Nutrients. Is it all snake oil???

speedwell68

speedwell68

Well-Known Member
I live in the UK and due to Covid, Brexit and the fact I live somewhere remote, my usual grow mix was unavailable. So I had to improvise so I got some peat free tomato grow bags (according to the label it is a mix of composted wood and green waste) and some composted farm manure. I mixed the two 50/50 and added some perlite. I usually use Plant Magic Oldtimers trio (grow, bloom and PK4/8 to which I will add a weekly dose of Epsom Salts. I was running low on old timers and the local grow shop was out of stock, covid was blamed. So I figured that my grows would be just fine in the compost and manure mix for a few weeks. I had 6 Autos in a poly tunnel in the garden and I had 12 photos in indoor tents.

As I thought both sets of plants were fine with just water and a weekly dose of Epsom Salt. I still couldn't get any Old Timers and thought fuck it and used tomato feed. The Autos were fed Tomorite (NPK 4-3- 8 weekly and the indoor plants were fed Gro-Sure Tomato Food (NPK 6-3-10), watering every other day. I started them off a 50% strength and worked my way up to full strength when they started flowering. I was giving them a Epsom Salt once a week too. I started to decrease the strength again at week 7.

All through the grows I had no signs of deficiency at all. No nute burn either. The yield was spot on and the weed is lovely, some of the nicest I have ever smoked.

I am just starting some seeds off for my next run and have kept the same soil mix and I am going to use the Tomato feed again. If it works again, and I don't see why it won't, I am going to stick with it. The more I read about the subject of nutrients and cannabis the more I believe most of the nutrient lines are mostly snake oil.
 
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Lordhooha

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
speedwell68 said:
I live in the UK and due to Covid, Brexit and the fact I live somewhere remote, my usual grow mix was unavailable. So I had to improvise so I got some peat free tomato grow bags (according to the label it is a mix of composted wood and green waste) and some composted farm manure. I mixed the two 50/50 and added some perlite. I usually use Plant Magic Oldtimers trio (grow, bloom and PK4/8 to which I will add a weekly dose of Epsom Salts. I was running low on old timers and the local grow shop was out of stock, covid was blamed. So I figured that my grows would be just fine in the compost and manure mix for a few weeks. I had 6 Autos in a poly tunnel in the garden and I had 12 photos in indoor tents.

As I thought both sets of plants were fine with just water and a weekly dose of Epsom Salt. I still couldn't get any Old Timers and thought fuck it and used tomato feed. The Autos were fed Tomorite (NPK 4-3- 8 weekly and the indoor plants were fed Gro-Sure Tomato Food (NPK 6-3-10), watering every other day. I started them off a 50% strength and worked my way up to full strength when they started flowering. I was giving them a Epsom Salt once a week too. I started to decrease the strength again at week 7.

All through the grows I had no signs of deficiency at all. No nute burn either. The yield was spot on and the weed is lovely, some of the nicest I have ever smoked.

I am just starting some seeds off for my next run and have kept the same soil mix and I am going to use the Tomato feed again. If it works again, and I don't see why it won't, I am going to stick with it. The more I read about the subject of nutrients and cannabis the more I believe most of the nutrient lines are mostly snake oil.
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You just ran a high carbon soil mix. these plants are only magic when smoked not growing. Basically fully organic.
 
icetech

icetech

Well-Known Member
Yes... sooo much stuff is just labeled that it's for weed then the price jacked up to 5-10x what it should be (Like Hydroguard... Souther AG works as good/better and costs next to nothing) Plants don't give a shit if you buy expensive or cheap nutes, only that they get what they need.. sounds like you nailed it:)
 
speedwell68

speedwell68

Well-Known Member
icetech said:
Yes... sooo much stuff is just labeled that it's for weed then the price jacked up to 5-10x what it should be (Like Hydroguard... Souther AG works as good/better and costs next to nothing) Plants don't give a shit if you buy expensive or cheap nutes, only that they get what they need.. sounds like you nailed it:)
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I was spending £45 per grow in nutes and soil, now I a spending half that for 3 grows.
 
Three Berries

Three Berries

Well-Known Member
Growing in soil I also have a box of special amendments for pH control and deficiencies issues if they arise. Potassium carbonate, Epsom salt, Calcium carbonate (white chalk), Mosquito Bits, super phosphate, and some clear ammonia. I use the potassium carbonate for pH control with the flower and ammonia for pH control of the veg.

I use to use epsom salt a lot but my well water is high in magnesium carbonate. So maybe at the beginning of veg and again when going to flower. I normally use rainwater with cup per gallon of well water blended in for the watering. Rain water is around 6.5 and the well water is around 7.5. I should see what a half and half mix does.
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
I found out the same thing years ago when I got caught up in the cannabis specific nutrient nonsense. It only took me a couple of grows to realize I was getting ripped off. Having been gardening and growing plants all my life I came to the conclusion that I didn't need what the industry was pushing. I got some cheap dry nutes and started having the best grows of my life. I haven't looked back.

Cannabis doesn't care if the calcium comes in a fancy quart bottle for $25 that will last a couple of grows or a 50 lb bag of calcium nitrate for $20 that will last years.

Tomatoes are harder to grow than cannabis yet all you need is an inexpensive fertilizer to get great results. Cannabis doesn't have special unique nutrition requirements. It just needs the same nutrients that 90% of all plants on earth need.
 
Three Berries

Three Berries

Well-Known Member
Here's a good discussion of Tomorite and miracle grow with others being mentioned.

miracle gro and tomorite

I've used miracle gro for my veg period and am using tomorite for flower, has anyone got any experience with these? any help on dosage and frequency would be great
www.thctalk.com
 
jondamon

jondamon

Well-Known Member
MickFoster said:
I use GH MaxiBloom.........$18 per grow.
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My A/B costs me around £14 for 1litre of each A and B which usually does me 1 grow.

i also add beeswax triacantonol, MKP, Epsom Salts during the grow with the A/B.

For those using TAMORITE or any other “cheaper” feeds whats the concentration like?

for example if you add 2ml per litre of water whats the EC?
 
Severed Tongue

Severed Tongue

Well-Known Member
Here's what I've observed.
And, this isn't just "cannabis nutrients."

It's called being 'Elitist' and thanks to the information age, it is now a problem in every faucet of our lives.

Being Elitist means you must have the newest, most expensive, flashiest, loudest, biggest everything to even be considered worthy.

I got trashed on when I joined last year and have no problem stating I use Miracle-Gro soil and nutrients (the cheap ones, not organic) for example. Any time I had the slightest of issue come up, immediately anyone judging pointed to this being the reason.

It's laughable at best.

I've taken 3 courses now, and have actual certification in basic horticulture. With this education, and as a hobbyist just growing for myself at home, I will continue using Miracle-Gro.
 
jondamon

jondamon

Well-Known Member
speedwell68 said:
I have no idea.
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Would be nice to know.

just thinking about the strength of the liquid is all.

if 4ml per litre equates to around 1.0EC then its on par with most A/B 2ml of A and B (total 4ml) is approx 1.0EC.

what would worry me for a hydro application is the fact that many of the nutrients aren’t listed on the bottles and generally only show you NPK on the lists as anything less than 1% isn’t required to be listed.
 
speedwell68

speedwell68

Well-Known Member
Severed Tongue said:
Here's what I've observed.
And, this isn't just "cannabis nutrients."

It's called being 'Elitist' and thanks to the information age, it is now a problem in every faucet of our lives.

Being Elitist means you must have the newest, most expensive, flashiest, loudest, biggest everything to even be considered worthy.

I got trashed on when I joined last year and have no problem stating I use Miracle-Gro soil and nutrients (the cheap ones, not organic) for example. Any time I had the slightest of issue come up, immediately anyone judging pointed to this being the reason.

It's laughable at best.

I've taken 3 courses now, and have actual certification in basic horticulture. With this education, and as a hobbyist just growing for myself at home, I will continue using Miracle-Gro.
Click to expand...
I make you right, it is an utter pissing contest. I have just dropped some money on a set of Alibaba Quantum Boards. People hate on them because they aren't the latest and greatest brand and can't possibly comparable to the fancy pants brand they have invested 3 times the money in. I have done my research and have been buying other electronics direct from China for a while and never had a problem.

Until I have a problem I am going to stick with what I am doing now. It is cheap and simple.
 
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