Wattzzup
Well-Known Member
Is that all that’s important to you is $2 gas? Gas went up to pay for your 18 billion dollar wallYou mean like when gas was $2.00 a gallon. Ya what a nightmare,
OK then. Biden 2020.
- Thread starter abandonconflict
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EmeraldØsiris
Well-Known Member
I hear what you are saying but that is not entirely nor 3xceptionally true, as many Canadians come to the US to get the healthcare treatment they are rejected for in Canada for whatever reason.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Yes it's true. Some Canadians traveled to the US to get a medical treatment.
Do you know how many traveled for a medical treatment? 63,000 traveled abroad for a medical treatment. Abroad. How many traveled abroad for illegal or procedures considered frivolous and therefore not covered? IDK but you don't either. That's 63,000 people, an unknown number traveling for frivolous procedures traveled abroad, not just the US but abroad. 63,000 out of 38,000,000 people traveled abroad. Meanwhile more than 70% of adults in Canada are proud of their health care system.
I'm sorry if this post seems like it's mocking you. It's just that if your post was intended to say that Canada has shit medical system it should make people who know the facts laugh.
Offmymeds
Well-Known Member
I will travel abroad to get dental implants for 1/4 quarter of what I would pay here. I could take a month-long vacation in Colombia and still save tens of thousands.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Right. Canada's health care system doesn't cover dental work. You'll be one of 63,000 people that Emerald was trying to use to imply Canada's system is shit. Of course, you are travelling for a procedure that is not offered and so his statement doesn't apply to you but he was lumping you into his number without regard to reasons.
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Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I've been eating a lot of beans lately.
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
No pun intended
President Trump has the Worst Economic Record in Recorded History
Trump likes to boast about how well the economy was doing before the pandemic hit. Yet the reality is that real wages were stagnant for…capaction.medium.com
Joe inherited this shit storm. Glad to have him doing such a great job getting this country back on track.
Wattzzup
Well-Known Member
That’s Joe’s fault too
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
Well, one of the railway unions did state this on November 29th:That’s Joe’s fault too
Biden’s statement, issued Monday, said he was “reluctant to override the ratification procedures” and shared workers concerns about sick leave, but that “a rail shutdown would devastate our economy” [see “Biden calls on Congress …,” Trains News Wire, Nov. 28, 2022]
But the BMWED statement said the decision “ignores” those concerns and said the sick-time issue is a safety issue: “The railroad is not a place to work while you’re sick. It’s dangerous. It requires full concentration, situational awareness, and decision-making. Because carrier management decided to egregiously reduce workforce, it’s more dangerous than ever, and the onus of that rests with them.”
Union: Biden decision ‘does not address rail industry disease’ - Trains
NOVI, Mich. — One of the four unions to vote down a tentative agreement with railroads is decrying President Joe Biden’s decision calling on Congress to impose that agreement and prevent a rail strike, continuing its call for paid sick leave while saying the move will not address rail service...
www.trains.com
He is in charge and he ignored the warnings, so..... what usually happens?
Really it was just a play on your choice of words after all the debate about the rail issues and thought you'd enjoy a chuckle, my bad.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Do you know how much sick leave employees may take and what the procedure is for a railway worker to take it?Well, one of the railway unions did state this on November 29th:
Biden’s statement, issued Monday, said he was “reluctant to override the ratification procedures” and shared workers concerns about sick leave, but that “a rail shutdown would devastate our economy” [see “Biden calls on Congress …,” Trains News Wire, Nov. 28, 2022]
But the BMWED statement said the decision “ignores” those concerns and said the sick-time issue is a safety issue: “The railroad is not a place to work while you’re sick. It’s dangerous. It requires full concentration, situational awareness, and decision-making. Because carrier management decided to egregiously reduce workforce, it’s more dangerous than ever, and the onus of that rests with them.”
Union: Biden decision ‘does not address rail industry disease’ - Trains
NOVI, Mich. — One of the four unions to vote down a tentative agreement with railroads is decrying President Joe Biden’s decision calling on Congress to impose that agreement and prevent a rail strike, continuing its call for paid sick leave while saying the move will not address rail service...
He is in charge and he ignored the warnings, so..... what usually happens?
Really it was just a play on your choice of words after all the debate about the rail issues and thought you'd enjoy a chuckle, my bad.
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
Did you read any of the links that I posted where they(railway employees) discussed their issues? It's all there.
Read this
28 Freight Rail Workers Tell Us What They Want You to Know About Their Lives
In threatening to disrupt the nation’s economy, freight rail workers are seeking basic dignities every other worker takes for granted.
www.vice.com
I honestly had no idea how fucked that industry is, couldn't pay me enough to have to live that way.
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cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
Can you please quote the portion that specifies the sick leave policy? All I saw was a morass of anecdote with numbers that don’t align.Did you read any of the links that I posted where they(railway employees) discussed their issues? It's all there.
Read this
28 Freight Rail Workers Tell Us What They Want You to Know About Their Lives
In threatening to disrupt the nation’s economy, freight rail workers are seeking basic dignities every other worker takes for granted.
I honestly had no idea how fucked that industry is, couldn't pay me enough to have to live that way.
doublejj
Well-Known Member
GOP Operative Sentenced to 18 Months for Funneling Russian Money to Trump Campaign
www.motherjones.com
GOP operative sentenced to 18 months for funneling Russian money to Trump
Judge finds a "pattern of deception" by a longtime Republican consultant.
www.motherjones.com
PadawanWarrior
Well-Known Member
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
I can't, but you can see a direct correlation between the reduced number of rail employees compared to the amount of freight being moved that supports what they are saying. I will have to find the analysis that was done by the government and post. If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, eats and flies and shits like one, do you really need DNA confirmation before you believe it's a duck?
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
I do need to point out that you said it’s all there. My own searches have not turned the info up. Considering the thousands of journalist-hours the topic has soaked up, the absence of a summary in concise, perhaps tabular format stands out.
On duckness, DNA is probably unnecessary (and a bit of a loaded question), but a photo with a scale object would be of value.
CANON_Grow
Well-Known Member
Fair point, should have chosen my words more carefully. The are a few big problems getting the exact details, biggest being it is 12 different unions that each have a different agreement(and likely a different policy), and it is not the usual working arrangement that most are familiar with.
So reading what some of those employee's stated, and reading this government publication that shows this chart:
Employment in rail transportation heads downhill between November 2018 and December 2020 : Monthly Labor Review: U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
This article provides an analysis of the recent employment declines in the rail transportation industry.
www.bls.gov
And discussing the strange policy here, where it was brought before a judge last year:
Under the new policy, engineers and conductors begin with 30 points, and then points are deducted from that for absences, with the deductions ranging from two points to 25 points. A worker can earn four points back by being available to work for 14 days in a row including weekends. An employee would be disciplined when their points are exhausted.
Judge says BNSF unions can't strike over new attendance rule
BNSF railroad's two biggest unions that represent 17,000 workers won't be able to go on strike over a new attendance policy they say would penalize employees for missing work for any reason. A federal judge ruled Tuesday that a strike would likely violate federal law because under their...
apnews.com
As well as reading this piece:
Issues with scheduling and time off have increasingly become top negotiating concerns coming out of the pandemic, but rarely are the issues as glaring as they are on the railroads. Virginia Commonwealth University professor Victor Chen said the railroads’ intense focus on a lean operating model that relies on fewer, longer trains with fewer locomotives and employees has “made formerly good jobs atrociously bad.”
“Over the years, they’ve laid off workers in droves while expecting those who remain to do much more,” said Chen, a sociologist who studies labor issues. “They’ve imposed schedules that are wildly unpredictable because it means they can squeeze more out of each worker. They’ve put in place insane attendance policies that would never fly in white-collar workplaces.”
Why many railroad workers still won't approve a new contract: 'Eventually there won’t be anybody to fix those choo-choos'
Rail employees can take any day off they want now. They just won't get paid for it.
And many other pieces written about it lead me to believe it's a legitimate cause for concern that they have.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Yes, I did, it didn't answer my question. I'm not really interested in hearing individual complaints. Although I'm not dismissing them, I'm just not all that sensitive to what people say who make a lot of money, don't have to worry about getting laid off at any moment, have sick pay, have vacation, have a strong union at their back. Most in this country don't have that. I wanted to know what their union had agreed to. In this situation, it's the contract that drives everything, not personal stories. They should tell their story to the janitors in LA and see how it is received.Did you read any of the links that I posted where they(railway employees) discussed their issues? It's all there.
Read this
28 Freight Rail Workers Tell Us What They Want You to Know About Their Lives
In threatening to disrupt the nation’s economy, freight rail workers are seeking basic dignities every other worker takes for granted.
I honestly had no idea how fucked that industry is, couldn't pay me enough to have to live that way.
That said, I'm not pro-railroad company either. I found this as the most recent policy that was posted online dated May 31, 2022 It is the policy that according to the source has either been revoked or is still in place.
.
It sucks. No question. It sucks and is at least 50 years behind the times in terms of providing employees work-life balance. If this is what is in place, it's a disgrace. I think it is, too.
According to the unions:
Unions complained that to manage a shortfall of employees, the carriers effectively forced their members to remain on call for days and sometimes weeks at a time, partly through the use of strict attendance policies that could lead to disciplinary action or even firing. They said the policies pushed workers to the limits of their physical and mental health.
Workers Say Railroads’ Efficiency Push Became Too Much (NY Times paywall)
According to the rail industry's National Railway Labor Conference
BARGAINING STATUS FAQ – DECEMBER 2022
Rail employees receive up to five weeks of vacation in addition to up to 14 paid holidays and/or paid leave days (all depending on craft and seniority). They also participate in a carrier-funded federal sickness benefit program, and many have access to other benefits under existing labor agreements.
Operating craft employees also can “mark off” – or temporarily remove themselves from service – for any reason, as long as they maintain a reasonable level of overall availability under carrier attendance policies.
The new agreements with the operating craft unions also include provisions regarding time away from work for routine and preventive medical care and provide that absences related to hospitalizations and surgeries are not counted toward normal attendance handling.
There is a new tentative agreement that may or may not supersede the anachronistic Hi-Viz attendance policy of May 31 but I can't access it because I'm not a member of the union. The bargaining status faq says all sorts of rosy things about the new agreement. BUT it all depends on what the attendance policy is. If it's the one that was struck in May, then the RR workers have a valid complaint.
To me, the main sticking point that did not change is unions say the RR companies are maintaining a skeleton crew. Hence the shitty and harsh attendance policies. Hence the tired workers, hence the safety concerns, hence the need for Congress to continue to work to resolve this issue.
So, yeah, this sucks, is a stain on the Biden administration and all the highfallutin words he said was just fluff.