Iran mistakenly shot down Ukraine jet - US media

[gb123]

Iran mistakenly shot down the Ukrainian plane that crashed on Wednesday near Tehran with 176 people on board, US media report.

US officials say they believe the Ukrainian International Airlines Boeing 737-800 was hit by a missile, CBS says.

Ukraine earlier said it was examining whether a missile strike brought down the aircraft - but Iran ruled this out.

The crash came just hours after Iran carried out missile strikes on two airbases housing US forces in Iraq.

CBS News quoted US intelligence sources as saying a satellite detected infrared "blips" of two missile launches, followed by another blip of an explosion.

Meanwhile, Newsweek quoted a Pentagon and senior US intelligence officials, as well as an Iraqi intelligence official, as saying they believed the Ukrainian plane was hit by a Russian-made Tor missile.

US President Donald Trump said on Thursday that "I have my suspicions" over the plane. "Somebody could have made a mistake," he said.

• What we know about downed flight PS752
• Plane crash victims 'were the best of us'
• Who were the victims of the crash?
• Tributes to three British nationals killed

Amid tensions heightened by the US killing of top Iranian general Qasem Soleimani on 3 January, Iran has said it will not hand over the recovered black box flight recorders to Boeing, the plane's manufacturer, or to the US.

Under global aviation rules Iran has the right to lead the investigation, but manufacturers are typically involved.

What did US media report?
In separate reports, CBS News and Newsweek said US and Iraqi intelligence officials were confident the Ukrainian plane was brought down by a missile fired by Iran.

CBS published a brief report on Twitter, saying the officials were confident the plane was shot down.

It said this information was based on US intelligence, which sources said picked up signals of a radar being turned on. US satellites also reportedly detected two missile launches shortly before the Ukrainian plane exploded.

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Meanwhile, Newsweek quoted US and Iraqi officials as saying they believed the aircraft was hit by a Russia-built Tor M-1 surface-to-air missile system, known as Gauntlet by Nato.

Two Pentagon officials assessed that the incident was accidental, Newsweek added.

It quoted sources as saying that Iran's anti-aircraft systems were probably active following its attacks on the US airbases.

 

[captainmorgan]

Most likely made up propaganda.

 

[Dr.Amber Trichome]

Very coincidental that’s for sure.

 

[captainmorgan]

The plane had just taken off leaving Tehran in the heart of the country full of fuel with mostly Iranians onboard. Another commercial flight above them report the plane on fire. Reports are that the plane tried turning back to the airport before going down. Look into the history of problems with the 737 since it came into service. Tail rudders driving planes into the ground, software driving planes into the ground, crack in the wings and wire bundle problems that can cause fires and system failures, what else might they be hiding? Anything Boeing says is suspect since they are trying to save the company from bankruptcy after trying to hide all the problems that have killed lots of people. Why would they shoot down their own citizens?

 

[DrKiz]

Very coincidental that’s for sure.

Agreed.

 

[DrKiz]

Why would they shoot down their own citizens?

Good question. Setup?

 

[captainmorgan]

Two most likely are problems with the plane or another country shot it down. The US shot down one of theirs before, Iran Air flight 655, by mistake we claim.

 

[doublejj]

The plane had just taken off leaving Tehran in the heart of the country full of fuel with mostly Iranians onboard. Another commercial flight above them report the plane on fire. Reports are that the plane tried turning back to the airport before going down. Look into the history of problems with the 737 since it came into service. Tail rudders driving planes into the ground, software driving planes into the ground, crack in the wings and wire bundle problems that can cause fires and system failures, what else might they be hiding? Anything Boeing says is suspect since they are trying to save the company from bankruptcy after trying to hide all the problems that have killed lots of people. Why would they shoot down their own citizens?

Boeing 737 is still one of the safest airplanes in the sky. It's only the latest version (737MAX) has has major issues. Trillions of safe air miles logged will tell you the early versions are exceptionally safe airframes...As of 2006, there were an average of 1,250 Boeing 737s airborne at any given time, with two either departing or landing somewhere every five seconds.

 

[captainmorgan]

Boeing 737 is still one of the safest airplanes in the sky. It's only the latest version (737MAX) has has major issues. Trillions of safe air miles logged will tell you the early versions are exceptionally safe airframes...As of 2006, there were an average of 1,250 Boeing 737s airborne at any given time, with two either departing or landing somewhere every five seconds.

In the 1990's 737's were driving themselves into the ground from stuck tail rudders.

 

[doublejj]

In the 1990's 737's were driving themselves into the ground from stuck tail rudders.

this is like tesla car fires......there are 40,000+ car fires every year but you only see Tesla fires on the news.....???
flying in a 737 is safer than driving a car......and yet we do that every day

 

[captainmorgan]

this is like tesla car fires......there are 40,000+ car fires every year but you only see Tesla fires on the news.....???
flying in a 737 is safer than driving a car......and yet we do that every day

Sure flying is safer than driving, does that mean it's ok for a company to hide design flaws that are killing people by the plane load?

 

[gb123]

Trudeau says Canada has intelligence Iran shot down Ukrainian airliner

(CNN)Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said Thursday that Canadian officials have intelligence from their own sources and Canada's allies that shows Ukrainian International Airlines flight 752 was shot down by an Iranian surface to air missile. "This may have been unintentional," Trudeau said at a press conference in Ottowa.
Trudeau has called for a thorough investigation into what caused the crash.
"The intelligence and evidence suggests that it's a surface to air strike," Trudeau added, though he would not provide additional details.
The US increasingly believes that Iran mistakenly shot down the airliner, according to multiple US officials. The working theory is based on continuing analysis of data from satellites, radar and electronic data collected routinely by US military and intelligence.


President Donald Trump on Thursday said he suspected the crash was not due to mechanical issues, indicating that "somebody could have made a mistake on the other side."
Asked during a White House event what he thought happened to the plane, Trump said, "Well, I have my suspicions."
European security officials told CNN they believe reports suggesting that the plane was shot down by an Iranian surface to air missile in error are credible.


Ukraine investigators consider missile strike, terrorism as possible causes of Iran plane crash
The timing of the crash has fueled speculation about its cause, coming just hours after Iran fired missiles at two Iraqi bases housing US troops in retaliation for the killing of its top general, also in Iraq. The exchange of attacks between Tehran and Washington on Iraqi soil was a dramatic escalation of tensions between the adversaries, and is raising fears of another proxy war in the Middle East.
The head of Iran's Civil Aviation Authority is questioning the US allegation.
Speaking to CNN, Ali Abedzadeh said, "if a rocket or missile hits a plane, it will free fall."
Abedzadeh asked, "How can a plane be hit by rocket or missile" and then the pilot "try to turn back to the airport?"
He also told CNN the plane's black boxes are damaged and Iran may need help decoding them.
"Generally speaking, Iran has the potential and know-how to decode the black box. Everybody knows that," Abedzadeh said.
However, he also added that, "the black box of this very Ukrainian Boeing 737 is damaged. Ukrainian Aviation experts arrived here in Tehran today. We had a session with them. From tomorrow they will start decoding the data."
"If the available equipment is not enough to get the content" Iran will outsource the boxes to "the experts from France or Canada," Abedzadeh said.
Newsweek was first to report US and Iraqi sources believe Iran shot down the plane by mistake.
"I don't want to say that because other people have their suspicions," Trump said, but added, "Somebody could have made a mistake on the other side ... not our system. It has nothing to do with us."
"It was flying in a pretty rough neighborhood. They could've made a mistake. Some people say it was mechanical. I personally don't think that's even a question."
Asked if he thought it was downed by accident, Trump said, "I don't know. I really don't know ... that's up to them. At some point they'll release the black box."
"Ideally they'd give it to Boeing," he said, but said giving it to France or "some other country" would be fine, too.
"Something very terrible happened, very devastating," he concluded.


Former investigator: How to handle Iran plane crash
The Ukrainian International Airlines (UIA) flight PS752 came down just minutes after takeoff from Tehran on Wednesday local time, killing all 176 people on board, including dozens of Iranians and Canadians. The Boeing 737-800 was headed for Kiev, where 138 passengers were expected to take a connecting flight to Canada. Ukrainians, Swedes, Afghans, Germans and British nationals were also aboard.
One possibility being considered is that an Iranian missile unit saw something on their radar, thought they were under attack and fired.
"If it is true that an Iranian missile brought down a civilian airliner, it points to exactly the sort of miscalculation and recklessness that attends the cycle of escalation and violence we've been seeing in the region. The innocent people killed in this tragedy would then, sadly, not be the only victims. Iran must fully cooperate with investigators and be willing to account for their actions," CNN national security analyst retired Adm. John Kirby said.
Investigation underway
Iran's Civil Aviation Organization head, Ali Abedzadeh, said it would not hand the flight data recorders to Boeing or the United States after they were found on Wednesday.
One of the officials said the US is working closely with the Canadians on the intelligence. US officials have also shared officials with UK officials, according to sources familiar.
Ukrainian officials on Thursday were considering terrorism, a missile strike and catastrophic engine failure as potential causes for the crash, as aviation authorities in Tehran said the jetliner was on fire before it came down.
Ukraine's National Security and Defense council chief, Oleksiy Danilov, said a meeting was taking place with Iranian authorities, where various causes behind the crash were "being studied," including a theory that the plane was hit by an anti-aircraft missile, according to a statement on Facebook.


House to vote to limit Trump's military action against Iran without congressional approval
Conflicting claims about potential causes for the disaster began hours after the crash, when Iranian state media blamed technical issues and Ukraine ruled out rocket attacks. Within hours on Wednesday, officials in both countries had walked back those initial statements.
An initial report by the Iranian Civil Aviation Organization on the crash cites witnesses as saying the airliner was on fire while in the air and changed directions after a problem, turning back toward the airport. People on other aircraft at higher altitudes also saw the flames, Iranian officials say. Images of the wreckage show the plane torn to piece, its parts charred and strewn across a field.
CNN's Nick Paton Walsh, Alex Marquardt, Faith Karimi, Vasco Cotovio, Artemis Moshtaghian and Tara John contributed to this report.

 

[Dr.Amber Trichome]

Two most likely are problems with the plane or another country shot it down. The US shot down one of theirs before, Iran Air flight 655, by mistake we claim.

Do you think that the United States shot the plane down? Could it have been a mistake or planned. Just like the recent email mistake sent about withdrawing all troops . Or even the mistake about targeting the Iranian cultural sites. So many mistakes. The biggest mistake of them all was electing Conald . I knew
That fucker was going to start a war before he left office and he has been very worried about the impeachment trial , he knows his days are numbered.

 

[hanimmal]

I can see a conspiracy theory about Trump assaninating the Iranian General on Putin's order so he could have Iran respond with a missile attack on a US base so that they could then blow up the plane with Ukrainians without any fingerprints of him doing it.

 

[Fogdog]

During this president's tenure, we have been fed lies almost nonstop, so I'll just wait for official statement from elsewhere. Agree that some blame can and should be laid on Trump for his arbitrary and poorly thought out acts of war that he carried out in Iraq.

Condolences to the families and all of those affected by their loss of loved ones.

 

[captainmorgan]

Seems kinda thin that a russian Tor missile took it down, I would think it would fall out of the sky if a missile hit it, not catch fire and turn back to the airport. I'm not saying we shot it down or anyone else, it all seems suspicious that they are putting this stuff out without being where it happen and having access to the black boxes and tower radar data. These type of investigations don't make guesses and usually take quite some time to examine the wreckage and data before they shoot their mouths off. With Boeing's problems and the political situation it seems odd they would put this out so soon without access to the crash.

 

[Fogdog]

Seems kinda thin that a russian Tor missile took it down, I would think it would fall out of the sky if a missile hit it, not catch fire and turn back to the airport. I'm not saying we shot it down or anyone else, it all seems suspicious that they are putting this stuff out without being where it happen and having access to the black boxes and tower radar data. These type of investigations don't make guesses and usually take quite some time to examine the wreckage and data before they shoot their mouths off. With Boeing's problems and the political situation it seems odd they would put this out so soon without access to the crash.

Does not seem odd to me that Trump didn't wait for an investigation and a review of evidence to be completed before he drew conclusions.

 

[Unclebaldrick]

The plane had just taken off leaving Tehran in the heart of the country full of fuel with mostly Iranians onboard. Another commercial flight above them report the plane on fire. Reports are that the plane tried turning back to the airport before going down. Look into the history of problems with the 737 since it came into service. Tail rudders driving planes into the ground, software driving planes into the ground, crack in the wings and wire bundle problems that can cause fires and system failures, what else might they be hiding? Anything Boeing says is suspect since they are trying to save the company from bankruptcy after trying to hide all the problems that have killed lots of people. Why would they shoot down their own citizens?

They fucked up. Shit happens when a war crisis is orchestrated in order to bolster an impeached aßhole.

 

[captainmorgan]

I'll hold off judgement till I actually see some evidence, I saw the B52 stuff but they fly at high altitude, not under 8,000 ft.

 

[Unclebaldrick]

I'll hold off judgement till I actually see some evidence, I saw the B52 stuff but they fly at high altitude, not under 8,000 ft.

Well yeah. But the likelihood of somebody accidentally firing a couple of missiles seems very likely.

It's Obama's fault because he paid for those missiles.