Yeah, custom diodes, they're serious about grow lights.
Maybe @Grow Lights Australia or others can help on the spectrum.
Cool, you'll fit right in here.
building a 750w LED fixture from high bay lights
- Thread starter watsongreenthumb
- Start date
Maybe @Grow Lights Australia or others can help on the spectrum.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Thanks for all the reply's guys, have been super busy sealing, insulating, waterproofing etc. Still trying to schedule a time to pick up the ufo's but he has me down for 5 and said he will cut me an even better deal if I want more. Tempting but there are a ton of things I still need for my room, as an unfortunate situation a few years back led to the loss of alot of my prized equipment, and I have had to get pretty creative with replacing it. For example I just got a 40 amp contactor and some of those 120/240 outlets so I can build a light controller, If anyone is interested in a diy on that let me know, my favorite feature on the titan controller I had was its ability to accept 120 or 240v style plugs but run everything at 240, and the controller I am building uses the same outlets. should be able to finish it for about $50 and it could be easily expanded to run as many or few lights as you want.
That was sort of off topic BUT lighting related I guess, anyways what are peoples thoughts on the samsung lm561 diodes vs the 301b? growdaddyled has a kit with 12 strips + heatsinks thats available in 2700k but uses the lm561 instead of the 301b. the link is HERE . these are going for $240, which seems like a pretty good deal, they also have 660 and 660+730 boards that use the same format and heatsinks. Also looked at some basic aluminum angle at home depot today that I could use to build a frame to hold everything, was $30ish for a 8 footer of 1 1/4 x 1/8. Not super rigid but would probably work, although the extrusions I have seen online are certainly sexier and possibly offer more mounting options. I am working up a design that is somewhat along the lines of THIS chilled logic 4x4 fixture from rapid led, except I am thinking it should be more square because I would like to cover a 5x5. IF anyone knows somewhere or way to get some more cost effective led boards I would love to hear about it, I have to go to the junkyard this weekend to shop for a transmission and was thinking I would check out the tail lights of any cars with led tails, as I watched a video where Dr Bruce Bugbee mentioned that the cost of 660nm diodes is coming down due to their use in taillights. Probably a long shot but might as well bust into a few while Im there..... OH and if anyone knows the best way to adhere panda poly to cinderblock I am ALL EARS....
PS Still very interested in hearing more about phosphor coated reds... since regular white Led's are Phosphor coated blues, Would a phosphor coated red have a similar spectrum except flipped? like a bump at 660 and then filling out the rest of the spectrum from there? VERY exciting stuff!!
That was sort of off topic BUT lighting related I guess, anyways what are peoples thoughts on the samsung lm561 diodes vs the 301b? growdaddyled has a kit with 12 strips + heatsinks thats available in 2700k but uses the lm561 instead of the 301b. the link is HERE . these are going for $240, which seems like a pretty good deal, they also have 660 and 660+730 boards that use the same format and heatsinks. Also looked at some basic aluminum angle at home depot today that I could use to build a frame to hold everything, was $30ish for a 8 footer of 1 1/4 x 1/8. Not super rigid but would probably work, although the extrusions I have seen online are certainly sexier and possibly offer more mounting options. I am working up a design that is somewhat along the lines of THIS chilled logic 4x4 fixture from rapid led, except I am thinking it should be more square because I would like to cover a 5x5. IF anyone knows somewhere or way to get some more cost effective led boards I would love to hear about it, I have to go to the junkyard this weekend to shop for a transmission and was thinking I would check out the tail lights of any cars with led tails, as I watched a video where Dr Bruce Bugbee mentioned that the cost of 660nm diodes is coming down due to their use in taillights. Probably a long shot but might as well bust into a few while Im there..... OH and if anyone knows the best way to adhere panda poly to cinderblock I am ALL EARS....
PS Still very interested in hearing more about phosphor coated reds... since regular white Led's are Phosphor coated blues, Would a phosphor coated red have a similar spectrum except flipped? like a bump at 660 and then filling out the rest of the spectrum from there? VERY exciting stuff!!
Grow Lights Australia
Well-Known Member
Here you go. The PC Reds are a broad-spectrum red that have a ratio of 3:1 Red: Far RedYeah, custom diodes, they're serious about grow lights.
Maybe @Grow Lights Australia or others can help on the spectrum.
Cool, you'll fit right in here.
MedicinalMyA$$
Well-Known Member
If you seal the cinderblocks with a couple coats of glossy paint in the spots you need to then normal or double-sided tape will work. Blu-Tack or another similar reusable adhesive putty is the easiest and cheapest option and should work on 'raw' cinderblocks but will depend on how dusty/chalky they are. Hot Glue will stick to the brick but not so sure it will stick to the poly.
The 301b are more efficient but also cost more. Meijiu or Kingbrite on alibaba are lower cost and popular here. Bridgelux EB2 strips are also cost effective.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Yeah I had already sealed/waterproofed them to address some moisture issues and prevent the possibility of mold. I kept after it last night and ended up just strapping out the walls with some 1x so I would have something to mount things on and attach the poly too. In the future I may cover the walls with a layer of xps foam board for better insulation + airsealing and the strapping will give me something to screw that to also.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Will have to check out those suppliers on alibaba, I have looked at a few different complete fixtures on alibaba but with so many suppliers it was hard to find somewhere to start and narrow things down to the best options. I am sure the shipping on led boards will be much more reasonable than the bar array fixtures I was primarilly looking at.
Those bridgelux strips sound really interesting, I noticed mars hydro uses almost 4000 brigelux chips on its fc-e 6500 and from what I have seen it is very efficient yet sells for a reasonable price. I actually googled around a few weeks ago for bridgelux boards after seeing thats what the fc-e was using but all I found were their cobs, is there a supplier you would recommend for the strips?
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Very cool! Those diodes look like they would be perfect for supplimenting the red and far red/ir all at once, seems more natural to me as well compared to two different bumps on the spectrum. Any plans to build a panel or strip with these diodes? I need to get on the computer and check out your website!!
Grow Lights Australia
Well-Known Member
We already offer those diodes as supplemental light in the form of Buddies, which are waterproof and more flexible than strips as they can be mounted pretty much anywhere.
Buddies – Flexible LEDs - Grow Lights Australia
Buddies are the flexible answer to LED side-lighting, under-canopy lighting and supplementary lighting to enhance almost any existing grow light setup.
growlightsaustralia.com
When you combine them with our 4K white Buddies you get a pretty nice side-lighting spectrum that is very similar to our High Light 420 spectrum, just minus the UV and violet. Here is the combined 1:1 PC Red + 4K White Buddies spectrum. This is normally what we sell as a side-lighting kit but they can also be used in small cabinets and shelves where the High Light 420 boards are too powerful.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Wow, just checked out your website. Love your full spectrum- but with LOTS of red on your buddies and led boards!! It seems like a lot of manufucturers have gone with more blue based spectrums but I have been looking for something with more and broader red. Those buddies look like they have infinite mounting options too.We already offer those diodes as supplemental light in the form of Buddies, which are waterproof and more flexible than strips as they can be mounted pretty much anywhere.
Buddies – Flexible LEDs - Grow Lights Australia
Buddies are the flexible answer to LED side-lighting, under-canopy lighting and supplementary lighting to enhance almost any existing grow light setup.
When you combine them with our 4K white Buddies you get a pretty nice side-lighting spectrum that is very similar to our High Light 420 spectrum, just minus the UV and violet. Here is the combined 1:1 PC Red + 4K White Buddies spectrum. This is normally what we sell as a side-lighting kit but they can also be used in small cabinets and shelves where the High Light 420 boards are too powerful.
View attachment 4983099
Grow Lights Australia
Well-Known Member
That's probably because we're one of the few companies that do a lot of in-house (proxy, commissioned) testing, so we know what works. Blue-based phosphors are great for radiant efficiency but can be detrimental to photosynthetic efficiency beyond a certain point. Far Red and UV are where it's at. Really, you want a balanced spectrum first, radiant efficiency second. Even better if you can combine the two (as we try to do).
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Yes it seems like they are all in a race to have the highest efficiency, and the higher color temps/more blue led's are slightly more efficient. But for me the efficiency is just an added bonus and not a deciding factor, the total light output and spectrum of the fixture are much more important, because for me its about what the plants like, we are not racing efficiency numbers ya know!
Treesomewanted77
Well-Known Member
There is a brand on Amazon called melonfarm that says they use LM301B diodes and meanwell drivers and they are only 40 bucks for a 100W true 100watt but says they are currently unavailable right now. A buddy ordered one before they wet out of stock so I will take a look at it and see if it’s all China junk or decent. I run a China knockoff 480w in 3000k with far red and UV and for what I paid it’s an awesome light but really boils down to what will work for your setup and budget. Best of luck in your search
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watsongreenthumb
Active Member
interesting, would deff be interested to know what diodes that uses and how many, and if they really use meanwell drivers. Honestly I am more skeptical of amazon than I used to be, getting to be alot more wild west than ever as far as different shady vendors and stuff. still though could be a diamond in the rough, there is no way to know for sure until you have actually checked them out in person. looks like I am finally picking the ufo lights up Saturday afternoon! excited to finally get these things and wrap my mind around the possibilities. need to figure out the voltages with the drivers and whatnot but I think I am going to go with one of the 12 pack of strips from growdaddyled.com, either the 2700k lm561 pack, or the 660+730 bundle. Will have to see the color temperature on the ufo's apparently they could be 4000k, 4500, or 5k. The guy I am getting them from thought they were 4k, but after talking to him more I am not so sure he has a clue. I really wish I knew the drive current and amperage on the drivers
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Okay so I dug a little deeper and found the sosen data sheet for the drivers, here is the LINK. tried to do some copy past from a pdf but didnt really work, but its constant current driver, 150W, 180-260V voltage range 240V-260V voltage out max 0.52-0.75A Iout. The voltage on these looks a LOT higher than most drivers I have looked at, (usually 24-48v) Will need to look at some wiring diagrams for some of these strips to see if thats something I can work with adapting the ufo drivers to run. If not I will just grab a couple for veg, toss a dimmer on there and call it good for now.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Haha! I wonder what Spiderfarmer thinks of "melonfarm"? Probably made by the same company in the same Chinese factory – they certainly look the same.
Mate, you're looking at Constant Current drivers, not Constant Voltage – that's why the output voltage is so high. It means you would need to wire those strips in series instead of parallel. Don't those UFOs already have drivers? if not, I doubt they can be wired in series, but you never know.
I'm not a fan of series strips and high DC voltages – I prefer parallel and lower voltages for safety reasons. Also, anything below 60V on this side of the world is not subject to the same safety standards as high-voltage aplliances, so you don't need an electrician to wire them together to be legal. I'm not sure of the regs in your own country, but it's something to be aware of.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Yes, those drivers are the drivers on the ufo's, was hoping to use some of those drivers to power all the pucks on the ufo's, running them at a lower current to up the efficiency and free up some drivers to power some other strips. While I am not aware of any regulations regarding working on things that are not hard wired to mains power, and I am in the trades and very comfortable with higher ac voltage, I dont have a ton of experience with high voltage DC or wiring LED's. From the basic research I have done it seems like there can be some issues when paralleling 10 or so strips. I did some math and if I daisy chained 10 of those strips, that would get me to 240v, but the drive current would only be 750ma max, out of the 1850 they are rated for, so it dosent seem like these drivers will work well with those particular strips. If anybody has any information otherwise, or a way to wire this up that will work, or some other led's that would be more compatable, please let me know!
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I don't know which strips you are talking about, but that driver is limited to 200V at 0.75A according to the performance curve. I can't help you with the number of strips you can run until I see the forward voltage vs forward current curve of the strips in question, as it is likely they won't drop 24V at 0.75A so you might still be able to run 10 of them. You will need to run the UFOs in parallel, I suspect, because they appear to be high voltage units and running in series (even if it's possible) may not provide enough voltage to light two up on one driver.
If you're getting all those UFOs so cheap, why not just spend the coin on a cheap driver for the strips?
If you're getting all those UFOs so cheap, why not just spend the coin on a cheap driver for the strips?
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Sorry, been super busy the past couple days trying to knock out these room renovations so i can move the girls back in. The strips I was talking about are lm561 24v strips with a max current of 1800ma from growdaddyleds.com, link Here. They have 12 48w lm561 strips with heatsinks for $240 and the same thing but with lm301b's for $300. I think I read somewhere that lm301b are 210 lm/w and the lm561 are like 187 lm/w- does that sound about right? So the lm301b strips would put out about 14% more light at the same wattage compared to the lm561, but the kit is 25% more expensive for the 301b. Something to think about.
I think your right about buying a different driver for the strips, I may play around with using 1 driver to run 2 ufo's, but since it dosent seem like those drivers would be a good match for any of the light strips I have seen, I will probably just leave them alone and use a dimmer. Have been planning out my fixture, trying to come up with the best way to incorporate the ufo's- the best idea I have come up with so far is using the ufo's in the corners and mounting some aluminum angle to the heatsinks of the ufos- to the part that extends out past the circular board in the center. That way I can use the nice round eyes on the ufo's as the hanging points for my entire fixture.
I have noticed that a lot of pre built fixtures from companies like mars hydro (fce-6500), Medicgrow, Volt etc seem to offer a similar or in a lot of cases even better value on diodes and drivers than buying the components and building it myself, is this just economy of scale or what? I think for me personally it still makes more sense to build fixtures as it gives me the ability to totally customize the spectrum, Include whatever features I want (being able to angle the boards a little to mimic the overlapping/angled light effect of hps lights), as well as add more boards over time to increase the efficiency. Really wish I had a 3d printer to be able to make small parts, like little covers for the wiring at the end of the light strips.
watsongreenthumb
Active Member
Would it be possible to wire two of those ufo drivers in parallel? I cannot find the Fv for those lm561 strips I posted the link for, it just says 24v and 1800ma reccomended maximum. But if those drivers are 200v at a max current of 750ma, could I run 2 ufo drivers in parallel to power some strips wired in series at 1500ma? 8 strips wired in series at 24v is 192 volts, within the range of the drivers and strips. I think those strips will run at something below 24v though so it may be possible to run 9. Thats provided it is even possible to run led drivers in parallel, I know its done with other kinds of dc power supplys, but I dont know about with led drivers. Very curious to hear what people think