I'm in the mood to abuse my plant

Xs121

Well-Known Member
man im reading this as if you were a dog meat butcher and you were trying to convince me that torturing the dog before you slaughter it made the meat taste better.
I'm not trying to convince anybody...it's an experiment. Why do you guys assume that it's my intention to convince. Either you agree or not it's entirely up to you. I'm just sharing my experiment...what is hard about that?

This is the kind of post that is meaningless and idiotic.
 

Xs121

Well-Known Member
I started this thread with humor and hopefully we can discuss this process intelligently. What I didnt expect is to see a bunch of Kings in here.

FYI, you're no better than me nor I'm better than you. If you cant discuss this process intelligently without resulting to crudeness and hostility...I refuse to answer any post.

I will come back to this thread and post the final result....good or bad

Meanwhile post on your insults and hostility.

:peace:
 

vostok

Well-Known Member
Spam?

Dude are you the post police or something? Chill man.

If you want it to be a serious posting....how about this....I'm defoliating my plant which is about maybe 6-7 weeks into flower and wants your expert opinion(you seem to be the expert here) if this technique would work or not.

Now add something constructive.

:peace:
Ahh so this is you attempt at humor: not funny! .. maybe this is...?



If these inhibitor-laden leaves are removed, the plant will proceed to flower, and maturation will be accelerated. Large leaves shade the inner portions of the plant, and small atrophied floral clusters may begin to develop if they receive more light.
In actuality, few if any of the theories behind defoilatin or de-leafing give any indication of validity. Indeed, leafing possibly serves to defeat its original purpose. Large leaves have a definite function in the growth and development of Cannabis. Large leaves serve as photosynthetic factories for the production of sugars and other necessary growth sub-stances. They also create shade, but at the same time they are collecting valuable solar energy and producing foods that will be used during the floral development of the plant.

Premature removal of leaves may cause stunting, because the potential for photosynthesis is reduced. As these leaves age and lose their ability to carry on photo-synthesis they turn chloro tie (yellow) and fall to the ground. In humid areas care is taken to remove the yellow or brown leaves, because they might invite attack by fungus.

During chlorosis the plant breaks down substances, such as chlorophylls, and translocates the molecular components to a new growing part of the plant, such as the flowers. Most Cannabis plants begin to lose their larger leaves when they enter the flowering stage, and this trend continues until senescence. It is more efficient for the plant to reuse the energy and various molecular components of existing chlorophyll than to synthesize new chlorophyll at the time of flowering. During flowering this energy is needed to form floral clusters and ripen seeds.

Removing large amounts of leaves will interfere with the metabolic balance of the plant. If this metabolic change occurs too late in the season it could interfere with floral development and delay maturation. If any floral inhibitors are removed, the intended effect of accelerating flowering will be counteracted by metabolic upset in the plant.

Removal of shade leaves does facilitate more light reaching the center of the plant, but if there is not enough food energy produced in the leaves, the small internal floral clusters will not grow any larger. Leaf removal may also cause sex reversal resulting from a metabolic change.

(https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/Entry/de-leaf-or-not.30156/)
 

vostok

Well-Known Member

click image for the above book in pdf

currently reading
Cannabis: Evolution and Ethnobotany is a comprehensive, interdisciplinary exploration of the natural origins and early evolution of this famous plant, highlighting its historic role in the development of human societies. Cannabis has long been prized for the strong and durable fiber in its stalks, its edible and oil-rich seeds, and the psychoactive and medicinal compounds produced by its female flowers. The culturally valuable and often irreplaceable goods derived from cannabis deeply influenced the commercial, medical, ritual, and religious practices of cultures throughout the ages, and human desire for these commodities directed the evolution of the plant toward its contemporary varieties. As interest in cannabis grows and public debate over its many uses rises, this book will help us understand why humanity continues to rely on this plant and adapts it to suit our needs.

both excellent reading

good luck
 

Chunky Stool

Well-Known Member
Hmm... now that you mention it, Mrs. Stool found an article that said defoliating brussels sprouts helps yield, so we're going to try it. Yesterday I took a serrated kitchen knife & cut off most of the lower growth. Basically, anything that didn't get direct sunlight got chopped.
In hindsight, I should have left a few of them alone for a side-by-side test.
Fuck. :dunce:
Gotta say, a sharp serrated knife was the perfect tool for this job. It took less than 5 mins to defoliate this section of brussel sprouts.
This morning Mrs. Stool reminded me that I still haven't cleaned up the mess & I gave my standard reply:
"If it bothers you, don't look at it".

:eyesmoke:
IMG_1099.jpg
 

Chunky Stool

Well-Known Member
Ahh so this is you attempt at humor: not funny! .. maybe this is...?



If these inhibitor-laden leaves are removed, the plant will proceed to flower, and maturation will be accelerated. Large leaves shade the inner portions of the plant, and small atrophied floral clusters may begin to develop if they receive more light.
In actuality, few if any of the theories behind defoilatin or de-leafing give any indication of validity. Indeed, leafing possibly serves to defeat its original purpose. Large leaves have a definite function in the growth and development of Cannabis. Large leaves serve as photosynthetic factories for the production of sugars and other necessary growth sub-stances. They also create shade, but at the same time they are collecting valuable solar energy and producing foods that will be used during the floral development of the plant.

Premature removal of leaves may cause stunting, because the potential for photosynthesis is reduced. As these leaves age and lose their ability to carry on photo-synthesis they turn chloro tie (yellow) and fall to the ground. In humid areas care is taken to remove the yellow or brown leaves, because they might invite attack by fungus.

During chlorosis the plant breaks down substances, such as chlorophylls, and translocates the molecular components to a new growing part of the plant, such as the flowers. Most Cannabis plants begin to lose their larger leaves when they enter the flowering stage, and this trend continues until senescence. It is more efficient for the plant to reuse the energy and various molecular components of existing chlorophyll than to synthesize new chlorophyll at the time of flowering. During flowering this energy is needed to form floral clusters and ripen seeds.

Removing large amounts of leaves will interfere with the metabolic balance of the plant. If this metabolic change occurs too late in the season it could interfere with floral development and delay maturation. If any floral inhibitors are removed, the intended effect of accelerating flowering will be counteracted by metabolic upset in the plant.

Removal of shade leaves does facilitate more light reaching the center of the plant, but if there is not enough food energy produced in the leaves, the small internal floral clusters will not grow any larger. Leaf removal may also cause sex reversal resulting from a metabolic change.

(https://www.rollitup.org/Journal/Entry/de-leaf-or-not.30156/)
I agree with most of this, but I had three plants that had green fan leaves right to the end.
Six other plants started to fade almost immediately after starting to flower.
Exact same soil mix & supplements (mostly nutrient teas).
The only difference was strain.
 

KryptoBud

Well-Known Member
I started this thread with humor and hopefully we can discuss this process intelligently. What I didnt expect is to see a bunch of Kings in here.

FYI, you're no better than me nor I'm better than you. If you cant discuss this process intelligently without resulting to crudeness and hostility...I refuse to answer any post.

I will come back to this thread and post the final result....good or bad

Meanwhile post on your insults and hostility.

:peace:
Good luck with your experiments. If you have the time and space to do a legit side by side with clones and everything equal post your results. I don't think I've ever seen it done before, it's talked about a lot but never proven to increase anything but peoples blood pressure.
 

whitebb2727

Well-Known Member
Good luck with your experiments. If you have the time and space to do a legit side by side with clones and everything equal post your results. I don't think I've ever seen it done before, it's talked about a lot but never proven to increase anything but peoples blood pressure.
Oh I encourage someone to try new things. I've tried a lot of stuff, some of it silly, just to see if it works.

I don't doubt a bit of trimming here or there increases yield. I mean you can the lower limbs off early flower. It will put that energy into the upper buds. May not yield more but it will be close and less trimming. Pruning or removing suckers it is helpful on some plants or trees.

I just refuse to believe that cutting every fan leaf will yield more. Sugar leaves just aren't as efficient at using light.
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Who the hell are you to tell me to stop coming back here and stop posting my experiments?
The guy with over 40 years of growing. The guy who has sat here and watched "experiment after experiment" in defoliation, never finish because the poster quit when he found his defoliation was failing....I have no responsibility to anyone to post a list of failed experiments so they don't stick their neck out and be ridiculed. All you had to do was search defoliation here. Go find it yourself. It was your neck you stuck out.

Forget about the "I don't respect you any more" grade school BS.I don't give 2 shits what you think of me.
You can experiment all you want. Don't you think you could have looked it up and found it out before harming your final quality? Right now I am doing a cpl of experiments.
#1: Trying variations on a micro nutrient formula that will raise THC or CBD levels. All in soil and buy supplementation or soil build. (several of us have been discussing the hydro application of this idea also - here, in this site)
#2: Cloning different strains by simply putting them in willow water and storing in ambient light. No dip, no root riot, or tray, No "spray cloner", no direct lighting...... By far the most strains will root and not turn yellow or feed on it's self. Resulting in stronger faster growing clones. Kinda been doing this for a while. Actually doing it this way for several strains that had a bit of difficulty the traditional way.
Got notes on plenty of others over the years too.
Do you read papers about any experiments before the result has been found? If you didn't want to be open to ridicule, then just why did you post it before you knew what would happen?

While you think you may have had a new twist on an old idea. It's not really. It's failed before.

Like whitebb2727 said;
Ummmm. The reason you keep hearing it is because its basic botany.

Leaves grow plants.
Will the plant attempt to finish faster? Yes but, not by enough to make the amount of end result lost to be worth it!

That was a really nice looking plant! I would have been more excited by what I could have done to get it closer to potentials! Defoliation does not allow for reaching potentials.

Striving to grow for potential. Should be the real goal of all growing. Short cuts tend to hurt that goal.
I never worry about making it happen faster.
It'll get there, and by allowing it to do it it's self, in it's own time. Gives far better results.
BTW, The more stress you introduce to the blooming plant, especially that late. Will increase the chances of bisexual response..... OH, oh, Botany again....


So, you opened the door to this.
I stuck my foot in and gave answer.
I hurt your feelings. Sorry but, you could have prevented it.
Now you try and pass the buck on to me? You go look it up! I'm not looking it up for you!
That was and is, your job.
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Your reason is valid... you try to prevent diseases, specially outdoor. I grow indoor, our environment is somewhat different. I do understand the relationship of source and sink and yes I agree with you that leaves are producers of sugar or glucose. But come a time that leaves losses their photosynthetic efficiency, specially mature leaves. There's a bell curve, in their production of sugar.

Lastly, we're not talking here of leaving the plant totally bald. I've estimated that the mass of leaves I've left is sufficient enough to provide the necessary sugar for the plant to be healthy and hopefully productive yield.
How? Green till their done or you didn't feed properly.....
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
That study was for tamtoes. It also stated that the highest yield was with 3 leaves removed and after that it hurt yield.

I'm not even sure a tomato study would apply to cannabis.
BINGO THAT!

You can not compare Tomato's and Cannabis..
I even dislike when someone say's "Grow it like a tomato". No, don't. They require 2 different feed values. Treat it like a tropical...A fussy tropical.
 

Chunky Stool

Well-Known Member
BINGO THAT!

You can not compare Tomato's and Cannabis..
I even dislike when someone say's "Grow it like a tomato". No, don't. They require 2 different feed values. Treat it like a tropical...A fussy tropical.
Yes indeed!
Tomatoes are calcium hogs, but cannabis loves magnesium. Give your herbs too much calcium & they won't ripen the way they should. (PH?)
 

Xs121

Well-Known Member
Drinking coffee and enjoying my cheese danish and reading all the talented responds of the geniuses here.

Hmmmmm....very entertaining :clap:
 

Xs121

Well-Known Member
It's actually cool...I think......I've never been in a small pool full of blood thirsty sharks :lol:
 

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
It's actually cool...I think......I've never been in a small pool full of blood thirsty sharks :lol:
Their just trying to help.

Every week someone posts a defoliating thread.....Anyone who has a plant education, tertiary or self taught, knows that there is stoner myths and botany science.

Humans have been cultivating it for thousands of years, not much new in basic growing. Even the willow water Dr Who is doing is not new. I'm not sure if science has done anything but its widey used by gardeners and again probably has been for 1000s of years.
 
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