What's wrong with socialism?

[doobnVA]

I like the free market, I don't want anything to be publicly owned that's dumb.

So, the stock market is "dumb"? You realize most companies who sell shares are, in fact, "publicly owned" by those shareholders?

You don't want to benefit from the actual profits of your employer, by owning a stake in the company? You'd rather be constrained to your arbitrarily set "wages", and let a small group of people benefit from YOUR hard work?

Something around here is dumb, I suggest if you want to find what that something is - take a look in the mirror.

 

[doobnVA]

To think that the government has your best interest is stupid. The only person that has your best interest is yourself.

But, but, isn't public ownership "dumb"? Socialism does not advocate government ownership, it advocates PUBLIC ownership (that's you and me, US, together). So, public ownership puts the power in the hands of the PEOPLE, you and me, who have our own best interests in mind.

It seems the only reason you're against socialism, is because someone convinced you that it's bad. someone lied to you.

 

[doobnVA]

Another interesting read:

what "they" don't want you to know about health insurance

http://www.thenewiq.com/integritywatch-blog/what-they-dont-want-you-know-about-health-insurance

 

[sunshine17542]

So, the stock market is "dumb"? You realize most companies who sell shares are, in fact, "publicly owned" by those shareholders?

You don't want to benefit from the actual profits of your employer, by owning a stake in the company? You'd rather be constrained to your arbitrarily set "wages", and let a small group of people benefit from YOUR hard work?

Something around here is dumb, I suggest if you want to find what that something is - take a look in the mirror.

A publicly traded company is a company where the general public can purchase shares. Everyone is allowed to own shares, but only the people that want to buy them buy them. The stock market is the free market. It's not cool to call me dumb I didn't call you dumb. But you are just so much smarter than everyone else here so its probably okay.

 

[sunshine17542]

But, but, isn't public ownership "dumb"? Socialism does not advocate government ownership, it advocates PUBLIC ownership (that's you and me, US, together). So, public ownership puts the power in the hands of the PEOPLE, you and me, who have our own best interests in mind.

It seems the only reason you're against socialism, is because someone convinced you that it's bad. someone lied to you.

Public ownership is dumb too. I don't want to be in a group with you. I am an individual. I have my own thoughts and ideas. I can take care of myself. My best interests are different from your best interests. I am not afraid to be on my own and take care of myself.

 

[sunshine17542]

I love freedom. If we are all grouped together we lose our individual freedom. I'm done with this thread.

 

[JimmyPot]

If you don't have an argument, attack the person. How typical.

Im more of a in your face attack the person type.There is no argument in politics.The left and right blindly follow their guys.I like to attack the people who believe in the greatest evil of all the right.I also like to point out to the right pot smoker that they are a special kind of mindless monkey wlking zombie.The fact that you can not defend such an attack only shows you have never really thought about your own views any deeper then how it effects your wallet.

 

[doobnVA]

ROFL. Wow, sunshine, you have NO idea what's really going on, do you? The stock market is public ownership. Public ownership is a socialist ideal.

You don't want to be in a group with me? What about the "american" group? We are both Americans, are we not? Society is not about the individual. to be a part of a society you have to recognize those other than yourself. I suspect this is what's wrong with our country today. Nobody wants to be part of society.

 

[sunshine17542]

ROFL. Wow, sunshine, you have NO idea what's really going on, do you? The stock market is public ownership. Public ownership is a socialist ideal.

You don't want to be in a group with me? What about the "american" group? We are both Americans, are we not? Society is not about the individual. to be a part of a society you have to recognize those other than yourself. I suspect this is what's wrong with our country today. Nobody wants to be part of society.

We can all be individuals and be apart of society.

 

[Leothwyn]

I like the free market, I don't want anything to be publicly owned that's dumb.

People like sunshine are why anything labeled socialist has no chance here (luckily we don't use that word to label our socialist programs)... hell, we can't even have a discussion about it. They assume we are talking about trying to be just like the USSR was. That is the only type of socialism, right?
Again, with the example of Scandinavian countries... do they have free markets?

If you're getting you're political ideology from fox news, you might not know that they do actually have free markets.

 

[doobnVA]

We can all be individuals and be apart of society.

right. Society is a group of individuals who are dependent on one another, and the group as a whole.

You cannot have a society without interdependence. That is not society, it's just a bunch of individuals standing near each other.

 

[sunshine17542]

People like sunshine are why anything labeled socialist has no chance here (luckily we don't use that word to label our socialist programs)... hell, we can't even have a discussion about it. They assume we are talking about trying to be just like the USSR was. That is the only type of socialism, right?
Again, with the example of Scandinavian countries... do they have free markets?

If you're getting you're political ideology from fox news, you might not know that they do actually have free markets.

Please don't say people like me, you don't know me. And I don't think every socialist idea or program is wrong or bad, but the more you have the more people will become dependent on the government.

 

[sunshine17542]

Socialism: political system of communal ownership: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles

The government is the collection of all of us. Therefore the government would have control in a socialist country.

 

[doobnVA]

Socialism: political system of communal ownership: a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles

The government is the collection of all of us. Therefore the government would have control in a socialist country.

the government is not the "collection of all of us"

Are you a part of the government? No, you aren't and neither are 99.99999% of the rest of us.

So you're basically saying you're against equity and fairness, and would rather see corporate control than democracy?

 

[sunshine17542]

the government is not the "collection of all of us"

Are you a part of the government? No, you aren't and neither are 99.99999% of the rest of us.

So you're basically saying you're against equity and fairness, and would rather see corporate control than democracy?

The government represents us as a whole. I never said I was against democracy. We are all created equally.

 

[sunshine17542]

The problems with society come from people. No matter what type of government or economy you have people are the only variable. People are greedy, they lie, cheat and steal. People create their own problems and we are the ones that have to change. If people followed the ten commandments and stayed away from the seven deadly sins this world would be a wonderful place. Whether you believe in God or not and it doesn't really matter what religion you come from if everyone followed these basic rules everything would be fine.

 

[doobnVA]

The problems with society come from people. No matter what type of government or economy you have people are the only variable. People are greedy, they lie, cheat and steal. People create their own problems and we are the ones that have to change. If people followed the ten commandments and stayed away from the seven deadly sins this world would be a wonderful place. Whether you believe in God or not and it doesn't really matter what religion you come from if everyone followed these basic rules everything would be fine.

Capitalism is driven by greed. is greed not one of the seven deadly sins?

Is "love they neighbor as thyself" not one of the 10 commandments?

Here's a Christian take on socialism

http://blog.beliefnet.com/progressiverevival/2009/09/thanks-glenn-beck---this-socia.html

 

[NoDrama]

Its pointless to argue .........................

Just go visit an Indian reservation and you will see what subsidizing people's existence does.............................

me that its my fault these people are poor when they wouldn't take a job if I begged them?..............................

A better life and becoming successful. I work with these people and see it every day. What Socialist Country has the influx of immigration equal to that of the US?

We may not agree on the 911 problem, but I can sure get behind you on this.

I work on Indian Reservations quite often, we have 4 or 5 smaller reservations in the area, and 1 really big one. I have lived with and been friends with many many Native Americans. I can wholeheartedly agree that they must be the poorest, worst educated, laziest, unhealthiest group of people in the US. There lives are nearly 100% subsidized by the US Government while on the rez. Crime is rampant, domestic violence is the highest in the nation, Vandalism is a sport to them, theft is an everyday occurance. The ones that got out of the rez and got an education only to return to the rez and embezzle the tribes money, I have seen it over and over. The reservation towns are so dirty and trash all over that you would swear you just entered the land fill.

Many of the Native Americans refuse to live on the rez and go get jobs somewhere and make something of themselves, the rest continue taking the government cheese and just living a empty life. Many complain that the "White Man" has it in for them.

Socialism at its finest.

 

[NoDrama]

Capitalism is driven by greed. is greed not one of the seven deadly sins?

Is "love they neighbor as thyself" not one of the 10 commandments?

So is wanting to eat a cheeseburger instead of tofu greed? Is wanting to have the money to pay to put food on your table greed? Do you get a paycheck at work doob? Do you pay your bills with it? You greedy fucker!! You should be down at the inner city giving away 100% of all cash you earn to those who don't have all those things in life that you do!!! Stop paying lip service to the ideal of socialism and go prove what you say! I am living my capitalistic, greedy, self indugent way and I seriously prefer it to any other style of life.

The stock market is not a "Publicly Owned " entity, its just a pool of people who want to own a small bit of a company at a time, in no way is it socialism. Thats not a good example to use Doob, unless you are trying to say that socialism is good for a few years ( Bull socialism) then it all crashes, everyone dies and we start over ( Bear Socialism), cuz thats how the stock market works.

 

[Leothwyn]

Totally destroy someone's culture, throw them on a little piece of crappy land where they cannot live how they were used to living for many, many centuries, and it doesn't go well. Hmm, imagine that.

Many of the Native Americans refuse to live on the rez and go get jobs somewhere and make something of themselves, the rest continue taking the government cheese and just living a empty life. Many complain that the "White Man" has it in for them.

Socialism at its finest.