Whoa whats going on with my little ladies!

So i ignored it but took note when i noticed this on one plant but now its happened to 3 and i have no idea what it is. It seems that the main growing stem just ceased and stopped growing(and the rest of the plant cant grow now). I did a ton of research and all i found was boron def that looks similar to this? Is that what it is and where do i find boron? or is this a pH problem im vegging under a 1000w thats 2ft from the plants and ive burned my plants in a previous grow and know that its not that.
I have rulled out nute burn because i feel i havent even used any of the GO line starter box and my plants are already 4weeks old. possibly not enough nutes?( ive gone full strengh only twice since germ and 1/4-1/2 strenght the remaining times.

Im really stuck on this so please! Any help is beyond appreciated PLEASE!!!


Bellow are two pictures that may help solve the mystery! Thank you Again
 

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doc111

Well-Known Member
So i ignored it but took note when i noticed this on one plant but now its happened to 3 and i have no idea what it is. It seems that the main growing stem just ceased and stopped growing(and the rest of the plant cant grow now). I did a ton of research and all i found was boron def that looks similar to this? Is that what it is and where do i find boron? or is this a pH problem im vegging under a 1000w thats 2ft from the plants and ive burned my plants in a previous grow and know that its not that.
I have rulled out nute burn because i feel i havent even used any of the GO line starter box and my plants are already 4weeks old. possibly not enough nutes?( ive gone full strengh only twice since germ and 1/4-1/2 strenght the remaining times.

Im really stuck on this so please! Any help is beyond appreciated PLEASE!!!


Bellow are two pictures that may help solve the mystery! Thank you Again
Boron deficiencies in cannabis are pretty rare. If you haven't been feeding it much, that COULD be your problem. I would probably give them a full strength feeding and see what happens. I don't even worry about identifying the specific deficiency anymore. I just feed them sparingly and if/when I see any signs of a deficiency I just give them a good feeding of a well balanced veg nute. :weed:
 
Boron deficiencies in cannabis are pretty rare. If you haven't been feeding it much, that COULD be your problem. I would probably give them a full strength feeding and see what happens. I don't even worry about identifying the specific deficiency anymore. I just feed them sparingly and if/when I see any signs of a deficiency I just give them a good feeding of a well balanced veg nute. :weed:
Thank you doc111! over watering could this be a sign as well possibly i let my pots dry out every other day possibly not enough time though(may need 2-3days)? any other ideas?
 

*BUDS

Well-Known Member
So i ignored it but took note when i noticed this on one plant but now its happened to 3 and i have no idea what it is. It seems that the main growing stem just ceased and stopped growing(and the rest of the plant cant grow now). I did a ton of research and all i found was boron def that looks similar to this? Is that what it is and where do i find boron? or is this a pH problem
im vegging under a 1000w thats 2ft from the plants and ive burned my plants
in a previous grow and know that its not that.
I have rulled out nute burn because i feel i havent even used any of the GO line starter box and my plants are already 4weeks old. possibly not enough nutes?( ive gone full strengh only twice since germ and 1/4-1/2 strenght the remaining times.

Im really stuck on this so please! Any help is beyond appreciated PLEASE!!!


Bellow are two pictures that may help solve the mystery! Thank you Again
Its heat stress from the light being too close. View attachment 1821091
 
Its heat stress from the light being too close. View attachment 1821091
So i just measured im 24-26inches from the tops of the plants, the lightbulb is not brand new either so it wouldnt be running at 100% anymore either. Temps in the tent have never gone over 86. ussually stays at 79-82degress. Humidity 50-60%. I just turned my ballast down to 75% and raised my hood 2inches. Hoping this well help my little friends out! Do you know if i can expect the growth to return to normal or will it just outgrow the effected area? thank you and i love your avatar mad funny!
 

mr.bond

Well-Known Member
Hey LostInTheWoods,

mr.bond here. so looking over your posts... in the pics on this thread, the new growth is a bit yellowed and has very small leaves, with some slight signs of curling. first, i'd rule out a couple of things.

boron deficiency - i'd peg this as highly unlikely considering you are growing in promix, which comes treated with micro nutrients.

excessive light - nope. in fact i usually keep my light even closer. even according to CaliGrower's chart, at 75% ballast output on a used 1000w, your plants in veg are only getting about 50% of the sun's PAR at the moment. heck even at 100% ballast output @ 26" youre still well below the sun's PAR (>75%)

pH issues - hmmm... im doubtful but its worth researching. when microbes eat organics the pH will rise a bit. since you havent been giving it full strength nutes, there might not be much of a pH rise, and the dolomite lime you have in there might be keeping the pH quite a bit low. when your soil dries up a bit, water until it starts to drain from the bottom. take a sample of that run-off and pH it, see where you are at. if it is a pH issue, it happened recently. the rest of your foilage looks quite green.

Nutrient issues - well you know im a fan of the GO line so i dont think this is it. although i would say its time to ramp up your nutrient schedule. use the GO Box feeding chart, and give it the works -- BioThrive Grow, BioWeed, BioRoot, Diamond Black, BioMarine, Ca/Mg. For now the feeding chart on the box should be fine, it is enough to cover all the bases without getting excessive.

Beneficials - if you want explosive root growth, and those organic compounds to be broken down, get moving on adding some beneficial bacteria/fungi to your soil mix. cheapest/quickest/most effective way to do it is to use that tea formula I linked you from Heisenberg. you can foilar spray a bit and also add some as a soil drench. this will jump start the roots if they are struggling. and also aid tremendously in water uptake, nutrient uptake, and disease resistance.

so yeah, your light is not too close. but light and heat are two different things. i think radiant heat exposure might be what is stunting your new growth. i didnt see anything about your veg light being cooled or having a hood, maybe it is but i didnt see it. 1000w lamps can put out quite a bit of radiant heat. for me it isnt much of an issue because my 1000w runs in an 8" vented hood with about 400cfm fan attached in a closed-loop config, however, without active cooling, the 1000w can easily hit 160F within 1 minute.

now im not saying that the heat issue is the definitive reason for your stunted growth, but it seems like that may be it. i have experienced similar stunting with new clones and high temps, and for me it was about a 7-10 day turnaround on recovery when put into a proper environment. some clones didnt recover, but you have a bit of a root base already so you should be ok. plus in the 2nd pic on this post, you see that one leaf thats curled over quite a bit, behind the new growth. that isnt typical for healthy growth. in my experience curling is usually due to temperature issues.

well thats all for now. ill wait to hear what your cooling situation is like for your veg lighting. even though you have reasonable ambient temps, those can raise drastically due to radiant heat exposure. let me know if you have any questions!

cheers
mr.bond
 
Hey LostInTheWoods,

mr.bond here. so looking over your posts... in the pics on this thread, the new growth is a bit yellowed and has very small leaves, with some slight signs of curling. first, i'd rule out a couple of things.

boron deficiency - i'd peg this as highly unlikely considering you are growing in promix, which comes treated with micro nutrients.

excessive light - nope. in fact i usually keep my light even closer. even according to CaliGrower's chart, at 75% ballast output on a used 1000w, your plants in veg are only getting about 50% of the sun's PAR at the moment. heck even at 100% ballast output @ 26" youre still well below the sun's PAR (>75%)

pH issues - hmmm... im doubtful but its worth researching. when microbes eat organics the pH will rise a bit. since you havent been giving it full strength nutes, there might not be much of a pH rise, and the dolomite lime you have in there might be keeping the pH quite a bit low. when your soil dries up a bit, water until it starts to drain from the bottom. take a sample of that run-off and pH it, see where you are at. if it is a pH issue, it happened recently. the rest of your foilage looks quite green.

Nutrient issues - well you know im a fan of the GO line so i dont think this is it. although i would say its time to ramp up your nutrient schedule. use the GO Box feeding chart, and give it the works -- BioThrive Grow, BioWeed, BioRoot, Diamond Black, BioMarine, Ca/Mg. For now the feeding chart on the box should be fine, it is enough to cover all the bases without getting excessive.

Beneficials - if you want explosive root growth, and those organic compounds to be broken down, get moving on adding some beneficial bacteria/fungi to your soil mix. cheapest/quickest/most effective way to do it is to use that tea formula I linked you from Heisenberg. you can foilar spray a bit and also add some as a soil drench. this will jump start the roots if they are struggling. and also aid tremendously in water uptake, nutrient uptake, and disease resistance.

so yeah, your light is not too close. but light and heat are two different things. i think radiant heat exposure might be what is stunting your new growth. i didnt see anything about your veg light being cooled or having a hood, maybe it is but i didnt see it. 1000w lamps can put out quite a bit of radiant heat. for me it isnt much of an issue because my 1000w runs in an 8" vented hood with about 400cfm fan attached in a closed-loop config, however, without active cooling, the 1000w can easily hit 160F within 1 minute.

now im not saying that the heat issue is the definitive reason for your stunted growth, but it seems like that may be it. i have experienced similar stunting with new clones and high temps, and for me it was about a 7-10 day turnaround on recovery when put into a proper environment. some clones didnt recover, but you have a bit of a root base already so you should be ok. plus in the 2nd pic on this post, you see that one leaf thats curled over quite a bit, behind the new growth. that isnt typical for healthy growth. in my experience curling is usually due to temperature issues.

well thats all for now. ill wait to hear what your cooling situation is like for your veg lighting. even though you have reasonable ambient temps, those can raise drastically due to radiant heat exposure. let me know if you have any questions!

cheers
mr.bond
MR. BOND,
If i could figure out how to give rep+ points you would get all i could give. THANK YOU!

https://www.rollitup.org/organics/469150-100-organic-soil-up-pics.html That is the link to my thread i have about my current set up. Please check it out if you have the time!

I currently have a 1000w in a 6in aircooled hood, with a 6in fan pulling thru a 8in CF. i would have gone 8in but my tent only allows 6in out. i havent noticed any temp issues or heat what so ever which is why i didnt understand the light burn answer. Im in there as much as possible and have never seen anything above 84. ussually sits nice at 75-80. Possibly humidity to high but it sits between 49-60 so that cant be it either.
Nut deficency and pH are honestly the only two possibilities i can think of. Nut def i say only because i lagit still have almost a full GO line(all containers full) which shouldnt be possible with nothing mixed into the soil and these things being 4 weeks old. there have been no def signs what so ever this whole time as you will see in the pics if you check the link. pH i just dont understand enough about in organics since this is my first run with Organics. i made sure my Dlime was in there and evenliy mixed in. IK i cant be pouring PH up and down into my mix so i havent been. ive been taking ppm,ph,temp,tds readings even though you are not supposed to before watering so i have that as well if it will help. Im waiting till tom to water so when i do that i will get some run off samples and test those. Should i use plain RO h20 for this or some nutes and just compare my in water reading to waster water?
Roots i did some upplanting not to long ago of some of them and they were all bright white and all over the place(strong not rootbound though). The go line recommends sub b+M so that has been in the mix too. also have only used maybe 2tsp out of each.
Maybe azamax to strong but i made sure not to make that potent! I have no idea i could ramble my thoughts out forever but i dont know, this suck:-?
Im honestly just lost on this one. I beyond appreciate this!
 
forgot to add this. my biggest issue is what to do now. should i cut the top effected growth off and kind of go with a topped plant thing or should i just leave it and see what happens. the thing that blows my mind is that it has only happened 4 of 25plants and at the same time. when everything gets the same water and nut mix when used. If i have to use 2 gallons its ussually a max of 10-20 ppm off of the other gallon. Thank you again!
 

mr.bond

Well-Known Member
youre welcome! its good that you are using the Sub-M/Sub-B in your soil mix. what to do now...

i'd say tomorrow give it a full strength feeding according to the GO Box chart, plus add some Diamond Black and BioMarine (those arent on the chart, use the directions on the bottle). use RO water if you have it (plus Ca/Mg), otherwise just use tap water. next time you have to water after feeding tomorrow, do a pH check of the run-off. if youre feeling frisky, you could also start a batch of tea for the girls, it would be done in 48 hours and should help the roots, which will help the new growth and rest of the plant. you could just use the Sub-M & Sub-B you have as your brew ingredients, along with molasses. do not top the plant unless you were already planning on topping it. plus topping it right now may put them into even more stress, could hermie. you said this happened to 4 of your 25 plants. are they all the same strain of seeds?

other than that stuff, give it a few days... seeing your setup im not really convinced it was radiant heat but you never know. if your hood fan was off for an hour while your light was on, that could be enough to stunt the new growth. i dont have much experience with azamax but it shouldnt be a problem.

cheers mate, keep us posted on the progress!
mr.bond
 
youre welcome! its good that you are using the Sub-M/Sub-B in your soil mix. what to do now...

i'd say tomorrow give it a full strength feeding according to the GO Box chart, plus add some Diamond Black and BioMarine (those arent on the chart, use the directions on the bottle). use RO water if you have it (plus Ca/Mg), otherwise just use tap water. next time you have to water after feeding tomorrow, do a pH check of the run-off. if youre feeling frisky, you could also start a batch of tea for the girls, it would be done in 48 hours and should help the roots, which will help the new growth and rest of the plant. you could just use the Sub-M & Sub-B you have as your brew ingredients, along with molasses. do not top the plant unless you were already planning on topping it. plus topping it right now may put them into even more stress, could hermie. you said this happened to 4 of your 25 plants. are they all the same strain of seeds?

other than that stuff, give it a few days... seeing your setup im not really convinced it was radiant heat but you never know. if your hood fan was off for an hour while your light was on, that could be enough to stunt the new growth. i dont have much experience with azamax but it shouldnt be a problem.

cheers mate, keep us posted on the progress!
mr.bond
So i gota do the brakes on my car first which works cause then the plants have a little bit longer to dry out. Full strenght will be used today(ro line+dB+marine all at the same time ISNT that too much?).
I do have RO h20 right now which i have also been letting sit out for 24hrs before using to water.(also have fish tank drops to reduce chlorine/cholramine because im not sure which of the two i have in my h20 and ik the chloramine doesnt get removed unless u have a special filter for it or use molasses as stated above or i have seen many people recommend the drops too.
The seeds i have used for this were just a bunch of random no name seeds i have come accross the last few months. Needed something to start right away before i ordered my genetics and spent money on it. Within the next day or two i will most likely be ordering those though. i went ahead and snapped a couple more pics this morning. Just still blows my mind 4 would randomly do this at the same time while the others are all completly fine.
Thank you for taking the time again MR Bond!
 
The update. i moved all the effected off to the right and grouped them together. So 5 are effected i miss counted before and i still have 25 that are doing well. as said full nutes today and well see where it goes!
 

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elduece

Active Member
So i ignored it but took note when i noticed this on one plant but now its happened to 3 and i have no idea what it is. It seems that the main growing stem just ceased and stopped growing(and the rest of the plant cant grow now). I did a ton of research and all i found was boron def that looks similar to this? Is that what it is and where do i find boron? or is this a pH problem im vegging under a 1000w thats 2ft from the plants and ive burned my plants in a previous grow and know that its not that.
I have rulled out nute burn because i feel i havent even used any of the GO line starter box and my plants are already 4weeks old. possibly not enough nutes?( ive gone full strengh only twice since germ and 1/4-1/2 strenght the remaining times.

Im really stuck on this so please! Any help is beyond appreciated PLEASE!!!


Bellow are two pictures that may help solve the mystery! Thank you Again
HIt the leaves with <=200 ppms of distilled water/bloom fert(with micronutes)/soaker(or better DM Saturator). The next set of leaves should grow normally.

Edit: That foliar mixture is my favorite "fix all" for these mutant causing deficiencies.
 

matthebrute

Well-Known Member
before you go getting all fancy thinking this and that, what size pots are you using? and how long have they been in them, MJ will grow massive root system fairly quick and if they get root bound they will stop growing, from the looks you need to transplant into bigger pots.

if you just transplanted them less than a week ago this probally isnt you issue but i would check it out, may just be root bound my friend and need some bigger pots to grow.
 
before you go getting all fancy thinking this and that, what size pots are you using? and how long have they been in them, MJ will grow massive root system fairly quick and if they get root bound they will stop growing, from the looks you need to transplant into bigger pots.

if you just transplanted them less than a week ago this probally isnt you issue but i would check it out, may just be root bound my friend and need some bigger pots to grow.
If you look at the first pic in that series i would agree with you two of them need to get upplanted but im not wasting soil on something that i should probably toss. all my plants were started at the same time and only few random ones have run into this problem(combonation of diffrent pot sizes). i water with the same water mixed the same mix into my soils. just stumped on this one!
 
HIt the leaves with <=200 ppms of distilled water/bloom fert(with micronutes)/soaker(or better DM Saturator). The next set of leaves should grow normally.

Edit: That foliar mixture is my favorite "fix all" for these mutant causing deficiencies.
Ive been seeing the DM saturator everywhere so its time i get some into the mix(do you have a link to a thread about just the product or know anything about it(is it organic)). Now my question and the reason i asked about topping was because now that the top growth is mutant is it going to be able to produce something new from that mutant growth. or would topping be a better idea to let the bottoms shoot up and take over the mutant growth.
 

elduece

Active Member
^^DM Saturator isn't "organic" by purist standards nor would it affect smoke quality. Just be assured that it's the best soaker in the market. Like I said, new growth thereafter should form normally.
 

snew

Well-Known Member
Thank you doc111! over watering could this be a sign as well possibly i let my pots dry out every other day possibly not enough time though(may need 2-3days)? any other ideas?
There are very few cases (inside) where watering every other day is needed. If you water every other day there is no "dry out". I keep a water meter around it helps keep me from over watering, however, being a chronic over water I use deep trays and bottom water which has eliminated over watering for the most part. The only time I top water is to feed, and thats rare.

But frankly I don't think I would feed treat, etc. until you address this. Keep it simple.
 

matthebrute

Well-Known Member
If you look at the first pic in that series i would agree with you two of them need to get upplanted but im not wasting soil on something that i should probably toss. all my plants were started at the same time and only few random ones have run into this problem(combonation of diffrent pot sizes). i water with the same water mixed the same mix into my soils. just stumped on this one!
then i would let em dry out like OP said and start over again with watering and nutes, they shouldnt have any deficincy at the size they are at, should be plenty for them in that soil if its a decent mix.
they will live in dry soil for a day or so

less is sometimes more.
gl on your prob man ill check back :)

ps. i wouldnt consider them a waste yet they look pretty good and your problem is reversable. keep poking at it you fig it out.
 
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