MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
I have been buying peat from Lowes, HomeDepot, and Wal-Mart...
Soil Test Results
- Thread starter Growitpondifarm
- Start date
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
Here we go, someone getting offended... Did I explain that I am on the quest for knowledge and not here just to look cool. If I am ever wrong, I will not try to hide it or cry. If someone can prove me wrong, do it. Maybe I will learn something... Just don't get your feelings hurt.
Here is the company that does the soil test, maybe they can answer your questions?
https://unibestinc.com/products/#soilsavvy
Here is where I heard about the soil tests.
https://www.kisorganics.com/pages/cannabis-cultivation-and-science-podcast-episode-17
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
Prove it... Or, am I the only one that has to site my sources on this forum???
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
I guess that you forgot that I shown you a water test report over at GC???
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
I can handle an answer like that!!!
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
The peat that I had tested, I didn't wash it at all! I just want to point that out because I make newb mistakes all the time... Also, my wife has some saponin nuts on hand. She was making homemade laundry detergent and it is very cheap to buy the whole nut and not the liquid mixture. You gotta tell me what Ivory liquid is...
Huh?
I see coir mentioned AFA high sodium, but nothing about peat, other than the "Spagnum peat moss outperformed coir" blip from Utah State U in the last paragraph.
IDK, I've never used coir. Mainly because of studies like Utah State U did.
I also get my peat at HD or Lowes, but generally avoid WalMart. Either Lambert or Premier and lately leaning towards the Lambert.
I did a quick study on both last year when I got a 3cf bale of each on sale, a cold 12pk and a fresh refill of my pain meds. I totally expanded both using a 1/2" screen and measured what resulted.
3cf bale of Premier brand peat moss, expanded and screened---- 32 gallons total
3cf bale of Lambert brand peat moss, expanded and screened --- 35 gallons total
Hmmm, 3 gallons more from the same size of Lamberts and the same price as the Premier with the same quality. Kind of a no brainer there.
Wet
I see coir mentioned AFA high sodium, but nothing about peat, other than the "Spagnum peat moss outperformed coir" blip from Utah State U in the last paragraph.
IDK, I've never used coir. Mainly because of studies like Utah State U did.
I also get my peat at HD or Lowes, but generally avoid WalMart. Either Lambert or Premier and lately leaning towards the Lambert.
I did a quick study on both last year when I got a 3cf bale of each on sale, a cold 12pk and a fresh refill of my pain meds. I totally expanded both using a 1/2" screen and measured what resulted.
3cf bale of Premier brand peat moss, expanded and screened---- 32 gallons total
3cf bale of Lambert brand peat moss, expanded and screened --- 35 gallons total
Hmmm, 3 gallons more from the same size of Lamberts and the same price as the Premier with the same quality. Kind of a no brainer there.
Wet
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
OK, your right... Where else would high sodium come from, kelp?
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
This is very close to what I used, but I didn't use any compost. How am I higher in sodium and he is lower in all of his Micro nutrients? I thought that compost was for the micros? What problems would occur if more kelp was used, sodium? When I mixed my soil, I used very little fish meal and replaced it with extra kelp. However, I was still low on micros... This is where the Melich 3 test would prove useful, it would tell me if the micros are there and just "Locked Out". The creator of the soil savvy test strongly suggested using the two tests together and I am really thinking about doing it...
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
There are minor differences to what we used in our soil and it really looks like similar inputs. I was mindful of high P and K issues from the past and I really addressed them on this mix. However, I am disappointed with the Micro levels in my soil... Here is the difference to what we used in the soil:
I used-
Glacial rock dust
Fish meal(sparingly)
dolomite lime
PondFarm used-
gypsum
ECW
Compost
I used-
Glacial rock dust
Fish meal(sparingly)
dolomite lime
PondFarm used-
gypsum
ECW
Compost
IDK, could be except kelp meal is not used in high amounts.
Most likely manure's and compost. Both are very high in sodium, especially manure. I still use manure (Black Kow), but much less than I used to for this very reason.
Wet
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
I cut back on manure because I keep getting high P #'s. The OP used manure in his mix but I used extra kelp on mine, that is the biggest difference that I can see... I probably did use kelp in high amounts.
Growitpondifarm
Well-Known Member
Mustang,
While I’m not sure if my low available micros is due to lockout or just a lack there of, one thing I can assume is that composts can have very different nutrient breakdowns based on inputs, environment, age etc. I bought my compost from a local farm so I have no way of knowing 100% what is in it.
What type of compost did you use in your mix?
All I know is that these guys grow some great produce so that was enough for me to give it a go. Not to mention I wasn’t going to buy some amazon compost that an online hero recommends for 30$ a bag. I bought a yard of the stuff for 40$.
@Wetdog
You’re mix is right up my alley, simple, easy to source and sounds proven. I hadn’t thought of using pine bark mulch in a mix. I would assume it adds aeration and will keep the soil from getting to basic over time as well.
My seedlings are a month from the time I put the seeds in the dirt. Two weeks in the soil mix that this whole thread started with. Other than maybe a small amount of leaf curl I see no I’ll effects yet. The real fun comes in 6 weeks when we’re couple weeks into flower in the fina pots. I will make sure and add a light kelp tea weekly in hopes of avoiding any type of micro nutrient issues.[/QUOTE]
While I’m not sure if my low available micros is due to lockout or just a lack there of, one thing I can assume is that composts can have very different nutrient breakdowns based on inputs, environment, age etc. I bought my compost from a local farm so I have no way of knowing 100% what is in it.
What type of compost did you use in your mix?
All I know is that these guys grow some great produce so that was enough for me to give it a go. Not to mention I wasn’t going to buy some amazon compost that an online hero recommends for 30$ a bag. I bought a yard of the stuff for 40$.
@Wetdog
You’re mix is right up my alley, simple, easy to source and sounds proven. I hadn’t thought of using pine bark mulch in a mix. I would assume it adds aeration and will keep the soil from getting to basic over time as well.
My seedlings are a month from the time I put the seeds in the dirt. Two weeks in the soil mix that this whole thread started with. Other than maybe a small amount of leaf curl I see no I’ll effects yet. The real fun comes in 6 weeks when we’re couple weeks into flower in the fina pots. I will make sure and add a light kelp tea weekly in hopes of avoiding any type of micro nutrient issues.[/QUOTE]
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
The problem with using high amounts of kelp, I didn't get the micros that I was looking for. I just answer my own question then about using more kelp, I already did it... The biggest micro that I am missing is Mn and that is supposed to be in the "Composted pine firs", so hopefully I will be able to give it a rest soon!
I have grown irritable from my on-going problems... I like to think that adversity builds character, but that character can't give up and has to keep learning.
I have grown irritable from my on-going problems... I like to think that adversity builds character, but that character can't give up and has to keep learning.
Growitpondifarm
Well-Known Member
Do you have any plants going right now? Maybe if you post some pictures people could try and help you. Or are you just frustrated by your soil test results?
Dude. My apologies.
I'm helping several growers with water quality issues, and got you tangled up in the mix. You did offer up a water analysis over at GC, and sodium wasn't the issue. It's the bicarbonate content.
I can't offer a linked source as far as soil chemistry and testing methods are concerned. I read collegiate texts concerning the subject....
https://www.amazon.com/Soil-Chemistry-3rd-Hinrich-Bohn/dp/0471363391
You may find this paper helpful. It deals with greenhouse growing (more applicable to indoor growing in potted containers than outdoors in the ground), and addresses the negative impact that alkaline irrigation water has on efficient plant nutrient adsorption. Keep in mind that greenhouse production of ornamental plants doesn't correlate to what we do indoors, considering the time frame necessary to produce said ornamentals vs. 3-5+ months to finish cannabis indoors. Greenhouse production is "turn-n-burn". We're in it for a rather long haul. Considering the watering methods generally utilized by those growing in organic soils (keeping the soil moist as opposed to watering to drain), AND the extended growing times necessary to accomplish such, the bicarbonates present in your water will begin to build up to levels (because they're not being flushed/leached from the soil) that drive pH up and begin to interfere with proper nutrient absorption. Your outdoor plants aren't affected as much or at all because the excessive bicarbonates are leached from the rhizosphere with repeated irrigation. Compare your bicarbonate levels to the upper limit levels suggested in the publication. You're adding "liquid lime" every time you water.
Hope this helps clear things up for you.
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
I have been using oak leaves, grass clippings, and rabbit bedding. I have been using a mix or straw and alfalfa hay for the bedding and it is usually urine soaked and full of feed pellets and turds.
When I first started composting, I was amending it with "Build-a-soil's Nutrient Pack". The one similar to Cootz's pack. However, I was using this bagged soil that was 60% composted pine bark firs and that is when I had my best success. I kept adding huge amounts of composted rabbit manure until everything started to turn yellow, then I screened the pine bark out because I thought that it was sequestering the N away. I found out later that I was dealing with P tox rather than N def.
The point of the story.. Everything went to shit after I screened out the pine bark firs... I have no evidence on this, but I have been dealing with the same P issues since I stopped using it. Also, I posted some pics earlier in this thread.
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
It's cool... My feelings are aside on this issue... My thoughts are that every person is going to have different issues from environmental differences. I tested the ground soil here and it is very high in P. Therefore, my high P might be coming from the leaves and grass that I use in my compost???
Let me look for my water test sample. I really haven't considered it because the test didn't look too bad and I use about 1/3 RO water to my well water.
MustangStudFarm
Well-Known Member
Ok, I really haven't researched the water test... To be honest, I have been keeping up more with what the OKC Thunder are doing this off-season. What a drama show!!!
