginjawarrior]

No, I would have replied if I could understand what the hell you were saying.

Your analogy about cars doesn't work because unless your spending mega money on buying car the your car is using old tech even if it's straight off the production line

A lot of medcine is evolving at such a rate that by the time economies of scale would apply the way of treatment changes

Doctors should be using the best treatments at their disposal rather than obsolete tech

 

[Mr Neutron]

Your analogy about cars doesn't work because unless your spending mega money on buying car the your car is using old tech even if it's straight off the production line

A lot of medcine is evolving at such a rate that by the time economies of scale would apply the way of treatment changes

Doctors should be using the best treatments at their disposal rather than obsolete tech

Or... maybe that is because we don't buy insurance to cover the cost of buying a car.

 

[ginjawarrior]

Or... maybe that is because we don't buy insurance to cover the cost of buying a car.

The car market does not translate to the healthcare market

 

[ChesusRice]

Your analogy about cars doesn't work because unless your spending mega money on buying car the your car is using old tech even if it's straight off the production line

A lot of medcine is evolving at such a rate that by the time economies of scale would apply the way of treatment changes

Doctors should be using the best treatments at their disposal rather than obsolete tech

only way economies of scale will work
is if we line up all the heart surgery patients at one time and then use a conveyor to put them thru the surgery production line

oh wait

that wont work well

 

[Mr Neutron]

The car market does not translate to the healthcare market

Ok, well then tell me why laser eye surgery is cheaper than it was when it first broke onto the scene. Is their technology from 10 years ago?

 

[ginjawarrior]

Ok, well then tell me why laser eye surgery is cheaper than it was when it first broke onto the scene. Is their technology from 10 years ago?

60 years is how long its been known for

The last 10 years probably has to do with mass produced machines and advancements in computing and optics

Uunfortunatly not something that can benefit all medicine

 

[ChesusRice]

Ok, well then tell me why laser eye surgery is cheaper than it was when it first broke onto the scene. Is their technology from 10 years ago?

Man that is so easy

Because
There are thousands of more laser eye surgery centers
more Lasik machines
that = more supply than demand

 

[Mr Neutron]

60 years is how long its been known for

The last 10 years probably has to do with mass produced machines and advancements in computing and optics

Uunfortunatly not something that can benefit all medicine

So, you don't know why but are convinced that whatever is the reason(s), it won't work for healthcare as a whole?

 

[Mr Neutron]

Man that is so easy

Because
There are thousands of more laser eye surgery centers
more Lasik machines
that = more supply than demand

wait for it...

 

[ChesusRice]

wait for it...

A few things stand out on this chart:

• We see that it's a relatively new industry, with tremendous growth in the
  late 1990s.
• We see how cyclical demand is (see the recession of 2002), and how its tied
  to economic growth. (Note that the 2008 number is an estimate from November
  2007; the current 2008 estimate is likely much lower considering the state of
  the economy.) However, we already knew these first two points.
• Perhaps, the most important thing we can see from this chart is the secular
  slowdown that appears to be occurring. Despite all the credit excesses, the
  run-up in housing prices, and higher confidence in this surgical procedure, at
  no point in the decade was the surgery more demanded than in the year 2000.
  Furthermore, despite a strong economy, surgeries actually dropped from 2005
  onward.

This raises the following questions:

1. What is the market going forward?
2. Did all the likely adopters already have the surgery, meaning the
   sustainable annual rate of surgeries going forward is much lower than the past
   cycle would indicate?
3. What is the sustainable number of annual surgeries going forward?

These are tough questions to answer, but they do clarify why value investors
prefer industries that are tried and tested, as there is far less uncertainty
involved.

 

[ginjawarrior]

So, you don't know why but are convinced that whatever is the reason(s), it won't work for healthcare as a whole?

Lol show me any other 60 year old technique and I can show you something that has gotten cheaper

Now look at the rest of medicine that is using new technique and see it hasn't had time to get cheaper

 

[VILEPLUME]

Who doesnt want to be a socialist?

No, I am opposed to helping the poor getting affordable healthcare and not being a greedy motherfucker.

 

[Moses Mobetta]

To me it seems the US government has screwed up just about everything it's gotten involved with, I just don't see how this will be any different,

 

[VILEPLUME]

 

[VILEPLUME]

 

[Moses Mobetta]

She looks hungry.

 

[nontheist]

Sounds to me everyone is ignoring how bad this system is setup for the hope everyone will get great insurance and everything will be latte fucking da. I am sorry to piss on your hopes but Insurance companies will try everything possible to not give you expensive care. They will string you around for years hoping you die before they pay 400k for the treatment you need. That won't be good enough either, they will flip flop money around showing they're losing profit margins and keep increasing rates. Nothing like paying more for insurance to help kill poor people, reality is a bitch.

 

[ChesusRice]

Sounds to me everyone is ignoring how bad this system is setup for the hope everyone will get great insurance and everything will be latte fucking da. I am sorry to piss on your hopes but Insurance companies will try everything possible to not give you expensive care. They will string you around for years hoping you die before they pay 400k for the treatment you need. That won't be good enough either, they will flip flop money around showing they're losing profit margins and keep increasing rates. Nothing like paying more for insurance to help kill poor people, reality is a bitch.

Sounds like you support the public option then

 

[Moses Mobetta]

Sounds to me everyone is ignoring how bad this system is setup for the hope everyone will get great insurance and everything will be latte fucking da. I am sorry to piss on your hopes but Insurance companies will try everything possible to not give you expensive care. They will string you around for years hoping you die before they pay 400k for the treatment you need. That won't be good enough either, they will flip flop money around showing they're losing profit margins and keep increasing rates. Nothing like paying more for insurance to help kill poor people, reality is a bitch.

I guess we will see over time what really will happen with this but I agree that your scenario is much more likely than the all those economically disadvantaged folks will have better lives because of this scenario.

 

[nontheist]

I guess we will see over time what really will happen with this but I agree that your scenario is much more likely than the all those economically disadvantaged folks will have better lives because of this scenario.

They do it all the time to middle class, I have seen so many horror stories of people that make 150k going bankrupt with insurance, think they will care more for poor people? A private sector system is not a fix for healthcare, its going to be a nightmare.