Help with nice/cheap LED? *CRAZY PLUG*

[shotnva777]

Scroll to bottom paragraph for the question! Lol

So I purchased these on sale from a guy on Amazon. It's made by a company called Carambola and the model is a "White Rose 2400" or something - it claimed 4000w on the ad, but its not lol. It's basically two 12"x12" aluminum panels, with lots of good quality Samsung LEDs, IRs, etc. mounted underneath (Refer to pictures - im VERRRRY new at this LED thing). Anyhow, they both have their seperate drivers/ballast mounted on top. Both are powered separately with a single split 110v power plug. The two panels are held together using 2 small reflectors on the side, as a makeshift hood. The design is nice though and for the price, I couldn't pass it up... BUT, I knew it would need some upgrading. I've built all of my old HID lights and I'm familiar with electronics, so it was nothing I didn't think I couldnt handle.

For starters, I knew this would need some upgrading for cooling. With 550+ LEDS, I knew the 1/8" piece of aluminum wasn't a good enough "heatsink", as the seller claimed. I did some test in my new 4x2x5ft tent and confirmed that this thing is BRIGHT AS HELL and puts off mega heat. I probably could've cooked an egg on the aluminum backing, after an hour of being on! So I've taken off the drivers and I'm in the process of applying actual heatsink across the entire top of the aluminum with thermal conductive paste. I also ordered two 4x4" cpu cooling fans, on top of 1" heatsink, to mount in the dead center of both lights. I went a step further and even bought small 2" fans on top of heatsink, to put ontop of the ballast. The ballest are being moved outwards, as well as raised, to make room for the fans that will halfway take their place. The fans have their own 12v power source and will just be on the timer with the LEDS.

My problem now lies in the dimmer function. The kit originally came with a "master controller" that had a dimmer and the veg/bloom booster switch on it. While this one I have still has the bloom booster switch on top of the ballast housing, no dimmer/master controller came with it (seller gave a partial refund, but zero reason as to why it didnt and no advice on how to get one). Funny part, is that it still came with the daisy chain to connect to the ballast and controller that doesn't exist. And that's where I'm at....

I can't find a controller that uses this type of plug ANYWHERE. I can find extension cords and plugs of the same 3 pin type, but no dimmer or even a name of the type of plug. I figure it's just like any other ordinary potentiometer and just needs a 1-10v connection as the dimmee? The problem is I've only ever hooked pots up with 2 wires for a dimmer. You know? So you can just control the 1-10v to dim the light. These plugs obviously have 3 wires inside (I cut to verify) and its a red, black and yellow. So most pots have 3 pins, can I just connect these 3 wires to a pot's 3 connections and be good to go? Can't be that easy..... I don't have that type of luck!

**UPDATE: After measuring the black and red wire coming off the daisy chain, with both ballast connected, the readout was bouncing around from 10-12v. It was constantly fluctuating. Would that be the two wires to hook to a potentiometer?**

Or what do I do here to just have a simple dimmer? The daisy chain uses 2 male connectors to both drivers, which then goes to a male and another female right next to it? I think this was supposed to be for the other model they offer, which is just another one of these panels added. I could just leave the other female disconnected regardless. But please, help me and refer to the photos!

 

[shotnva777]

I'm completely confused now. The master controller was supposed to get 110v too?? What in the world! I give up...

 

[sfw1960]

A penny saved is a dollar BURNED?

If you could include some links and other information rather than just the pics maybe we can figure something out.
No idea what kinda drivers those are and that's going to be a good start....

 

[Everytimefoo]

Simple solution… return these and save up for something nice, or get two inline fans.

 

[shotnva777]

A penny saved is a dollar BURNED?

If you could include some links and other information rather than just the pics maybe we can figure something out.
No idea what kinda drivers those are and that's going to be a good start....

Indeed! e

But yea, the only info I have on them is what you see. That's why I took a photo of the top of one. I'm not sweating the dimming function too much honestly, was more of just wondering. It seems that there are 2 ways to run this driver, one is the way it is now, plugged directly into the wall. Or it was daisy chained through the cord I have, in which the controller itself offered the power and the dimming/flower bloom. Didn't know if there was a way to just tap in and dim it, but not necessary. It just needed some good heat sink and a cpl fans. Dollar EARNED in my book!

Simple solution… return these and save up for something nice, or get two inline fans.

Nah. They're nice lights, just cheaply thrown together to make a quick buck. Putting the heatsink on alone has done wonders. I've added heatsink fans to the tops of the drivers and I'm waiting on 2 more 4" heatsink fans for it as well. Everything seems well built and of good quality, they just put zero money into heat dissipation! Ha

 

[sfw1960]

I've always said if it doesn't perform the job with acceptable results, no good.
The chinese imitation hasn't earned my dollar but I just got four HLG boards with heatsinks for UNDER $37 each I've got a few spare MW 240 watt drivers onhand and would have recommended those over the goose chase but that's just me.
I can't make out the info on top of the driver where specifications are generally listed.
IDK what current or voltage specs are from any pictures.
Probably 48v as most chiminilly klonez are.
Can you take a shot of the driver?
Front of boards silkscreen unlit might help too.
I hope it's worth the frustration for you!
GL

 

[Everytimefoo]

Indeed! e

But yea, the only info I have on them is what you see. That's why I took a photo of the top of one. I'm not sweating the dimming function too much honestly, was more of just wondering. It seems that there are 2 ways to run this driver, one is the way it is now, plugged directly into the wall. Or it was daisy chained through the cord I have, in which the controller itself offered the power and the dimming/flower bloom. Didn't know if there was a way to just tap in and dim it, but not necessary. It just needed some good heat sink and a cpl fans. Dollar EARNED in my book!



Nah. They're nice lights, just cheaply thrown together to make a quick buck. Putting the heatsink on alone has done wonders. I've added heatsink fans to the tops of the drivers and I'm waiting on 2 more 4" heatsink fans for it as well. Everything seems well built and of good quality, they just put zero money into heat dissipation! Ha

My time is worth too much for all that but smoke em if you got em.

 

[sfw1960]

My time is worth too much for all that but smoke em if you got em.

Agreed, I can get a free bushel of frustration almost anywhere for free - I'm not going to pay for it at ANY price....

 

[shotnva777]

It's truly not frustrating fellas lol. Everything has gone smooth as butter and seems to work great, it was just the heat dissipation.

I spent $30 on the light fixture shipped to my door (originally $199) - guessing they had a lot of failed units due to heat.

I spent a good $40 on Amazon for fans/heatsink and she's good to go. I'll take a 200w full spectrum for $70 and a cpl hours of my time. I enjoy doing things like this... hell I was initially thinking of building my own until I found this. This is basically what I had planned to build anyhow

 

[shotnva777]

I'll post a photo of the after, once all the parts come in and everything is put together. It's in pieces atm. Lol.

This is my first LED grow. I'm used to using HIDS. MH for veg and adding HPS during flower. I've built a few small, 70w cooltubes. But I was just using a massive 600w unit, thay this LED shits on and the size difference is insane haha

 

[Jjgrow420]

Sounds like bottom bin components, and cheap drivers.
Like stated above, I'd rather not pay for frustration.
I've seen horror stories from burnt boards, Burned out driver's, burnt out LEDs, fires etc. To me, it's not worth saving a few bucks and Jimmy rigging in dimmers and such. They're cheap for a reason..... might work ok for you might not... Craps shoot and you just put all your $ on 7.

 

[Everytimefoo]

It's truly not frustrating fellas lol. Everything has gone smooth as butter and seems to work great, it was just the heat dissipation.

I spent $30 on the light fixture shipped to my door (originally $199) - guessing they had a lot of failed units due to heat.

I spent a good $40 on Amazon for fans/heatsink and she's good to go. I'll take a 200w full spectrum for $70 and a cpl hours of my time. I enjoy doing things like this... hell I was initially thinking of building my own until I found this. This is basically what I had planned to build anyhow

Yeah im not a big fan if guessing and hoping. Ill keep my cmh and two inline fans that i bought and plugged in and worked. I live by the rule of theres always a high price to be paid for being too cheap. I love tinkering and working with my hands as well but not on something that should work right out if the box. I built that pc in the background, and customized my grow setup with my hands i do all my own automotive work, built that pvc stand you see in the picture to support the top flood tray etc so i definitely get it.

 

[shotnva777]

Sounds like bottom bin components, and cheap drivers.
Like stated above, I'd rather not pay for frustration.
I've seen horror stories from burnt boards, Burned out driver's, burnt out LEDs, fires etc. To me, it's not worth saving a few bucks and Jimmy rigging in dimmers and such. They're cheap for a reason..... might work ok for you might not... Craps shoot and you just put all your $ on 7.

I understand pal, I'm working on a budget and really do enjoy building things. I know the LEDS are of good quality, i know the light is good now as far as heat, and I knew the drivers were cheap Chinese knockoffs - just by looking at them! Ha... I'll run them until they fail... or don't. I'm home almost 24/7 (I work from home), so they'll always have a watchful eye. I have a 6" inline duct fan coming in and a 6" inline duct fan going out, with a charcoal filter (that I also built lol). I wasn't asking to Jimmy rig a dimmer, I was asking if anyone knew where to get the master controller I posted a picture of or if anyone knew how to wire one to the 3 pin plug that is there. Honestly dimming wasn't really a need for me anyhow, it was really just a thought. Thanks tho.

Yeah im not a big fan if guessing and hoping. Ill keep my cmh and two inline fans that i bought and plugged in and worked. I live by the rule of theres always a high price to be paid for being too cheap. I love tinkering and working with my hands as well but not on something that should work right out if the box. I built that pc in the background, and customized my grow setup with my hands i do all my own automotive work, built that pvc stand you see in the picture to support the top flood tray etc so i definitely get it.

Well then you get it....!

There's not always a high price to pay for "going cheap", as long as you upgrade the cheap part of the system. IMHO. I think their intentions were good with this unit, but I sincerely believe that they shorted themselves on the cooling, which probably caused a lot of failures and an upgraded system. Period. It's so obvious it's crazy lol - atleast to me. Their newer units are basically the same, except with better cooling options (heatsink and raised drivers)

Again, I'll post up when I finish with the cooling upgrade, later this week. Fans will be here thursday. Here's where I'm at now and my plans.... (and also a photo of the fans/heatsink I purchased that claims they're good to 100w a piece)

 

[shotnva777]

Yeah im not a big fan if guessing and hoping. Ill keep my cmh and two inline fans that i bought and plugged in and worked. I live by the rule of theres always a high price to be paid for being too cheap. I love tinkering and working with my hands as well but not on something that should work right out if the box. I built that pc in the background, and customized my grow setup with my hands i do all my own automotive work, built that pvc stand you see in the picture to support the top flood tray etc so i definitely get it.

Oh and did you say you're using a MH? I have a 600w unit and 2 different ballast I'm trying to sell, I have like 6 bulbs to go with it too, ranging from 250w to 600w. Hell, I'll throw in the highbay fixtures I have too lol...

 

[Everytimefoo]

I understand pal, I'm working on a budget and really do enjoy building things. I know the LEDS are of good quality, i know the light is good now as far as heat, and I knew the drivers were cheap Chinese knockoffs - just by looking at them! Ha... I'll run them until they fail... or don't. I'm home almost 24/7 (I work from home), so they'll always have a watchful eye. I have a 6" inline duct fan coming in and a 6" inline duct fan going out, with a charcoal filter (that I also built lol). I wasn't asking to Jimmy rig a dimmer, I was asking if anyone knew where to get the master controller I posted a picture of or if anyone knew how to wire one to the 3 pin plug that is there. Honestly dimming wasn't really a need for me anyhow, it was really just a thought. Thanks tho.



Well then you get it....!

There's not always a high price to pay for "going cheap", as long as you upgrade the cheap part of the system. IMHO. I think their intentions were good with this unit, but I sincerely believe that they shorted themselves on the cooling, which probably caused a lot of failures and an upgraded system. Period. It's so obvious it's crazy lol - atleast to me. Their newer units are basically the same, except with better cooling options (heatsink and raised drivers)

Again, I'll post up when I finish with the cooling upgrade, later this week. Fans will be here thursday. Here's where I'm at now and my plans.... (and also a photo of the fans/heatsink I purchased that claims they're good to 100w a piece)

Looks like a fire hazard. Tbh

 

[Fangthane]

CMH = Ceramic Metal Halide.

 

[shotnva777]

CMH = Ceramic Metal Halide.

Oh gotcha. I'll have to look into that, never heard of it. I've use MH and HPS, CFL'S, T5's, you name it. But not that! Ha!

 

[sfw1960]

IDK how you can say the LEDs are of good quality when I have an idea of the typical chinese amz light, which I've ran dozens and repaired probably 75%+ of them and sold them before taking a total bath on the cost.
99% say they're top bin LM301B/H and they're NOT.
You can't trust a single thing to be "genuine" or "real"...
I'm not that brand loyal but I know what is of good, better or poor quality and there's not that many "good ones" being sold dirt cheap and being passed off as a silk purse . Seems those who haven't tried a bunch of stuff don't have much to benchmark it against, so naturally better results than a previous thing should be "good".

Congrats on getting it working and I hope you don't lose a crop after putting much time and effort into it to have a failed component take out your finish line stretch, because it can happen to anyone.
$70 for a 200 w light is good but only if you get at least that amount in service life - if it pukes in 45 days it just wasn't worth the time, hassle and money so I will avoid those situations.
I won't use cheap or off brand drivers because they DON'T last and it's not like you can just wait for a seller to send a replacement from china if the "store" or sellers not left with your money and started another Kool aid stand on the next corner.

In comparison, I'd rather have a pair of the new QB272's (544 LEDs @ 250 w) for less than $80 and if you find real Ming Wei 240/320/480w drivers for under $80 a poke I'd like some more please!

No fans needed or required for these.

Otherwise for me, I will be using the existing HLG 240H-54A drivers I already own while a few years warranty still remains of the original seven. Don't need new frames because I'll be adding them to the ones hanging.
I love to DIY but I also do make stuff longer lasting, safer & better than the questionable sea of other things being passed around like the hot potatoes they are!
Hope yours lasts for years to come...

 

[shotnva777]

IDK how you can say the LEDs are of good quality when I have an idea of the typical chinese amz light, which I've ran dozens and repaired probably 75%+ of them and sold them before taking a total bath on the cost.
99% say they're top bin LM301B/H and they're NOT.
You can't trust a single thing to be "genuine" or "real"...
I'm not that brand loyal but I know what is of good, better or poor quality and there's not that many "good ones" being sold dirt cheap and being passed off as a silk purse . Seems those who haven't tried a bunch of stuff don't have much to benchmark it against, so naturally better results than a previous thing should be "good".

Congrats on getting it working and I hope you don't lose a crop after putting much time and effort into it to have a failed component take out your finish line stretch, because it can happen to anyone.
$70 for a 200 w light is good but only if you get at least that amount in service life - if it pukes in 45 days it just wasn't worth the time, hassle and money so I will avoid those situations.
I won't use cheap or off brand drivers because they DON'T last and it's not like you can just wait for a seller to send a replacement from china if the "store" or sellers not left with your money and started another Kool aid stand on the next corner.

In comparison, I'd rather have a pair of the new QB272's (544 LEDs @ 250 w) for less than $80 and if you find real Ming Wei 240/320/480w drivers for under $80 a poke I'd like some more please!

No fans needed or required for these.

Otherwise for me, I will be using the existing HLG 240H-54A drivers I already own while a few years warranty still remains of the original seven. Don't need new frames because I'll be adding them to the ones hanging.
I love to DIY but I also do make stuff longer lasting, safer & better than the questionable sea of other things being passed around like the hot potatoes they are!
Hope yours lasts for years to come...


View attachment 5340414

I agree for the most part and you're right, a lot of it is snake oil. But, as someone who goes cheap on everything, I kinda know what to watch oit for. They're Samsung LEDS, atleast seem to be. If the power supply fails, I'll grab another and mount them outside the tent. If it ALL fails, I have a 600w MH/HPS that I can use, until a replacement LED comes. ALWAYS a backup! Lol. But hopefully I'll have some luck with it and get a a couple good grows out of it. Hell, one and it's paid for itself...

That said. I plan. To build my next one, maybe even using this same hood/board

 

[Rocket Soul]

I agree for the most part and you're right, a lot of it is snake oil. But, as someone who goes cheap on everything, I kinda know what to watch oit for. They're Samsung LEDS, atleast seem to be. If the power supply fails, I'll grab another and mount them outside the tent. If it ALL fails, I have a 600w MH/HPS that I can use, until a replacement LED comes. ALWAYS a backup! Lol. But hopefully I'll have some luck with it and get a a couple good grows out of it. Hell, one and it's paid for itself...

That said. I plan. To build my next one, maybe even using this same hood/board

More or less agree with both of you: you can make really good gains in bang for buck by sourcing some cheap parts in china but you shouldnt think they have the same performance as original diodes, no matter what brand name attached to it. A good idea is to try to work out power per diode and diodes per dollar. If you can get some thing cheap and run it at less than .2w per diode your usually in the clear as long as you have some kinda of heapsinking, usually a backing alu sheet is enough.
For op: another important thing to look out for in these cheapo lights are those quick connectors. If they dont make perfect contact theres sometimes a bit of arching electricity which can cause them to melt and possible fire risk. Seen it on a few mid range lights here over the years, not sure if it was Mars or spiderfarmer.
Wagos, quick connectors and drivers: i source it from any local place. Boards and strips: if i can get a decent deal on alibaba i go for that generally. The HLG r-spec deal on recently is really good especially if youre US based. But for me it works out better to buy china and get a spare or two and see the boards and strips as somewhat perishable.
If you want tweaked spectrum it may be better to go with something more reputable.