Will You Take The Vaccine?

Are you going to take the corona virus vaccine?

  • No.

  • Yes.


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shimbob

Well-Known Member
"About a month ago, I was talking to a pretty senior Hill aide on the Republican side. Vaccinated, everybody in his shop was vaccinated. I said, 'What is the deal, why are you doing is this? It's your own constituency you're killing.'
"And he said they just want to make Biden look bad. They want the crisis to happen on Biden's watch so that he does not get the credit for the vaccine that they felt Trump should get the credit for."

 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
It's a hot night here in the Cape, I was out on the front step talking to the neighbor from across the street. He's a nice 40 something guy who has swallowed the whole covid disinformation package from it's a hoax, to masks to vaccines, I was arguing with him for a bit, but there was little use. I heard it all in one short package, they had him programmed good and he and his family are delta victims waiting to happen. The fellow isn't too bright and is poorly educated, a typical disinformation victim, death for profit.

I told him about my Buddy Al passing away yesterday, he knew him too. I'm still torn up over Al and was making a useless effort to save a life. Anyway I'm gonna help him to build some grow lights this fall or winter and provide them for free, since I've got a lot of parts and drivers and I'm also retiring from growing.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Canada is not as vaxxed as Iceland and America is hardly vaxxed at all, considering what has begun and is about to happen. Maybe this is how the meek shall inherit the earth? :lol:
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Delta COVID Surge in Iceland Is Very Bad News for the U.S.

IF IT’S BAD THERE...
A surge of COVID cases in one of the world’s best-protected countries shows that initial herd immunity predictions may have been way too optimistic.

Iceland is one of the most vaccinated countries in the world. But that didn’t stop the tiny island nation from catching a whole lot of COVID in recent weeks.

Although the natural, immediate response to this news might be panic, experts who spoke to The Daily Beast said that Iceland’s recent surge in infections—fueled by the new Delta variant of the novel coronavirus—is probably a sign that herd immunity is within reach over there.

What’s happening in Iceland right now might be one of the final stages in the long, often painful process by which a country achieves some form of population-level “herd immunity” against a dangerous virus.

Once COVID vaccines hit the market early this year, Iceland quickly secured enough doses for almost everyone. And people dutifully lined up to get their shots. Today, the country has administered 477,000 doses and 275,000 people have gotten at least one jab—77 percent of the total population. Add in people with natural immunity from past infection, and it’s likely that more than 80 percent of Iceland has some level of protection.

The 20 percent of Icelanders who didn’t get vaccinated or haven’t already had COVID are the ones now catching Delta, with the exception of a few breakthrough cases of vaccinated people. (Children under 16, who aren’t yet eligible for vaccination, make up most of the unvaccinated group.) A couple thousand people have tested positive in recent weeks, a spike in cases far exceeding the worst weekly case-rates from 2020.

But hospitalizations have not surged to the same degree as cases in this latest Icelandic surge. That’s because older Icelanders, as a group, are highly vaccinated. Younger people, who as a group are less vaccinated, are the ones getting infected now. They have a better chance of weathering COVID without serious symptoms. And the antibodies and T-cells their immune systems are producing could represent the last—or close to last—brick in Iceland’s wall of immunity.


Now consider what happened in the United States while Iceland was working toward a minimally painful, population-level immunity.

Tragically, the U.S. is probably many, many months from achieving the same herd immunity. And as it does, the final surge—or surges—in infections could be much deadlier. That’s because Iceland has done almost everything right to get to herd immunity with the least possible pain. The United States, by contrast, has done almost everything wrong.

Iceland’s health department didn’t respond to requests for comment. Likewise, epidemiologists at Iceland’s biggest universities either didn’t respond or declined to comment. But American experts were eager to weigh in on what they described as an effective response to the pandemic. “This is a success story for Iceland,” Eric Bortz, a University of Alaska-Anchorage virologist and public health expert, told The Daily Beast.

To be clear, no one knows for sure what proportion of a population has to get vaccinated, or get infected and recover, before SARS-CoV-2 runs out of transmission pathways. In other words, no one knows exactly where herd immunity really begins. Epidemiologists once assumed that, with the novel coronavirus, it might take two-thirds of the population. New and more aggressive lineages that began appearing late last year convinced some experts to bump up their expectations. Maybe population-level immunity would require vaccination or natural immunity in three-quarters of people, they posited. Delta’s rapid spread starting this summer compelled some epidemiologists to revise their threshold estimates even higher.

“There is no question that the Delta variant has changed the goalposts,” Lawrence Gostin, a Georgetown University global health expert, told The Daily Beast.

Wherever the threshold is—80 percent, 90 percent, whatever—Iceland is much closer to crossing it than the United States is. Indeed, Iceland might be crossing that threshold right now. Bortz said Iceland, along with the United Kingdom, is one of the few countries where “a modicum of herd immunity against severe infection may be achievable” in the short term.

Getting there required discipline, sacrifice and mutual care on a national scale. When the pandemic first struck in the spring of 2020, the Icelandic government reacted swiftly. “Just letting the virus spread freely through society, no one said that,” explained Þórólfur Guðnason, the country’s chief epidemiologist. “We need to have some restrictions both at the border and domestically.”

Authorities limited travel to the rocky, volcanic country and got busy tracing contacts and quarantining exposed residents while also enforcing strong social-distancing measures. Mask-wearing was widespread and uncontroversial.

There were waves of infection, but they were never very bad. The first wave, in the spring of 2020, resulted in a few thousand confirmed cases. A second wave that fall added a few thousand more. Going into its third and most recent wave starting mid-July, the country had tallied around 7,000 cases (2 percent of the population) and just 30 deaths (.008 percent).

Meanwhile, while Iceland was locking down, Americans were taking to the streets to protest even the most modest social-distancing measures. Where Icelanders dutifully wore masks, right-wing media in the United States convinced millions of followers that masks were symbols of oppression.

Heading into this summer’s Delta surge, the United States had registered 34 million confirmed infections (10 percent of the population) and around 600,000 deaths (.18 percent). Cases and deaths were an order of magnitude worse in the U.S. than in Iceland.

As Iceland steadily vaccinated three-quarters of its people, the U.S. vaccination campaign started strong, then hit a wall of right-wing obstinance. The same misinformation-peddlers who castigated masks also conned millions of Americans—Southerners, Westerners and conservatives, mostly—into believing vaccines were part of some liberal plot.

Today, just 59 percent of the U.S. population has gotten at least one jab. The United States is sitting on tens of millions of unused doses of world-class vaccines while poorer, less privileged countries practically beg for access to shots.

Now, it’s true that tens of millions of Americans have caught COVID and recovered. Their antibodies and T-cells count toward herd immunity. But even taking into account widespread natural immunity still leaves somewhere in the vicinity of 100 million Americans—a third of the population—with zero immunity. No vaccine. No antibodies or T-cells. Nothing.

Icelanders are so highly vaxxed—and so open to the country’s ongoing vaccination campaign—that a few thousand cases, mostly mild, could push the population into herd immunity any day now.

Considering that as many as one in four American adults say they won’t ever get vaccinated, it could take millions of additional infections to get the U.S. through that same threshold. It’s anyone’s guess how long it will take for Delta or some future lineage to spread that widely, and how much damage it will do while getting there.

It’s possible, even likely, that most of those infections will be mild. But even a low rate of serious illness could kill thousands of Americans and leave thousands more with long-term complications—so-called “long COVID.”

“We have to be careful about what our expectations are with herd immunity,” Jeffrey Klausner, a former professor of medicine and public health at UCLA, told The Daily Beast.

And in the time it takes the United States to rack up the extra infections it needs to get to herd immunity, the novel-coronavirus could produce variants—“lineages” is the scientific term—that are even more transmissible and virulent than Delta. It’s even possible some future lineage could partially evade the vaccines, thus imperiling vaccinated individuals alongside the unvaccinated.

“By allowing the virus to test a myriad of new variants in unvaccinated individuals, we may be naturally selecting the worst strains putting us all at risk—both in the U.S. and abroad,” Elias Sayour, a University of Florida professor of neurosurgery and pediatrics and director of the school’s Pediatric Cancer Immunotherapy Initiative, told The Daily Beast.

“We’re in trouble,” Bortz said. “The U.S. vaccination rate is nowhere near what is needed for broad immunity in the population, to limit the spread and consequences of [variant-of-concern] Delta and other COVID-19 variants.”

As Americans brace for another infectious fall, many of them might glance toward Iceland with envy. It wasn’t a foregone conclusion that the United States, despite possessing every material advantage, would fail so badly to build widespread immunity against the novel coronavirus.

It was possible to do better. Iceland is proving that.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Statistically speaking, a vaxxed 70 year old has much less chance of ending up in hospital from delta covid, than a 30 year old unvaxxed person. 40 years+ of advantage in two shots, the hospitals are full of the unvaxxed young and elderly, but not the vaxxed elderly, even with delta. Vaccination rates for seniors top 90% in many places for those 60 and older and only the ones who are immunocompromised or have underlying health issues get seriously ill. Some vaxxed people do get breakthrough infections, and they are probably the ones who'd be filling hospitals to overflowing if they weren't vaxxed.

Delta is so infectious it will likely become endemic and herd immunity might not be possible or it will require immunization, one way or another, of over 90%. I think the best we can do for now is vaxx everybody we can and turn it into something about as lethal as the flu, for the vaxxed. Other more virulent covid strains have a hard time competing with delta, it's contagion that wins Darwin's race, not virulence. Apparently the Epsilon variant is having trouble establishing a foot hold in America, it's being out competed for victims by delta.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
According to experts and insiders the vaccines will come out of EUA in as little as two weeks and IMHO it will cause vaxx rates in Canada to go up to 90% as younger working people and students are vaxxed, especially out west, or anywhere there are concentrations of younger folks.

In the States, the vaccines coming out of EUA might cause a major freak out on the right and among antivaxxers. IMHO mandates will impact America far more than Canada, private healthcare insurance won't pay for stupidity forever and many working Americans get their healthcare from employers. I believe this will increase the number of employers, schools and colleges mandating vaccines dramatically and some of these lunatics are gonna go violent. There could even be an increase in workplace shootings, as many of these dug in assholes face the jab or the axe. So far we've seen very high compliance with employer mandates, in the 98% range. The bitching and whining will be epic and on full display here via the many news posts, it will be quite the show, FREEDUMB!
 
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captainmorgan

Well-Known Member

captainmorgan

Well-Known Member
A Monday feel good story.


 

CatHedral

Well-Known Member
A Monday feel good story.


Imagine the eulogy I could give, but I need the Aramaic word for neener.
 

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Pay no attention to the pile of bodies.


i think i predicted Walmart parking lot pyres and we're not even in September.
 
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