The Democratic Party Autopsy Report

Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
ChefKimbo said:
Yes most Native Americans have some form of state/federal citizenship. Usually according to their treaties with the U.S.of A.
Not all indigenous peoples here are Native Americans. There were various people groups of all shades here before Cristobal. Dutch explorer Arnoldus Montanus (among many others) wrote extensively the various nations sharing these lands in peace.

Heres a question, what makes you any different from anyone who is not a U.S. citizen? What benefits do you have that ALL other non-citizens do not?
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LOL

All pre-Columbian residents of the what is now the US were from the same genetic group that I prefer to call the first people but also call Native Americans. They fought among each other for territory and resources, it wasn't Nirvana.

All Native Americans who were born in the US or born to US citizens are US citizens.

Not going to answer a leading question. Explain yourself and perhaps I'll answer.
 
see4

see4

Well-Known Member
Rob Roy said:
Oh, so when a piece of paper containing Jim Crow laws said it was okay to forcibly keep people from associating against their wishes that meant it was sacrosanct and all people had to obey it ?

Older men having sex with boys? Have you been eyeing me again ? I thought I already told you I'm not interested Pee Wee.
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Being wrong about civil rights. Check.
Not denying involvement with NAMBLA. Check.
Thinks it's ok for young boys and older men to engage in consensual sex. Check.

We get it Rob. You hate blacks and like little boys.
 
ChefKimbo

ChefKimbo

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
LOL

All pre-Columbian residents of the what is now the US were from the same genetic group that I prefer to call the first people but also call Native Americans. They fought among each other for territory and resources, it wasn't Nirvana.

All Native Americans who were born in the US or born to US citizens are US citizens.

Not going to answer a leading question. Explain yourself and perhaps I'll answer.
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I just gave you a well known and reputable explorer from 1600s, and you still debate opinions. Here's another name, Horace Butler.
You believe there was no peace in these lands, taught from the writings of the who invaded and conquered the Americas. Patriotism. There are a number of writings detailing the efforts of European aggression to destabilize relations between the various indigenous nations. Forcible takeover of numerous ancient trading routes, destroying and poisoning of crops causing war between tribes. All this recorded in Dutch, French, Turkish, Portuguese, and Spanish archives.

Can't seem to drill it into your head that being born on this soil does NOT make you a citizen of the U.S. There is an administrative process EVERYONE must follow to become a citizen of the UNITED STATES. SOME people of indigenous bloodlines do not follow that process. There are other legal processes to declare your nationality and status for public record.

You really have a hard time understanding there is life outside of the bubble you live in.
 
dagwood45431

dagwood45431

Well-Known Member
ChefKimbo said:
I just gave you a well known and reputable explorer from 1600s, and you still debate opinions. Here's another name, Horace Butler.
You believe there was no peace in these lands, taught from the writings of the who invaded and conquered the Americas. Patriotism. There are a number of writings detailing the efforts of European aggression to destabilize relations between the various indigenous nations. Forcible takeover of numerous ancient trading routes, destroying and poisoning of crops causing war between tribes. All this recorded in Dutch, French, Turkish, Portuguese, and Spanish archives.

Can't seem to drill it into your head that being born on this soil does NOT make you a citizen of the U.S. There is an administrative process EVERYONE must follow to become a citizen of the UNITED STATES. SOME people of indigenous bloodlines do not follow that process. There are other legal processes to declare your nationality and status for public record.

You really have a hard time understanding there is life outside of the bubble you live in.
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Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
ChefKimbo said:
Can't seem to drill it into your head that being born on this soil does NOT make you a citizen of the U.S. There is an administrative process EVERYONE must follow to become a citizen of the UNITED STATES. SOME people of indigenous bloodlines do not follow that process. There are other legal processes to declare your nationality and status for public record.
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Yes, I'm pretty hard headed when somebody is trying to convince me of something that I know is not true.

People born in the borders of the United States are automatically US citizens. Children of foreign diplomats born in the United States are the only exception. Cite a reference that explains the law otherwise.

This was lifted from U.S. Code Title 8. Aliens and Nationality
The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:

 a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;

 a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe:  Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;

By law a Native American born inside the borders of the US is a US citizen unless their tribe says otherwise. I can't find any example where a tribe denies its members US citizenship. Do you know of any? If so, cite it. Everybody can choose to renounce their citizenship if they want to but everybody born inside the borders automatically is a citizen under US law.
ChefKimbo said:
I just gave you a well known and reputable explorer from 1600s, and you still debate opinions. Here's another name, Horace Butler.
You believe there was no peace in these lands, taught from the writings of the who invaded and conquered the Americas. Patriotism. There are a number of writings detailing the efforts of European aggression to destabilize relations between the various indigenous nations. Forcible takeover of numerous ancient trading routes, destroying and poisoning of crops causing war between tribes. All this recorded in Dutch, French, Turkish, Portuguese, and Spanish archives.
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You do know what "pre-Columbian" means, don't you? As far as your assertion of peace reigning over the land before white people showed up, the archaeological record says otherwise. There is plenty of physical evidence of inter-tribal conflicts that led to wholesale slaughter.

http://www.science20.com/news_articles/the_most_violent_era_in_america_was_before_europeans_arrived-141847

http://plainshumanities.unl.edu/encyclopedia/doc/egp.war.023

Entire areas of the mid-southwest in 1200's were depopulated with almost 90 percent of people's remains showing signs of lethal trauma to the head and arms. In other instances, wars between farmers and nomads or between farming communities in pre-Columbian plains of the 1300's led to entire villages -- hundreds of men, women and children were massacred. Per-capita these were the highest rates of violent death in the area that is now called the United States.
ChefKimbo said:
You really have a hard time understanding there is life outside of the bubble you live in.
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There is plenty that I'm not aware of but what you are trying to foist off of on me is false. I'm trying to be respectful but really, you should evaluate your beliefs against verifiable facts. It's fine if you don't want to take somebody else's words for it. To hold the claims you assert, you must deny the physical and legal records which are not belief or opinion but are simply facts that are verifiable and will not change no matter how hard you believe otherwise. Believe what you want. You have every right to be wrong.
 
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londonfog

londonfog

Well-Known Member
ChefKimbo said:
Can't seem to drill it into your head that being born on this soil does NOT make you a citizen of the U.S. There is an administrative process EVERYONE must follow to become a citizen of the UNITED STATES. SOME people of indigenous bloodlines do not follow that process. There are other legal processes to declare your nationality and status for public record.

You really have a hard time understanding there is life outside of the bubble you live in.
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lol
 
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Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Yes, I'm pretty hard headed when somebody is trying to convince me of something that I know is not true.

People born in the borders of the United States are automatically US citizens. Children of foreign diplomats born in the United States are the only exception. Cite a reference that explains the law otherwise.

This was lifted from U.S. Code Title 8. Aliens and Nationality
The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:

 a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;

 a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe:  Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;

By law a Native American born inside the borders of the US is a US citizen unless their tribe says otherwise. I can't find any example where a tribe denies its members US citizenship. Do you know of any? If so, cite it. Everybody can choose to renounce their citizenship if they want to but everybody born inside the borders automatically is a citizen under US law.

You do know what "pre-Columbian" means, don't you? As far as your assertion of peace reigning over the land before white people showed up, the archaeological record says otherwise. There is plenty of physical evidence of inter-tribal conflicts that led to wholesale slaughter.

http://www.science20.com/news_articles/the_most_violent_era_in_america_was_before_europeans_arrived-141847

http://plainshumanities.unl.edu/encyclopedia/doc/egp.war.023

Entire areas of the mid-southwest in 1200's were depopulated with almost 90 percent of people's remains showing signs of lethal trauma to the head and arms. In other instances, wars between farmers and nomads or between farming communities in pre-Columbian plains of the 1300's led to entire villages -- hundreds of men, women and children were massacred. Per-capita these were the highest rates of violent death in the area that is now called the United States.

There is plenty that I'm not aware of but what you are trying to foist off of on me is false. I'm trying to be respectful but really, you should evaluate your beliefs against verifiable facts. It's fine if you don't want to take somebody else's words for it. To hold the claims you assert, you must deny the physical and legal records which are not belief or opinion but are simply facts that are verifiable and will not change no matter how hard you believe otherwise. Believe what you want. You have every right to be wrong.
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Weren't children born on a plantation from a slave mother automatically the property of the plantation owner? Maybe you're thinking of that ?
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
that's the exact opposite of what happened, pedophile
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Oh certainly many white people did horrible things to black people in the past. It sure was wrong when people were forced to use their bodies and their property in ways they hadn't consented to wasn't it? Yep forced associations were certainly bad waaay back then.



So, today, you'd force a black person to use his body and property to serve a white person against his will though, wouldn't you?

That's not the opposite of what happened a long time ago, it's the same thing, forcibly depriving a person of their self determination. Yep, forced associations sure are bad, STILL, today. You're a little slow aren't you?
 
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Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
see4 said:
Being wrong about civil rights. Check.
Not denying involvement with NAMBLA. Check.
Thinks it's ok for young boys and older men to engage in consensual sex. Check.

We get it Rob. You hate blacks and like little boys.
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Cute. I'm impressed you stopped stroking your humongous dick long enough to think that up.
 
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