If veg NPK is 3-1-2 then wtf are most nutes no where near?

Uberknot

Uberknot

Well-Known Member
I love all this talk about NPK and ratios....I am still trying to figure out the medium part....

I see this stuff all the time and actually save it for later when I can understand it better....

VEGETATIVE:
Seedlings 2-1-2 : 2 - 1 - 2
Early Vegetative 4-2-3 : 2 - 1 - 1.5
Mid-Vegetative 10-5-7 : 2 - 1 - 1.4

FLOWERING:
Cycle Changeover 7-7-7 : 1 = 1 = 1
Early Flowering 5-10-7 : 1 - 2 - 1.4
Mid-Flowering 6-15-10 : 1 - 2.5 - 1.7
Late Flowering 4-10-7 : 1 - 2.5 - 1.8

or

Seedling 5-3-4
Vegetative 5-2-3
Flowering 5-5-3

Or

Veg: (NPK ratio: 1.5 - 1 - 1.5) I might vary that to 1:1 parts and get 1.3-1-1.3?
Transition (NPK ratio: 1-1-1)
Early flower (1-1.2-1.2) Maybe drop the AP at times to get 1-1.3-1.3?
Mid flower (1-1.5-1.33)
Late flower (1-2-1.6)

OR

Early flowering: 5-10-7
Mid flowering: 6-15-10
Late flowering: 4-10-7


So many different ways and you have to know the Soil/Medium/Nutrients....and the plant.
 
Uberknot

Uberknot

Well-Known Member
Not only that.....this too. Then I see some guy using MG soil and just letting go.....doing better.

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Bunduki

Bunduki

Active Member
Different strains or even phenotypes can vary in the exact nutrient %'s they use, you see so many different answers, all of which people say work, because there ARE many different answers. Just read some of the growlogs with different strains performing differently in the same conditions with the same nutes and it's fairly clear even to a virtual novice like myself.

This gives you 3 options as far as I can see.

Make up your own nutrients, whether from scratch or combining various additives and adjust them to suit your plants is the best, but it requires you sticking to the same strain to get it dialled in right. If you use clones, this is a good choice.

Experiment with different nutrients to find which works best for your plants. This can be costly as you need to buy various different brands, but if you frequently grow different strains, eventually you'll use each up on whichever you find likes it best.

This only really works in hydro - just change your water more often. As long as your water is at the right temp, ph and ec, your plant doesn't NEED the exact proportions it uses, if it uses most of one nutrient and not much of another, that will cause a buildup of the excess, but as long as you completely change your water every week through bloom it's never getting long enough to be a problem.
 
MrClone

MrClone

Active Member
MrClone said:
That is just a general guide. Like a guide you would use in making your own ?-?-? mix. I use a way different mix for my moms.
instead of 3-2-1 tsp/g GH recommends for aggressive feed which has to much nitrate nitrogen. Or a luxury amount I use more of a 1.8-1.6-0.5 mix and get better results and much faster rooting, faster transition, and it has more stored energy than one that has higher nitrogen specially Nitrates because a plant will use 60% of its energy to assimilate the nitrates. Won't burn it at the luxury level but why make your plant work harder to grow instead of letting use more energy to store essentials that it will need in flowering? Like stored sugars that way it will use less in flowering do to it having stored resources and can give more energy to producing flowers.
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Sorry I dunno what I was thinking here its only 30 ish % of its energy used assimilating the nitrates not 60 haha
 
L

Lil dicky

Member
Connoisseurus Rex said:
It's any bottled nutes. Let me try to simplify this.

For example, NPK ratio of 3-3-3. That means that 3% of the volume is N, 3% is P, 3% is K and 92% is filler.

Now, your 3% N is broken down into concentration. The nitrogen concentration in that 3% could be 100% or 80% or whatever they chose to go with.

In other words, ratios are just how much content is in the mix. Concentration is how strong the nutrient in the ratio is.
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You guys
The whole damn reason they have a part A (Veg nutrient) with more potassium is that these two-part nutrients are meant to be used all the way through into flowering.
You will need that pk boost during EARLY FLOWER, when you are transitioning into bloom. Like weeks 1-3 of flower
You will start with just part A in veg, then slide slowly into A and B (with more A than B at first, hence using more potassium at first), then 50/50 A and B in week 3 prolly, then sliding into prolly 30/70 veg/bloom then.. by the end of flower you are ALL part B (bloom)
Prolly by week 5.
boom there you go
That’s why the veg npk of a two part nutrient base has so much K
 
Wizzlebiz

Wizzlebiz

Well-Known Member
Lil dicky said:
You guys
The whole damn reason they have a part A (Veg nutrient) with more potassium is that these two-part nutrients are meant to be used all the way through into flowering.
You will need that pk boost during EARLY FLOWER, when you are transitioning into bloom. Like weeks 1-3 of flower
You will start with just part A in veg, then slide slowly into A and B (with more A than B at first, hence using more potassium at first), then 50/50 A and B in week 3 prolly, then sliding into prolly 30/70 veg/bloom then.. by the end of flower you are ALL part B (bloom)
Prolly by week 5.
boom there you go
That’s why the veg npk of a two part nutrient base has so much K
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You are 5 years late with this info.

Think of all the people you could have helped if you were on time with this thread response.

For shame.
 
L

Lil dicky

Member
Wizzlebiz said:
You are 5 years late with this info.

Think of all the people you could have helped if you were on time with this thread response.

For shame.
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Haha well yeah
It’s just some people were saying “these nutrient companies don’t know what they’re doing, why should we listen to them”
And obviously yeah, they’re selling us water
But their ratios are pretty much on point
 
Southernontariogrower

Southernontariogrower

Well-Known Member
my veg nutes are 20-10-20 and using calmag at 14-0-14 so works out to 34-10-34, this allows me to feed at lower strength and plants can still thrive. Always thought lower numbers were for hydro and such, used Gaia 4-4-4 for veg for years, first time in decades feeding high numbered nutes and remembering bro science being why l changed to lower numbers, lm cheap and want most from my plants. 10x the amount of nutes means l can use 10xs less if desire. Imo only, but am putting to test this years grow. No more liquid is too costly. Solualable powders now.
 
jondamon

jondamon

Well-Known Member
Wizzlebiz said:
You are 5 years late with this info.

Think of all the people you could have helped if you were on time with this thread response.

For shame.
Click to expand...
What’s going to kick it even further into the field of OH FUCK!

Direct from DUTCH PRO when I queried why there NPK on tbr website contains no P!

Hi Jon,

The A+B does contain phosphorus, but according to regulations, whenever the amount is below 1%, you are not allowed to state it on the label.

However, we just launched our new recipe for the soft water nutrients, which is more concentrated and then you actually see 2% of phosphorus on there.

Even if we were to have 1.9% of something in our products, we have to round it down to 1%...therefore the NPK statement feels a bit like a joke. I wished regulations would change this.
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Lordhooha

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
Lil dicky said:
Haha well yeah
It’s just some people were saying “these nutrient companies don’t know what they’re doing, why should we listen to them”
And obviously yeah, they’re selling us water
But their ratios are pretty much on point
Click to expand...
Oh they know what they're doing suckering ppl into buying ridiculous amounts of over priced water. Powered nutrients are where its at and honestly it doesn't have to be overly complicated. I use either a single or a.two part at most mix them 50/50 adjust my ec accordingly and feed them a balanced nutrient blend start to finish. Recharge or compost tea are the only other thing I use. At my home lab/ grow im trying yara milas 15-15-15 prilled nutrients with great success only giving Recharge each watering.
 
M

melaninTonic

Member
Lil dicky said:
Haha well yeah
It’s just some people were saying “these nutrient companies don’t know what they’re doing, why should we listen to them”
And obviously yeah, they’re selling us water
But their ratios are pretty much on point
Click to expand...
Hehe, well I'm for giving them some slack in choosing their own formulations and pitching them to us as the Solution.
But where I draw the line is where one company's Veg formula is exactly the same NPK as another's Bloom formula.
Biobizz Grow and Iguana Juice Organic Bloom are both 4-3-6, for crying out loud.

I get it that both will probably actually work quite well for both Veg and Bloom, and maybe that's the balance they were aiming for, but then label your products accordingly... shouldn't be too much to ask. I'm whacking Iguana a bit more heavily because 'Bloom' is a more specific label than 'Grow'. Grow truly can mean both phases since technically, plant matter is growing in both: just different cell specialisations. Bloom means bloom and nothing else.

In my eyes, a bloom specific product should have less nitrogen than that, and definitely less nitrogen than phosphorus.
Anyway. I'm ok. I promise. This stuff doesn't keep me up at night.
 
Lordhooha

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
melaninTonic said:
Hehe, well I'm for giving them some slack in choosing their own formulations and pitching them to us as the Solution.
But where I draw the line is where one company's Veg formula is exactly the same NPK as another's Bloom formula.
Biobizz Grow and Iguana Juice Organic Bloom are both 4-3-6, for crying out loud.

I get it that both will probably actually work quite well for both Veg and Bloom, and maybe that's the balance they were aiming for, but then label your products accordingly... shouldn't be too much to ask. I'm whacking Iguana a bit more heavily because 'Bloom' is a more specific label than 'Grow'. Grow truly can mean both phases since technically, plant matter is growing in both: just different cell specialisations. Bloom means bloom and nothing else.

In my eyes, a bloom specific product should have less nitrogen than that, and definitely less nitrogen than phosphorus.
Anyway. I'm ok. I promise. This stuff doesn't keep me up at night.
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I use front row ag and nitrogen is high and dont have an issue. Plus grow and bloom generally have different trace elements in them not to mention sulphates and calcium load.
 

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