Yeah that's what gets me,I don't think most Israeli's want to be viewed in the light that Netanyahu's gov. is shining either.
Hamas offensive against Israel
- Thread starter printer
- Start date
The Iranians punch above their weight when it comes to stirring shit up,not much is being said about their nuke program(handcuffs off for a while now),Saddam's downfall was a present from Uncle Sam(we lose blood/treasure they gain unfettered influence in a majority Shite country that had been a Sunni controlled enemy).They control all these proxy groups like puppets and not to mention all the Shaheed drones terrorizing the Ukrainians.The timing is all bad now,but one wonders what will happen if they push to far,the recent Hamas/Israel has their fingerprints all over it as the Israel/Saudi relationship was inches from being formalized and wouldc have cornered the Ayatollah's.
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
I'm pretty sure that the Saddam Iraq was controlled by Saddam's Sunni faction which was a minority of Iraq's pop. which I believe was a Shite majority,the whole Basra region along the Euphrates is Shia .
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
Shite is how Scots say
It made me think of that man’s crass phrase “shithole country”.
The word you seek is Shiite: two Is.
Thanks man,that's why it's beneficial not to be the smartest in the room.
Sativied
Well-Known Member
Israel defends itself at the UN's top court against allegations of genocide in Gaza
Israeli legal advisor Tal Becker told a packed auditorium that the country is fighting a “war it did not start and did not want.”
apnews.com
printer
Well-Known Member
Just too much time with other stuff to keep track of Gaza. Maybe luck will smile on us yet.
State Department: Arab nations will partner with US on Gaza if Israel gets on board
Secretary of State Antony Blinken has returned from a seven-day trip in the Middle East, where he visited nine countries to discuss the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas and the conflicts that threaten a wider regional war.
According to his spokesperson, Matt Miller, the Arab nations are ready to partner with the U.S. on short-term and long-term solutions for Palestinians in Gaza, but only if Israel is willing to get on board.
“We’ve traveled through to nine countries and met with leaders in each of those, and was able to secure agreements with all of these Arab partners, as well as with Turkey, that they were ready to have those conversations, they were ready to coordinate with the United States and they were ready to take real steps to improve the lives of the Palestinian people in Gaza and to look at how to rebuild Gaza and establish Palestinian-led governance in Gaza,” Miller told MSNBC’s Andrea Mitchell on Friday.
“But they were only willing to do that if they had a partner on the other side in Israel and if Israel was ready to take real concrete steps to establish an independent Palestinian state,” Miller continued.
Blinken traveled to Turkey, Greece, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates (UAE), Saudi Arabia, Israel, Egypt and the West Bank to continue diplomatic discussions as tensions in the region have spiked surrounding the Israel-Hamas war.
The most recent trip was Blinken’s fourth visit to the region since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 in a surprise attack that killed 1,200 Israelis and took more than 200 hostages. In the months since, Israel has pursued a deadly and destructive counteroffensive that has killed more than 23,000 Palestinians and displaced nearly all of the region’s population.
Miller said during the most recent trip, there “really was a difference” because the Arab partners they spoke with after the initial attacks were not ready to discuss the reconstruction, security and governance in Gaza, but now they are.
Blinken reportedly had a “very candid conversation” with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and other Israeli government officials about the partners the country would gain in the Arab world if it were to agree on the future of Gaza.
“But look, it’s going to require tough choices, and not just tough choices from Arab partners in the region, but really tough choices from Israel,” Miller said. “And so, the United States can’t make those tough choices for Israel. We can’t make those tough choices for any of these countries.”
Miller said the U.S. plans to play a leadership role in presenting its vision on the reconstruction of Gaza, and that Blinken will “continue to present” and “continue to press” in upcoming trips to the region in the next weeks and months.
thehill.com
State Department: Arab nations will partner with US on Gaza if Israel gets on board
Secretary of State Antony Blinken has returned from a seven-day trip in the Middle East, where he visited nine countries to discuss the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas and the conflicts that threaten a wider regional war.
According to his spokesperson, Matt Miller, the Arab nations are ready to partner with the U.S. on short-term and long-term solutions for Palestinians in Gaza, but only if Israel is willing to get on board.
“We’ve traveled through to nine countries and met with leaders in each of those, and was able to secure agreements with all of these Arab partners, as well as with Turkey, that they were ready to have those conversations, they were ready to coordinate with the United States and they were ready to take real steps to improve the lives of the Palestinian people in Gaza and to look at how to rebuild Gaza and establish Palestinian-led governance in Gaza,” Miller told MSNBC’s Andrea Mitchell on Friday.
“But they were only willing to do that if they had a partner on the other side in Israel and if Israel was ready to take real concrete steps to establish an independent Palestinian state,” Miller continued.
Blinken traveled to Turkey, Greece, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates (UAE), Saudi Arabia, Israel, Egypt and the West Bank to continue diplomatic discussions as tensions in the region have spiked surrounding the Israel-Hamas war.
The most recent trip was Blinken’s fourth visit to the region since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 in a surprise attack that killed 1,200 Israelis and took more than 200 hostages. In the months since, Israel has pursued a deadly and destructive counteroffensive that has killed more than 23,000 Palestinians and displaced nearly all of the region’s population.
Miller said during the most recent trip, there “really was a difference” because the Arab partners they spoke with after the initial attacks were not ready to discuss the reconstruction, security and governance in Gaza, but now they are.
Blinken reportedly had a “very candid conversation” with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and other Israeli government officials about the partners the country would gain in the Arab world if it were to agree on the future of Gaza.
“But look, it’s going to require tough choices, and not just tough choices from Arab partners in the region, but really tough choices from Israel,” Miller said. “And so, the United States can’t make those tough choices for Israel. We can’t make those tough choices for any of these countries.”
Miller said the U.S. plans to play a leadership role in presenting its vision on the reconstruction of Gaza, and that Blinken will “continue to present” and “continue to press” in upcoming trips to the region in the next weeks and months.
State Department: Arab nations will partner with US on Gaza if Israel gets on board
Secretary of State Antony Blinken has returned from a seven-day trip in the Middle East, where he visited nine countries to discuss the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas and the conflicts that t…
thehill.com
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
This is probably simplistic, but Israel is getting much aid from us. Make it contingent.Just too much time with other stuff to keep track of Gaza. Maybe luck will smile on us yet.
State Department: Arab nations will partner with US on Gaza if Israel gets on board
Secretary of State Antony Blinken has returned from a seven-day trip in the Middle East, where he visited nine countries to discuss the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas and the conflicts that threaten a wider regional war.
According to his spokesperson, Matt Miller, the Arab nations are ready to partner with the U.S. on short-term and long-term solutions for Palestinians in Gaza, but only if Israel is willing to get on board.
“We’ve traveled through to nine countries and met with leaders in each of those, and was able to secure agreements with all of these Arab partners, as well as with Turkey, that they were ready to have those conversations, they were ready to coordinate with the United States and they were ready to take real steps to improve the lives of the Palestinian people in Gaza and to look at how to rebuild Gaza and establish Palestinian-led governance in Gaza,” Miller told MSNBC’s Andrea Mitchell on Friday.
“But they were only willing to do that if they had a partner on the other side in Israel and if Israel was ready to take real concrete steps to establish an independent Palestinian state,” Miller continued.
Blinken traveled to Turkey, Greece, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates (UAE), Saudi Arabia, Israel, Egypt and the West Bank to continue diplomatic discussions as tensions in the region have spiked surrounding the Israel-Hamas war.
The most recent trip was Blinken’s fourth visit to the region since Hamas invaded Israel on Oct. 7 in a surprise attack that killed 1,200 Israelis and took more than 200 hostages. In the months since, Israel has pursued a deadly and destructive counteroffensive that has killed more than 23,000 Palestinians and displaced nearly all of the region’s population.
Miller said during the most recent trip, there “really was a difference” because the Arab partners they spoke with after the initial attacks were not ready to discuss the reconstruction, security and governance in Gaza, but now they are.
Blinken reportedly had a “very candid conversation” with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and other Israeli government officials about the partners the country would gain in the Arab world if it were to agree on the future of Gaza.
“But look, it’s going to require tough choices, and not just tough choices from Arab partners in the region, but really tough choices from Israel,” Miller said. “And so, the United States can’t make those tough choices for Israel. We can’t make those tough choices for any of these countries.”
Miller said the U.S. plans to play a leadership role in presenting its vision on the reconstruction of Gaza, and that Blinken will “continue to present” and “continue to press” in upcoming trips to the region in the next weeks and months.
State Department: Arab nations will partner with US on Gaza if Israel gets on board
Secretary of State Antony Blinken has returned from a seven-day trip in the Middle East, where he visited nine countries to discuss the ongoing war between Israel and Hamas and the conflicts that t…
So, 2 wks. ago I threw out the ides that a humanitarian airdrop over Gaza by the US would have been a humane and well received gesture . Hamas is pretty pocketed and some food,winter jackets/blankets, and medical supplies wouldn't have threatened the Israeli beatdown. Now Israel is being accused of genocide in the Hague and the US has slapped the "Hooters" w/air strikes. Would the narrative have been different w/a simple humanitarian gesture?Would S.Africa have brought their case if Israel had accepted a US aid drop,consequently would the "Hooters" be burning American flags doing their "Allah Akbar","death to America" rants if we'd have made a effort to relieve the suffering in Gaza? I wonder,also the munitions spent would probably finance a second air drop money wise.
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
I doubt the airdrop would have been a well received gesture by anyone. A few MREs was not going to stop the attacks in the Red Sea, or the calls against America, without also calling for a humanitarian ceasefire, which the US can't do. It would piss of Israel's government and be used as propaganda by the few extremists to try and gain more political control. With the amount of death every day and all the statements made by people involved in control of how the war is being fought, it was being brought to the ICJ short of a ceasefire being agreed to. Best case scenario is it being brought to the ICJ causes those less extreme people controlling the military to think about speaking a little more responsibly and that the boots on the ground listen closely.
Some army officers are willing participants. In a video addressed to Gaza’s residents, one major general, Ghassan Alian, castigated “citizens of Gaza” for celebrating Hamas’s extremism, promising: “Human animals are dealt with accordingly. Israel has imposed a total blockade on Gaza, no electricity, no water, just damage. You wanted hell, you will get hell.” Another retired major general and adviser to the defence minister, Giora Eiland, demanded other countries be prevented from offering assistance, demanding that Gaza’s people be left with “two choices: to stay and to starve, or to leave”. He advocated Gaza being made “a place that is temporarily or permanently impossible to live in”, declared women were not innocent because “they are all the mothers, sisters or wives of Hamas murderers”, and advocated “humanitarian disaster” and “severe epidemics” to achieve war aims: the finance minister Bezalel Smotrich tweeted he agreed “with every word”.
The brutality and inhumanity of Israel’s assault on Gaza is no surprise. It’s just what was promised | Owen Jones
As the international court considers claims of genocide, the question of intent seems moot. Just read the words of Netanyahu and his allies, says Guardian columnist Owen Jones
www.theguardian.com
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
It’s a bitch to read about a people who were thus treated in living memory talking about human animals. In the immortal words of Siddhartha Gautama,I doubt the airdrop would have been a well received gesture by anyone. A few MREs was not going to stop the attacks in the Red Sea, or the calls against America, without also calling for a humanitarian ceasefire, which the US can't do. It would piss of Israel's government and be used as propaganda by the few extremists to try and gain more political control. With the amount of death every day and all the statements made by people involved in control of how the war is being fought, it was being brought to the ICJ short of a ceasefire being agreed to. Best case scenario is it being brought to the ICJ causes those less extreme people controlling the military to think about speaking a little more responsibly and that the boots on the ground listen closely.
Some army officers are willing participants. In a video addressed to Gaza’s residents, one major general, Ghassan Alian, castigated “citizens of Gaza” for celebrating Hamas’s extremism, promising: “Human animals are dealt with accordingly. Israel has imposed a total blockade on Gaza, no electricity, no water, just damage. You wanted hell, you will get hell.” Another retired major general and adviser to the defence minister, Giora Eiland, demanded other countries be prevented from offering assistance, demanding that Gaza’s people be left with “two choices: to stay and to starve, or to leave”. He advocated Gaza being made “a place that is temporarily or permanently impossible to live in”, declared women were not innocent because “they are all the mothers, sisters or wives of Hamas murderers”, and advocated “humanitarian disaster” and “severe epidemics” to achieve war aims: the finance minister Bezalel Smotrich tweeted he agreed “with every word”.
The brutality and inhumanity of Israel’s assault on Gaza is no surprise. It’s just what was promised | Owen Jones
As the international court considers claims of genocide, the question of intent seems moot. Just read the words of Netanyahu and his allies, says Guardian columnist Owen Jones
du’udes.
Sativied
Well-Known Member
Namibia condemns Germany for defending Israel in ICJ genocide case
Namibia says Germany has failed to ‘draw lessons from its horrific history’ by supporting Israel at the ICJ.
Over 1/4 in Gaza facing starvation,as this goes on Israel 's(Netanyahu gov.) prosecution of this is increasingly blunderous,I saw a stat. that they have dropped more 2000Lb. bombs than the US did in Iraq from 2003-to present, in a area that is miniscule in comparison.Biden is increasingly at odds w/Bibi on this and he refuses to see the light. It's time for Biden to lay a no BS gloves off ultimatum w/threats to halt US aid.The destruction in Gaza is not proportionate to the threat IMO how Israel's govt. can be this oblivious to the suffering is mind numbing.Israel is dicking around letting aid in and are inflicting serious damage to their reputation internationally.!00 days in a area this small w/the amount of heavy ordinance expended and only 1/3(Israeli estimate) of Hamas fighters KIA???? Hamas has no AA capacity and is in small pockets hunkering down, Biden should tell Netanyahu that the US will drop food and supplies in Gaza to forestall a impending humanitarian disaster and any Israeli gov. objections will be met with halting of US aid.By the KIA figures Israel has given that means it's 300 days(almost a yr.) for Israel to irradicate 25K Hamas fighters in a very small geographic area w/their modern highly esteemed IDF???With the situation in Europe starting to be neglected the fighting in Gaza needs to be approaching a end game soon.With Netanyahu facing trial and investigations he's seemingly in no hurry,it needs to be put to him to fast forward Israel's objectives or Biden needs to put a clock on him,Gaza is starting to wreek w/more than the smell of death.
Sativied
Well-Known Member
This might actually help:
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
It might but I don't think helping is his motivation.
He's in the position of watching two opponents fight a death match. Through his actions he showed us who he is before this and we should keep that in mind.
Last edited:
Sativied
Well-Known Member
I agree with the latter, but, that's just part of the lens I'm looking through and by itself doesn't define their policy towards Israel-Palestina. The benefits and interest Saudi Arabia has in buddying up with Israel is still there.
If you really want to be pessimistic. A condition from Saudi Arabia for the normalization with Israel is the transfer of nuclear technology from the US to them. For nuclear power supposedly. Given that they have plenty of solar capabilities and oil and gas, that is suspicious. A few months ago"MBS suggested in an interview with Fox News that his country “will have to get” a nuclear weapon should Iran develop its own."
So if Russia and US don't nuke us all to oblivion, Russia through Iran and/or US through Saudi Arabia will.
An obstacle for them is the right-wing government in Israel, which we can agree with. (recent poll shows far-right getting wiped out in Israel). If they make a Palestinian state a contingency, and do the same for Palestinians to denounce violence against Israel, we might actually end up with peace there. Thanks to Jared Kushner. (
)
If you really want to be pessimistic. A condition from Saudi Arabia for the normalization with Israel is the transfer of nuclear technology from the US to them. For nuclear power supposedly. Given that they have plenty of solar capabilities and oil and gas, that is suspicious. A few months ago"MBS suggested in an interview with Fox News that his country “will have to get” a nuclear weapon should Iran develop its own."
So if Russia and US don't nuke us all to oblivion, Russia through Iran and/or US through Saudi Arabia will.
An obstacle for them is the right-wing government in Israel, which we can agree with. (recent poll shows far-right getting wiped out in Israel). If they make a Palestinian state a contingency, and do the same for Palestinians to denounce violence against Israel, we might actually end up with peace there. Thanks to Jared Kushner. (
)
Sativied
Well-Known Member
"The survey also showed that Gantz, who temporarily joined Netanyahu’s coalition to have a seat at the table running the war, would lead the largest party in the Knesset, while the far-right Religious Zionism party of Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich, which ran on a joint slate with Otzma Yehudit in the last election, would fail to make it back into the Knesset."
Netanyahu has to go and sooner rather than later,he is a thorn in the side any chance for a lasting peace. Facing what he faces in the courts and responsibility for the Hamas Oct. 7th attack it is in his interest for a lasting war. He has damaged Israel's rep,possibly beyond repair w/ the brutality of this Gaza operation. Israel's war is w/25K Hamas fighters in a pop. of 2.2 Million people which is roughly 1.25% of the existing pop. So much of Gaza is reduced to rubble it looks like a total war making the "war is w/Hamas and not the Palestinians" complete BS. I'm willing to wager he wants to go "all in"w/Hezbollah and even Iran in order to stay in power. What I can't fathom is that Israel (the state) is the vindication and deliverance of a peoples subjected to repression,subjugation,racism,genocide,and endless wandering/yearning for a homeland for centuries and yet be completely obtuse to a peoples who are experiencing much the same at their hands. The birth of Israel was less than 80 yrs. ago how could empathy and compassion for their plight be erased from memory so soon. Mr. Netanyahu is surely learned enough to know that "Those who forget the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them"
s
s
It makes me terribly squirmy when Saudi Arabia and nuclear are used in the same sentence,that tech in a country that predominately contributed the 9/11 "ALLAH AKBAR" attackers is cause for serious worry. For all the $$ spent on hardware from the US their military is pretty poorly trained and inept( they couldn't subdue the rag tag Houthi's in 10 yrs of war)so I wonder if their security services would demonstrate the same ineptitude w/nuclear tech.?????I agree with the latter, but, that's just part of the lens I'm looking through and by itself doesn't define their policy towards Israel-Palestina. The benefits and interest Saudi Arabia has in buddying up with Israel is still there.
If you really want to be pessimistic. A condition from Saudi Arabia for the normalization with Israel is the transfer of nuclear technology from the US to them. For nuclear power supposedly. Given that they have plenty of solar capabilities and oil and gas, that is suspicious. A few months ago"MBS suggested in an interview with Fox News that his country “will have to get” a nuclear weapon should Iran develop its own."
So if Russia and US don't nuke us all to oblivion, Russia through Iran and/or US through Saudi Arabia will.
An obstacle for them is the right-wing government in Israel, which we can agree with. (recent poll shows far-right getting wiped out in Israel). If they make a Palestinian state a contingency, and do the same for Palestinians to denounce violence against Israel, we might actually end up with peace there. Thanks to Jared Kushner. (