Senator Sanders, in his own words

[Fogdog]

Introducing universal healthcare isn't a piece of major legislation?

Nope

First, it was an unfinished bill. It didn't come with a funding mechanism. It spelled out what but not how.

Second, it never even made it to the floor for a vote.

Third and I think this is most important. It was simply not politically acceptable to the people of this country. Bernie's bill was a mandate that everybody would switch to federal health care program. There are 80 million people who already have health care coverage. About 80% of them like their health care plan. What that plan would have done is to create 60 millon angry people. Scott Lamb won by 700 votes. If he supported that poisonous bill, A Republican would have his seat instead of a Democrat. He supported making the ACA better and he won with that policy.

No sir. That plan, if it had made it into a serious national debate would have ensured Republican control of Congress for the foreseeable future. It would have enabled Republicans to do away with the ACA, Medicare and Medicaid

That symbolic bill that you believe in so much without any real understanding.fails because it wasn't a complete bill, it never saw the light of day and would have forced 80 million people out of coverage that they already have and like.

 

[ttystikk]

All opinions here.

Yours directly help Trump.

False logic, which thus casts doubt on the rest of your opinions here.

The notion that I owe the Democratic Party my vote or loyalty when they don't effectively represent me is fundamentally flawed and even antidemocratic.

Not to mention self serving.

 

[ttystikk]

I think wasting time whining about 2016 is idiotic.

I explained to you before about taking money doesn't guarantee a damn thing.

How many disappointed donors are there?

Examining the disaster of 2016 is extremely instructive if one actually wants to make changes to better reflect the votes of its base.

Nancy Pelosi herself is on record as saying the Democratic Party plans no such corrections, so why should I support them?

 

[ttystikk]

My company used to donate to both sides.

I guess they were always behind the eight ball, right?

There is such a thing as good money.

Maybe you just don't like money. Most people do.

I'm willing to bet they 'earned' an excellent return on their investment in political bribery.

You must be proud. Did you personally profit? Are you a stockholder? If so, you're an accomplice. If not, merely a sucker.

 

[ttystikk]

Are all bernouts this divisive? I can't even be friends with people now? I mean, I'm not friends with you because you say stupid shit, like that time you claimed that more is expected of you at work because you are a white guy. So you want me to stop being friends with people who acknowledge idpol and be friends with you instead?

You're dumb.

This post proves how divisive YOU are.

Nevermind childish.

 

[ttystikk]

Yeah except for that damn 1st amendment.

Yet somehow this country got along just fine for 200 years without 'equating money with free speech'.

You're grasping.

 

[Fogdog]

How else do we get it passed? Why are you trying to denigrate getting it passed as introduced?

You tell me how we get it passed. How do we get it passed without Democrats Denigrating the process?

That bill was poison to the goal of enacting universal health care legislation.

 

[Fogdog]

Examining the disaster of 2016 is extremely instructive if one actually wants to make changes to better reflect the votes of its base.

Nancy Pelosi herself is on record as saying the Democratic Party plans no such corrections, so why should I support them?

So,

Are you going to vote Republican?

 

[abandonconflict]

You must be blind. You and Buckwit and your Merry band of ballwashers have made attacks, personal and otherwise the centerpiece of your 'debate' style for years now.

If you don't like being on the receiving end, then try to grow up and debate on the merits and without puerile insults, you know, like an actual intelligent adult.

So "merry band of ballwashers" is not a personal attack?

That's why your only friends on this site are schuylaar and padaraper. Get a job gringo.

 

[Rob Roy]

I never consented to your "purchase" of real estate property. That land is only made "yours" by threat of violence against other natural persons who may happen upon it not to trespass.

For the time being, I'll speak to this in a generic way, rather than a personal level, to try to
establish a basis for defining property.

Your point is reasonable, except human beings are physical, meaning we have to exist somewhere and no two human beings can occupy the same physical space at once. That's a feature of nature, not a manmade construct. So our physicality and having to occupy SOMEWHERE is not a thing we can consent to or not, it is a pre-existing condition of our being.

So, if you are occupying a physical space prior to me, if I come to you and attempt to remove you, my action would be an application of offensive force. I would be the attacker. Your action, to defend that space you physically occupy would be defensive, since you would be repelling my offensive force.

Further in order for people to exist they require things from the physical world, food, water, shelter etc. Therefore the food that you might harvest or grow in the area you occupy is said to be "property" and if you grew it, etc. it would be YOUR property and not mine.


Where do you agree or disagree, so far?

 

[Rob Roy]

That bill was poison to the goal of enacting universal health care legislation.

If you are a fan of Universal Healthcare and it became a law, would you be in favor of using guns to enforce that law against peaceful people who decided they didn't want to go along with your idea or would you leave them in peace?

 

[londonfog]

If you are a fan of Universal Healthcare and it became a law, would you be in favor of using guns to enforce that law against peaceful people who decided they didn't want to go along with your idea or would you leave them in peace?

Name one case where guns where used for Universal healthcare. or are you just making shit up again for the sake of argue

 

[Justin-case]

Name one case where guns where used for Universal healthcare. or are you just making shit up again for the sake of argue

Rob would refuse life giving care to black people, so naturally like all scared racists, he expects guns would become an issue.

 

[Unclebaldrick]

So "merry band of ballwashers" is not a personal attack?

That's why your only friends on this site are schuylaar and padaraper. Get a job gringo.

I protest.

He has gotten quite popular with the alt-right and Russian trolls.

 

[Rob Roy]

Name one case where guns where used for Universal healthcare. or are you just making shit up again for the sake of argue

All of them where the person being forced to belong to something hasn't explicitly consented.

 

[Rob Roy]

Rob would refuse life giving care to black people, so naturally like all scared racists, he expects guns would become an issue.

Speaking of racists...

I bet this guy wouldn't like you to pursue your racist disarmament policies.

 

[londonfog]

All of them where the person being forced to belong to something hasn't explicitly consented.

PLEASE STFU thanks

oh and thanks for paying your share. Keep it up whilst you STFU

 

[abandonconflict]

defining property...

No.

 

[Rob Roy]

No.

That was cryptic. Let me guess, you mean that defining property makes no sense, because you don't believe some things can be owned or can't be owned to the extent that some people claim they can be owned?

It would help if you offered a definition of the range of things which you think can (or should) be owned and why. I'm interested in hearing what you have to say.

 

[Rob Roy]

PLEASE STFU thanks

oh and thanks for paying your share. Keep it up whilst you STFU

STFU isn't a very good argument. It's just a notch above "nuh uh" your other "really really good" argument.