New High Times Suggests Harvesting Earlier...RIU Rejoice!
- Thread starter CaptainCAVEMAN
- Start date
Alex Kelly
Active Member
This thread is interesting and innovative let's keep it going. BUMP. Anyone else with any opinions or experience to share???
CaptainCAVEMAN
Well-Known Member
Here is the same plant from above after 4 days of hang dry, on it's way to jars. It's White Berry from Paradise seeds. I need a better camera or something cause theese pictures don't do it justice!
tardis
Well-Known Member
bullshit.
in MY experience in 2010 i've found that clear is bunk, milky is strong, and amber is relaxing. best to harvest when all or almost all clear are gone, and it is mainly milky with some very noticable amber.
tardis
Well-Known Member
What i've found is the earlier you harvest the more soaring the high but the SHORTER the high lasts... Say one soaring puff and 20-30 minutes later you are kinda hungover. whereas mostly cloudy with some amber can give you an amazing high which lasts 2+ hours.
Micromaster
Active Member
Amber trichs is just oxidized thc
Alex Kelly
Active Member
Okay you can't just walk in and shut down this guys research article which he obviously spent alot of time on and got published in High Times and have no type of real or scientific evidence to back up your claims. Personal opininion/experience is not enough. THIS is real evidence and science which makes complete sense and presents a much more valid arguement than you.
""I would imagine that the isomeric breakdown of remnant carboxylic acids (which I would imagine to be higher if cut early) underlines that although cropping earlier = more THC, a good proper cure is just as important as the early crop. Although, with this logic, CBN is created mainly during the curing process, so under the same token, possibly a shorter cure would bolster such desired outcomes.
Lets think about this then:
For an early crop:
Early crop = more carboxylic acids, about the same THC, and less CBD.
Cure = Carboxylic turns to THC, existing THC breaks down to CBD and CBN. THC overall level may edge up a bit, but probably ends up holding the line.
For a Later Crop:
Later cropping = Less Carboxylic acids, More THC, and a good presence of CBD and compared to the early crop.
Cure = Less THC is yielded from the Carboxylic acids, and the existing THC breaks down into CBD and CBN.
So even though you start out with more THC on a later cure, you will probably end up with less THC (as it will not be replenished through the curing process), or a shittier high as the CBN (which will be in higher quantities with the later cure) will block the THC from getting to more of your brain receptors.
Article makes some sense.
So I suppose, with this thinking, a later crop should cure for less time to retain THC levels. So fuck the taste. And if you crop early, cure for a normal period of time to have the carboxylic acids fully turn to THC.
If you are selling however, once you hit a certain quality threshold: weight = money. This maybe a better tip for head stash, or people pin pointing depression.""
Obviously we are going to have to side with this guy who obviously has presented real evidence and proof of the possibility that there will be a higher present THC content in the Trichromes of finished buds which were taken down when the Trichromes were clear v.s. mostly cloudy and or amber in appearence. I will definately be putting this to the test with my sativas can't wait. Amber trichromes point to the presence of more CBN which, as you can see above, leads to a shittier feeling high.
Lets think about this then:
For an early crop:
Early crop = more carboxylic acids, about the same THC, and less CBD.
Cure = Carboxylic turns to THC, existing THC breaks down to CBD and CBN. THC overall level may edge up a bit, but probably ends up holding the line.
For a Later Crop:
Later cropping = Less Carboxylic acids, More THC, and a good presence of CBD and compared to the early crop.
Cure = Less THC is yielded from the Carboxylic acids, and the existing THC breaks down into CBD and CBN.
So even though you start out with more THC on a later cure, you will probably end up with less THC (as it will not be replenished through the curing process), or a shittier high as the CBN (which will be in higher quantities with the later cure) will block the THC from getting to more of your brain receptors.
Article makes some sense.
So I suppose, with this thinking, a later crop should cure for less time to retain THC levels. So fuck the taste. And if you crop early, cure for a normal period of time to have the carboxylic acids fully turn to THC.
If you are selling however, once you hit a certain quality threshold: weight = money. This maybe a better tip for head stash, or people pin pointing depression.""
Obviously we are going to have to side with this guy who obviously has presented real evidence and proof of the possibility that there will be a higher present THC content in the Trichromes of finished buds which were taken down when the Trichromes were clear v.s. mostly cloudy and or amber in appearence. I will definately be putting this to the test with my sativas can't wait. Amber trichromes point to the presence of more CBN which, as you can see above, leads to a shittier feeling high.
You have to also consider the majority of the trics' which is why sometimes its better to harvest when a few are starting to turn amber, as some of the clears at that point are just reaching full size and numbers. This really isnt new, in fact its incredibly old information. Go look at Ed and Mel's MJ growers handbook, I've had a copy since the 80's, Ed states that you should harvest when clear for the most THC. You need to consider if there are still trics that are growing while everything is clear. If you had say 1000 clear trics but if you wait another 2 weeks and you have 200 new clears, 600 still clear 400 milkly you are probably better off. For a single trich, I think its pretty much a scientific fact that this is when you will have the most THC for that one trich, I dont really think its disputable. Of course there are some reasons for wanting more CBD/N those are also things to consider. There is no one answer to the question, but if you understand the concepts involved you can make an educated decision as to what you want to do. Things like if you plan to harvest in stages, then you probably want to harvest top bud earlier than if you are going to cut the entire plant at 1 time because the top buds which you will be harvesting are at their most potent stage. Where you might wait a little longer till some of the lower buds are have grown more trichs if you do the entire plant at 1 time.
Alex Kelly
Active Member
I agree with you just imo amber trichs are bad. At the very latest i would harvest when I saw the very first amber trich or at least start my 2 days of darkness b4 harvest.
CaptainCAVEMAN
Well-Known Member
All comments are welcome but ones like theese are most helpful. +rep
Hudsonvalley82
Well-Known Member
Yeah the problem is knowing when to harvest clear trichs, if you harvest too early you get fucked, if you harvest too late, you missed the boat, so you really have to take the cues from the plant. When you start to see even a few milky, I would go to 48 of dark and get the trim station ready.
tardis
Well-Known Member
Anytime I've harvested any plant too early, as for example one OG Kush #18 which along side its ready sister I harvested, it was nowhere near as potent or enjoyable. I'm speaking from MY limited newbie experience, and i'm not going to harvest a 10 week strain at week 5 or 6 no matter what this article says. Was the word "bullshit" much too harsh? Perhaps.
I'm going to keep doing it my way as anytime i've experimented with what they are suggesting i've been greatly dissapointed.
Psycological problems? I've never heard that, how about quoting a reference for your information.
I'll wait.
Hudsonvalley82
Well-Known Member
trichome fiend
Well-Known Member
...I'll be waiting also.
Hudsonvalley82
Well-Known Member
Quote from another forum:
In the article "Resin Factory", HT travels to a huge grow op where the owner talks about harvesting when the trichs are just starting to turn milky (most of them are clear) after reading notes from a study by Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg . Here is a quote from the HT article:
"Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg who found that THC in the resin head is at it's peak when it's still clear - not opaque and certainly not amber. Dr. Mahlberg stuck a tiny syringe into the bulbous head of the trichome and extracted it's contents, then analyzed it for THC. The result: Without a doubt, THC is at it's highest before the trichome turns opaque."
End Quote
He's not say week 5 or 6 he is saying like half a week or a week earlier than you normally would. Harvest at the very first sight of milky trichs. Much like I said. Much like I do. Potent as fuck. Milky = loss of THC. Amber = Distinct loss of THC, and much higher levels of CBN.
Chemistry is chemistry. But of course with anything these days, opinions weigh more than facts...So lets debate a pointless and baseless argument some more. This guy is a biology professor for the University of Indiana, whose specialty is the "Ultra structure of the resin-producing gland". All of the veterans I have seen weigh in on when to harvest say clear. These people have their shit together, and have literally, in every sense of the word, brought this down to a science. I would just love to hear what your opinion means to raw data, chemistry, and experience.
Of course there are people who say, "my customers love my pot". That is true. But people also love mcdonalds, people also love brick weed. That has no bearing on this argument. My customers love getting high, if what I have gets them high, then they love it. Bottom line.
This article is not for every grower by any or all means. This is for people striving for an every more clear and THC laced high, in lieu of a couch lock stone (or something). This will indeed lower your yield, and maybe one should just try to cut a piece of one part of the plant off at this stage for head stash and compare it to later harvested bud. This way people can have more subjective fodder to put up against data, education, experience and facts.
In the article "Resin Factory", HT travels to a huge grow op where the owner talks about harvesting when the trichs are just starting to turn milky (most of them are clear) after reading notes from a study by Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg . Here is a quote from the HT article:
"Dr. Paul G. Mahlberg who found that THC in the resin head is at it's peak when it's still clear - not opaque and certainly not amber. Dr. Mahlberg stuck a tiny syringe into the bulbous head of the trichome and extracted it's contents, then analyzed it for THC. The result: Without a doubt, THC is at it's highest before the trichome turns opaque."
End Quote
He's not say week 5 or 6 he is saying like half a week or a week earlier than you normally would. Harvest at the very first sight of milky trichs. Much like I said. Much like I do. Potent as fuck. Milky = loss of THC. Amber = Distinct loss of THC, and much higher levels of CBN.
Chemistry is chemistry. But of course with anything these days, opinions weigh more than facts...So lets debate a pointless and baseless argument some more. This guy is a biology professor for the University of Indiana, whose specialty is the "Ultra structure of the resin-producing gland". All of the veterans I have seen weigh in on when to harvest say clear. These people have their shit together, and have literally, in every sense of the word, brought this down to a science. I would just love to hear what your opinion means to raw data, chemistry, and experience.
Of course there are people who say, "my customers love my pot". That is true. But people also love mcdonalds, people also love brick weed. That has no bearing on this argument. My customers love getting high, if what I have gets them high, then they love it. Bottom line.
This article is not for every grower by any or all means. This is for people striving for an every more clear and THC laced high, in lieu of a couch lock stone (or something). This will indeed lower your yield, and maybe one should just try to cut a piece of one part of the plant off at this stage for head stash and compare it to later harvested bud. This way people can have more subjective fodder to put up against data, education, experience and facts.
Hudsonvalley82
Well-Known Member
Introduction to an interview with Dr. Mahlberg:
"One of only two DEA permits to grow Cannabis in the United States is held by Dr. Paul Mahlberg of the Biology Department at Indiana University, Bloomington. His research program began over 20 years ago and continues to the present, specializing in the ultra structure of the resin-producing gland and the biogenesis of its cannabinoids. With his post-doctoral fellows and graduate students, he has explored these and other topics important to the definition of Cannabis as either a drug or fiber plant."
Link to interview -> http://www.hempfood.com/iha/iha02114.html
"One of only two DEA permits to grow Cannabis in the United States is held by Dr. Paul Mahlberg of the Biology Department at Indiana University, Bloomington. His research program began over 20 years ago and continues to the present, specializing in the ultra structure of the resin-producing gland and the biogenesis of its cannabinoids. With his post-doctoral fellows and graduate students, he has explored these and other topics important to the definition of Cannabis as either a drug or fiber plant."
Link to interview -> http://www.hempfood.com/iha/iha02114.html
Pureblood89
Well-Known Member
The coloration of the gland heads can vary with different strains and maturity, but most start with clear or slightly amber heads that gradually become cloudy or opaque when THC levels have peaked and are beginning to degrade. Regardless of the initial color of the trichomes, with careful observation you should be able to see a change in coloration as maturity levels off. Some cultivators wait for about half of the trichomes to go opaque before harvesting to ensure maximum THC levels in the finished product. However, you will also want to try samples at various stages to see what is best for you. While you may be increasing the total THC level in the cannabis by allowing half of the glands to go opaque, there will also be a larger percentage of CBN, which is why some people choose to harvest earlier while most of the trichomes are still clear.
Logan Edwards is the author of Grow Great Marijuana: An Uncomplicated Guide to Growing the World's Finest Cannabis
Logan Edwards is the author of Grow Great Marijuana: An Uncomplicated Guide to Growing the World's Finest Cannabis