Best economical way to extract ?

[ChaosHunter]

Hi gang, What would be the best setup to extract on a small scale ? Extracts would be only used for vape pen oil and not dabs or edibles. BHO ? QWISO ? I don't really want a bunch of lab equipment if possible. Whats your take on the most efficient way ?

 

[Fadedawg]

From a minimal equipment standpoint for quality concentrates, I would suggest QWET.

 

[cannetix Inc]

I would suggest BHO, as long as you do it outdoors only. I'm assuming you're not stupid enough to run butane indoors, you seem to be a regular around here, but you can never stress that enough when suggesting someone make BHO. When I was making BHO regularly I would use a stainless steel turkey baster that would fit about 1Oz. of bud, a stainless steel hose clamp, and a 25-micron stainless steel screen. You can also use unbleached coffee filters but in my experience, these absorb a significant amount of oil that cant exactly is recovered. Spray into a small pyrex glass dish. You can get all the necessary equipment for around $30.00. High-quality butane is pretty cheap and easy to find. Use Colibri or Puretane. It's also very important that you only use stainless steel. You don't need an expensive vacuum chamber to purge BHO as many like to claim. You inhale more butane from a Bic lighter than what may be present in trace quantities in BHO. Un-ground bud quick-washed with the above method will make a concentrate that is hard to beat without distillation or supercritical CO2 extraction, both of which require relatively expensive equipment. Ground bud will give you a slightly higher yield but a slightly darker color due to more impurities.



QWET is a pain in the ass as far as I'm concerned unless there's an easier method of evaporation that I'm not aware of. Takes hours.

 

[ChaosHunter]

I would suggest BHO, as long as you do it outdoors only. I'm assuming you're not stupid enough to run butane indoors, you seem to be a regular around here, but you can never stress that enough when suggesting someone make BHO. When I was making BHO regularly I would use a stainless steel turkey baster that would fit about 1Oz. of bud, a stainless steel hose clamp, and a 25-micron stainless steel screen. You can also use unbleached coffee filters but in my experience, these absorb a significant amount of oil that cant exactly is recovered. Spray into a small pyrex glass dish. You can get all the necessary equipment for around $30.00. High-quality butane is pretty cheap and easy to find. Use Colibri or Puretane. It's also very important that you only use stainless steel. You don't need an expensive vacuum chamber to purge BHO as many like to claim. You inhale more butane from a Bic lighter than what may be present in trace quantities in BHO. Un-ground bud quick-washed with the above method will make a concentrate that is hard to beat without distillation or supercritical CO2 extraction, both of which require relatively expensive equipment. Ground bud will give you a slightly higher yield but a slightly darker color due to more impurities.

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QWET is a pain in the ass as far as I'm concerned unless there's an easier method of evaporation that I'm not aware of. Takes hours.

By the time I :
overnight deep freeze the dry
overnight deep freeze the strained
then filter to evaporate
It takes a couple of days

I would like to try BHO just to say I tried it to compare I just don't want to invest in vac equipment etc. Thank you for the idea above and that's doable ! Anywhere to source the screen locally ?

 

[Philip-O]

What about your very own bubble hash washing machine, for US$39.95? https://www.ebay.com/itm/231142242779

Add some bags (US$28 to US$46) and go nuts.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B006C6NY3Q/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=AXC6VLRHTOFD2

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LL65DZE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_3?smid=A3M104HT1W8RYK&psc=1​

You might add some screens for dry sifting (or just go with that, and get the bubble hash setup later). Check out what Dry Sift Master, Drysiftco and others are showing in IG.

EDIT: I just saw you are looking into making oil, but I´ll leave this here as it might be useful for other people that check out the thread.

 

[vostok]

Yip.. ice hash has gotta be the cheapest!

 

[kratos015]

My vote goes toward butane being the most economical because it gives me the best results in terms of yield and quality. QWISO is likely your cheapest option for sure as you only need a jar and some 91% ISO, but it's a bit more difficult to master than BHO in my experience. Bubble bags and dry sift and all that good stuff are also not too complicated, but require special equipment and don't yield as much as BHO or even QWISO. If you don't want to buy any equipment, look into QWISO. If you're willing to buy the equipment you need, BHO has always reigned supreme for me. I've done dry sift, bubble bags, ISO, and BHO and BHO is the consistent winner for me in terms of yield and quality.

 

[ChaosHunter]

My vote goes toward butane being the most economical because it gives me the best results in terms of yield and quality. QWISO is likely your cheapest option for sure as you only need a jar and some 91% ISO, but it's a bit more difficult to master than BHO in my experience. Bubble bags and dry sift and all that good stuff are also not too complicated, but require special equipment and don't yield as much as BHO or even QWISO. If you don't want to buy any equipment, look into QWISO. If you're willing to buy the equipment you need, BHO has always reigned supreme for me. I've done dry sift, bubble bags, ISO, and BHO and BHO is the consistent winner for me in terms of yield and quality.

I would like to try BHO at some point, Having to use a vac chamber though keeps me away from it. I've done well with QWET over the years although it takes days for me to go start to finish.

 

[kratos015]

I would like to try BHO at some point, Having to use a vac chamber though keeps me away from it. I've done well with QWET over the years although it takes days for me to go start to finish.

Yeah, QWET can be a process but in the grand scheme of things it is the easiest for sure.

You don't necessarily need a vac chamber, although it makes things easier and they can be had for $100-150. Definitely something to look into if you make bho often.

The butane can be removed just sitting out so long as your slab is slim enough to allow for the entire surface area of the slab to be exposed to air, however this takes days and requires the slab be flipped every 12-24 hours.. the slab also has to be as flat as possible. If the slab is too thick then you won't have even coverage and not all the butane will be able to evaporate.

You can also winterize it. just blast bho as normal, let it evaporate like normal until its the goop we typically vacuum purge. Instead of purging it with a vacuum we use alcohol. I use 30-50ml of 95% Everclear (heated to 110F) per 1 gram of wax. When the wax has fully dissolved into the Everclear you freeze it for 48 hours and then strain it through coffee filters. Make sure to strain it in the freezer because if the solution rises above freezing temps the waxes and lipids will just go back into your product and you won't have an absolute at that point.

Once your absolute is strained of the waxes and lipids and so forth you just evaporate on a pyrex dish as normal. The result is pretty much always shatter.

 

[ChaosHunter]

Yeah, QWET can be a process but in the grand scheme of things it is the easiest for sure.

You don't necessarily need a vac chamber, although it makes things easier and they can be had for $100-150. Definitely something to look into if you make bho often.

The butane can be removed just sitting out so long as your slab is slim enough to allow for the entire surface area of the slab to be exposed to air, however this takes days and requires the slab be flipped every 12-24 hours.. the slab also has to be as flat as possible. If the slab is too thick then you won't have even coverage and not all the butane will be able to evaporate.

You can also winterize it. just blast bho as normal, let it evaporate like normal until its the goop we typically vacuum purge. Instead of purging it with a vacuum we use alcohol. I use 30-50ml of 95% Everclear (heated to 110F) per 1 gram of wax. When the wax has fully dissolved into the Everclear you freeze it for 48 hours and then strain it through coffee filters. Make sure to strain it in the freezer because if the solution rises above freezing temps the waxes and lipids will just go back into your product and you won't have an absolute at that point.

Once your absolute is strained of the waxes and lipids and so forth you just evaporate on a pyrex dish as normal. The result is pretty much always shatter.

@kratos015 the winterizing is a step I do with my QWET, I do a course strain and then overnight the solution in the deep freeze. The next day I filter it before drying at 110.

 

[kratos015]

@kratos015 the winterizing is a step I do with my QWET, I do a course strain and then overnight the solution in the deep freeze. The next day I filter it before drying at 110.

Ohh gotcha, forgive my assumptions! Sounds like you've already got a pretty solid tech going on and that will definitely give you the most economical performance in yield and quality.

Organic bubble has is the tastiest thing ever but the yields are so small that its hard to justify unless I'm doing outdoor. I love full melt bubble but not enough to put up with 5-10% yields xD

 

[Fadedawg]

When considering small scale operations, with the least possible investment in equipment, and the greatest possible safety margin, I look at GRAS solvents (Generally Regarded As Safe). That leads me to Propane, Butane, and Ethanol.

To perform museum quality extractions with Propane and Butane, requires addressing Mystery Oil, which means Reagent grade Propane and/or Butane blends, or the equipment to pre-distill the LPG before extracting with it.

It also presents one of the highest hazard indexes of all the extraction methods, because of its high flammability and explosive potential, especially when open blasting to minimize investment in equipment.

Given the rash of residential explosions legislators are also trying to get a handle on and I predict closer scrutiny and control of all forms of LPG.

190 Proof ethanol is not cheap because of tax burden, but works right out of the jug and isn't pernicious if the residuals are above the 5000 ppm limits for FDA Class III solvents.

As the human sensory threshold is significantly below 5000ppm, you can detect its presence by simple taste and smell, even if you don't have a Gas Chromatograph.

It is a polar solvent, so not nearly as forgiving as LPG when it comes to things like water, water solubles, and C-55 chlorophyll, but more effective extracting C-22 polar carboxylic acids and less prone to extract beige C-30 non polar plant waxes, C-40 yellow/red beta carotene, and C-55 olive brown pheophytin.

Freezing to tie up the water and water solubles ostensibly reduces C-15 flavonoid pickup, because they are water soluble, but also ties up the chlorophyll and pheophytin locked in by frozen water soluble chlorophyll binding proteins.

My first cannabis extraction was Green Lizard, followed by refluxed chlorophyll soup, followed by refluxing bubble, followed by BHO open blasting. I subsequently picked up QWET as a way to get a higher yield for formulating chlorophyll free cancer meds, but when vaporizing became popular it was a natural.

Here are some shots of my first QWET extraction before removing the alcohol.

 

[hyroot]

 

[cannetix Inc]

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HAHAHAHA. If you're claiming there any risk involved with spraying butane OUTDOORS, you obviously lack a clear understanding of how combustion works, no offense. Nice memes though.

In order for an explosion to occur in open-air, there has to be a strong oxidizer present. The combination of a strong oxidizer with a fuel is called a high-explosive; the resulting 'explosion' happens at supersonic speeds and is more technically referred to as a detonation. Such a detonation is impossible with a flammable gas like butane. Explosion risk with flammable liquids/vapors like butane, propane etc. tends to come in the form of something called a Boiling Liquid Expanding Vapour Explosion or 'BLEVE', which requires a pressurized vessel. The extraction chamber used to run BHO cannot act as this pressurized vessel because it is not sealed. Even if ignition occurs, the result will be a fire that is extinguishable by smothering the pyrex dish. The liquid butane present in the dish will not explode, it will burn on the surface as it releases vapor, just like any liquid fuel such as Gasoline would. Please educate yourself.

Running butane INDOORS is different because if ignition occurs, the pressure wave will cause pressure inside the enclosed space to build resulting in a BLEVE-like explosion. Please show me one news report of someone blowing themselves up running butane OUTDOORS and I will rescind my statements but do date 100% of the reports I have seen have all been indoors.

Every time I finish a run, I always take a lighter to the end of my extraction vessel to burn off the butane left inside. It burns for a long time, much like a torch, but there is no risk of explosion because the pressure inside the open-ended vessel cannot reach levels anywhere near high enough. I'll post a video sometime.

Rosin sucks IMO, it's much higher in plant waxes and sugar and certainly isnt economical with the yield it gives you. At that point, you may as well just do ice water extraction.

 

[cannetix Inc]

By the time I :
overnight deep freeze the dry
overnight deep freeze the strained
then filter to evaporate
It takes a couple of days

I would like to try BHO just to say I tried it to compare I just don't want to invest in vac equipment etc. Thank you for the idea above and that's doable ! Anywhere to source the screen locally ?

I would try a home hardware store, you can often find fine stainless steel mesh there for window screening. Make sure its, not the nylon stuff, though. As long as its fine enough to give you good quality dry sift it will work for the previously described method so you can always test it out if you're not sure!

 

[hyroot]

If you're open blasting at all you're about as sharp as a marble. It can still blow up in your face.

First off you need to distill the butane before using. Then use a closed loop system and a dry ice chamber for dewaxing. Purge in a vac oven for a few days. Lab tests should come back at zero ppm's.

 

[kratos015]

If you're open blasting at all you're about as sharp as a marble. It can still blow up in your face.

First off you need to distill the butane before using. Then use a closed loop system and a dry ice chamber for dewaxing. Purge in a vac oven for a few days. Lab tests should come back at zero ppm's.

No need to hurl insults at someone just for asking a question my man..

While I won't argue (or rather, cant, obviously) the points you made above in regards to making BHO 100% safe, the OP was asking for the most economical way and had elaborated that he runs QWET and it was determined that is the most economical way for him to extract as it's much cheaper to grab some 95% everclear and mason jars as opposed a case of butane and an extraction tube, both of which provide greater yields than full melt in my experience. While I love me some full melt, if I only had an ounce of material to run I'd look into QWET/BHO over bags/sift. Bags or screens will run you $50 minimum, where as extraction tubes can be had for $7-$25 depending on size.

There are a plethora of things that could be potentially dangerous if precautions aren't taken, this isn't something that is exclusive to open blasting. Without any sources of ignition and the ventilation that the outdoors tends to provide I have never had an issue in the last 5 or so years. My old woodworking boss told me that 25% of people in that profession end up losing at least a finger, however due to his diligence with safety and being constantly alert and cautious he hasn't been one of those 25% in the 30 years he's been working with saws. I work with a guy who's been a butcher for over 20 years now, he's nicked himself with knives more often than he can even count and almost lost his finger to the band saw. Some people use chainsaws but you won't ever fucking see me being one of them! Accidents typically only happen due to carelessness and/or neglect.

You're usually a very polite and informative poster, not sure what upset you but I hope everything is alright.

 

[Jedb]

25% of woodworking people end up losing a finger? yikes that's terrifying... and yes, agree that bho can be very dangerous, but of course, some people seem to have made it work. YMMV...

 

[GuyLeDuche]

My vote goes to Rosin. Grab a hair iron for $4 at your local thrift shop and a $3 roll of reynold's parchment. If you're a big spender drop $25 more on a bench vise to smash it in. From there get creative, make something cool. This cost me under $50 and has pressed many pounds of bud

 

[macsnax]

My vote goes to Rosin. Grab a hair iron for $4 at your local thrift shop and a $3 roll of reynold's parchment. If you're a big spender drop $25 more on a bench vise to smash it in. From there get creative, make something cool. This cost me under $50 and has pressed many pounds of bud View attachment 4037070

Care to explain your plates and heating element on that? I've pondered doing this with my vise in the garage.