Voting Against Prop 19 means :

fdd2blk said:

i was offered a job there teaching. i did not like the way they ran things though. that and dick still owes me. i would never open myself up to be screwed by him twice.

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IDK bro, never met the man myself. I won't deny that he is behind 19 tho. BUT I will point out that his motivations and mine are not the same. I teach at a satellite campus in the north bay, and I LOVE it. The feedback is amazing. Plus, they pay great, but I only teach an hour or two a month. They don't pay my rent, in other words.

Matt Rize said:

IDK bro, never met the man myself. I won't deny that he is behind 19 tho. BUT I will point out that his motivations and mine are not the same. I teach at a satellite campus in the north bay, and I LOVE it. The feedback is amazing. Plus, they pay great, but I only teach an hour or two a month. They don't pay my rent, in other words.

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i'm well aware of what they pay.

Looks like this thread went off into the weeds...

For what it's worth - think of it this way: if we pass 19, CA will be a magnet for stoners, and we'll have a much better chance of passing a more permissive measure in 2012.

The corn analogy is stupid - look at alcohol. Has alcohol been legalized? In a sense, yes, but it is still regulated. Expect the same treatment for mj. We'll end the destructive prohibition on it, but we'll never let it be truly free. However, like alcohol, I'd expect you'll eventually be free to make as much as you want, provided you don't piss off the wrong people. So it is in the great US of A.

mrFancyPlants said:

Looks like this thread went off into the weeds...

For what it's worth - think of it this way: if we pass 19, CA will be a magnet for stoners, and we'll have a much better chance of passing a more permissive measure in 2012.

The corn analogy is stupid - look at alcohol. Has alcohol been legalized? In a sense, yes, but it is still regulated. Expect the same treatment for mj. We'll end the destructive prohibition on it, but we'll never let it be truly free. However, like alcohol, I'd expect you'll eventually be free to make as much as you want, provided you don't piss off the wrong people. So it is in the great US of A.

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Thanks for getting us back on track.

mrFancyPlants said:

Looks like this thread went off into the weeds...

For what it's worth - think of it this way: if we pass 19, CA will be a magnet for stoners, and we'll have a much better chance of passing a more permissive measure in 2012.

The corn analogy is stupid - look at alcohol. Has alcohol been legalized? In a sense, yes, but it is still regulated. Expect the same treatment for mj. We'll end the destructive prohibition on it, but we'll never let it be truly free. However, like alcohol, I'd expect you'll eventually be free to make as much as you want, provided you don't piss off the wrong people. So it is in the great US of A.

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My father grows 3/4 of an acre of grapes tax free and he is a old portugese and a avid wine maker he built some costem equitmet and alsow bought some other equitment that he uses to make wine.There is no restrictions on how much grapes he can grow or even how much wine he can make or have at anytime.Every year we make about 300-400 gallons of wine.My father is 72 years old and we have been doing this since 1993. Alcohol is way less restricted then what prop 19 preposes for mj.

Needofweed said:

My father grows 3/4 of an acre of grapes tax free and he is a old portugese and a avid wine maker he built some costem equitmet and alsow bought some other equitment that he uses to make wine.There is no restrictions on how much grapes he can grow or even how much wine he can make or have at anytime.Every year we make about 300-400 gallons of wine.My father is 72 years old and we have been doing this since 1993. Alcohol is way less restricted then what prop 19 preposes for mj.

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I suppose that depends on the math. 300-400 gallons of wholesale wine is worth 5 to 15 dollars a gallon: http://www.walkersfruitbasket.com/Retail Prices.html

That comes up to maximum of $2,000 to $6,000 of wine that he is making. Not much in the Canna-world.

fuk that one OZ at a time shit..there doing that so they can make more money and bust people who get caught with more..HHEELLLOOOO this is a growing site right?? u guys pull more then one OZ off your plants at a time right?? am i missing something.???? i buy 4-8oz at a time cuz it saves me money but if prop 19 passes im going to have to pay 225-300 an OZ or so..FUK THAT and i dont like the fact that there ganna retire (for lack of a better word) certain strains

Taken from wiki

According to the State of California analysis, the bill will have the following effects.[6]
[edit] Legalization of personal marijuana-related activities

Persons age 21 and older:

• May possess up to 1 ounce (28 g) of marijuana for personal consumption. >>>FUK THAT
  
• May use marijuana in a non-public place such as a residence or a public establishment licensed for on site marijuana consumption.
• May grow marijuana at a private residence in a space of up to 25 square feet (2.3 m2) for personal use. BUT YOU CAN ONLY POSSES ONE OZ (28g) at a time SO GROW SMALL PLANTS>>FUK THAT 2

NO ON PROP 19 till someone can make me think otherwise cuz most of the stuff i read was bs and ego's talking..u guys dont know how county's are ganna fuk u over obviously..the taxes will be so expensive only tobacco companies will be the one's growing big..say goodbye to ur gardens rollitup..and hello to ur one plant with one oz on it

if 19 passes, employers can no longer guarantee a drug free work place. without a guaranteed drug free work environment california stands to loose billions in federal grant money( the feds dont pay if the drug free standard isnt imposed.) which means California based companies would no longer be eligible for federal contracts. this would impact our debt and economy in a very significant and negative way. it is true that the taxation and regulation of marijuana would generate billions in revenue for the state annually, however when the surprisingly high costs of regulation gets factored in, i'm not sure it any longer would generate revenue to exceed the federal grant money we currently enjoy. this federal money helps to pay teachers, civil servants, construction industries, and generally provides funding for "mainline" efforts of the common good. Also it could be assumed that regulation is where they will push home-growers out and it will be the high costs of regulation that allows their monopoly. Check out the U.S farm bill if you want an idea of how u.s regulation works to fuck over the small AMERICAN farmer. if 19 passes forget about bringing crop to market- you wont be able to afford the inspection costs, let alone the cost of strictly mandated production equipment; especially when corporate farms drop the price floor to $50 an ounce so only they can produce enough crop to turn a profit. if anything prop.19 will increase mafia activity on both sides of the law. who do you think big business turns to for investment prospects? PROP.19 does not end marijuana prohibition by a long shot- marijuana will remain federally illegal and nothing in prop.19 exempts a marijuana grower/dealer/user from federal prosecution. if we return to a conservative right wing regime after Obama, this whole house of cards comes tumbling down! (hope you didnt put your name on the list...terrorist!)

Vote no on prop 19 and stop the Richard Lees cashcow.

Look, do you really think 19 is going to make the price of weed rise above the current street level? If it did, people would just use the established underground networks(or create new ones) and the state wouldn't get their money.

I don't know what to say about federal grant money - I guess that's true but you've got to start somewhere. I seriously doubt the feds would fuck the most economically important state like that. We *are* the worlds.. 5th? biggest economy if you treat CA as a nation.

I grew for years without anyone noticing. I have a hard time believing prop 19 is going to change that. The practical effect is that law enforcement won't give a shit.

Also, I'm a med patient - and not for 'back pain' or some other horseshit(yes, lots of people with back pain use MMJ I'm just saying that it's a common excuse used to get a script). I can still grow and possess all I want. Do you think cops are going to carry around scales and weigh your shit if 19 passes?

Also... how are these supposed large commercial farms supposed to work if the delivery guy can't transport more than an ounce at a time?

The key to 19 is that it's better than what we have now, which is a 0 oz limit and 100% taxation for non-medical users.

look, if u dont know what ur taking about dont talk. The one oz law is for a person like u or me not commercial farmers they got laws they gotta follow to but not one OZ law lol cant even believe u said that so i had to say something..and i can legally have 8ounces on me at all times, thats my COUNTY law. If 19 passes i can only have a Oz and instead of buying 8oz at a time for 1600-1850 dollars im ganna have to buy an Oz a week or so and most likely the price will only drop if 19 passes by like 20-50 bucks an Oz

Cali.Grown>408 said:

look, if u dont know what ur taking about dont talk. The one oz law is for a person like u or me not commercial farmers they got laws they gotta follow to but not one OZ law lol cant even believe u said that so i had to say something..and i can legally have 8ounces on me at all times, thats my COUNTY law. If 19 passes i can only have a Oz and instead of buying 8oz at a time for 1600-1850 dollars im ganna have to buy an Oz a week or so and most likely the price will only drop if 19 passes by like 20-50 bucks an Oz

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Shit, sorry - it's been a while since I read it.

(l) such larger amounts as the local authority deems appropriate and proper under local circumstances, than those established under section 11300(a) for personal possession and cultivation, or under this section for commercial cultivation, processing, transportation and sale by persons authorized to do so under this section;

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So higher limits for possession by commercial growers.

Still don't understand why you're going to have to buy an oz at a time if you qualify as a patient. Can you explain that?

What's the 8oz limit from? Is that your county's medical limit? I hope ya know that the county limits are now only guidelines for law enforcement and not legal limits. If you're a med patient, with or without 19, you can have as much as you can prove you have a need for. You might have to go to court to explain it, but legally they can't limit what you need to medicate.

mrFancyPlants said:

Shit, sorry - it's been a while since I read it.



So higher limits for possession by commercial growers.

Still don't understand why you're going to have to buy an oz at a time if you qualify as a patient. Can you explain that?

What's the 8oz limit from? Is that your county's medical limit? I hope ya know that the county limits are now only guidelines for law enforcement and not legal limits. If you're a med patient, with or without 19, you can have as much as you can prove you have a need for. You might have to go to court to explain it, but legally they can't limit what you need to medicate.

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Yes to the first sentence about commercial growers.

Oz at a time doesnt apply to med patients...thats literally the only exception that 19 makes in regards to MMJ. They've reiterated this point countless times like MMJ patients should be happy about it...it makes no sense to say "hey, we're not going to restrict your possession limits as patients but...we are going to make it impossible for you to cultivate your own, or for your caregiver to cultivate"

The biggest issue for MMJ patients, IMO, is that ALL grows, unless commercial, will be subject to the 5x5 AND quite possibly to NEW taxes ALLOWED by 19.
Essentially 19 will make every garden larger than 5x5 ILLEGAL, and whether its "legal" or not it will also NOW be subject to new taxes because of all the REGULATION 19 has opened the door for....Read the section on taxes, they list a grip of "possible" taxes but no solid amounts - pretty much letting the counties decide how much EVERYONE pays, medical or not. And given the numbers that have been thrown around they look to be astronomical. Just look at Rancho Cordova.

Most dispensaries (the small ones) aren't very hip to 19 from what I have gathered...because 19 will more than likely put most of them out of business within a year. And that's fucked up for the patients....shame on these people....the major pro-19 players....

They are disgracing themselves en masse, and I for one will never support corporate weed knowing what the REAL cost has been.

Cali.Grown>408 said:

fuk that one OZ at a time shit..there doing that so they can make more money and bust people who get caught with more..HHEELLLOOOO this is a growing site right?? u guys pull more then one OZ off your plants at a time right?? am i missing something.???? i buy 4-8oz at a time cuz it saves me money but if prop 19 passes im going to have to pay 225-300 an OZ or so..FUK THAT and i dont like the fact that there ganna retire (for lack of a better word) certain strains

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Ehhh.... you can have as much marijuana as you want within the privacy of your own home.

You're only allowed to travel with 1 ounce of marijuana on your person. (Unless you are a prop 19 patient)

The Ruiner said:

Yes to the first sentence about commercial growers.

Oz at a time doesnt apply to med patients...thats literally the only exception that 19 makes in regards to MMJ. They've reiterated this point countless times like MMJ patients should be happy about it...it makes no sense to say "hey, we're not going to restrict your possession limits as patients but...we are going to make it impossible for you to cultivate your own, or for your caregiver to cultivate"

The biggest issue for MMJ patients, IMO, is that ALL grows, unless commercial, will be subject to the 5x5 AND quite possibly to NEW taxes ALLOWED by 19.
Essentially 19 will make every garden larger than 5x5 ILLEGAL, and whether its "legal" or not it will also NOW be subject to new taxes because of all the REGULATION 19 has opened the door for....Read the section on taxes, they list a grip of "possible" taxes but no solid amounts - pretty much letting the counties decide how much EVERYONE pays, medical or not. And given the numbers that have been thrown around they look to be astronomical. Just look at Rancho Cordova.

Most dispensaries (the small ones) aren't very hip to 19 from what I have gathered...because 19 will more than likely put most of them out of business within a year. And that's fucked up for the patients....shame on these people....the major pro-19 players....

They are disgracing themselves en masse, and I for one will never support corporate weed knowing what the REAL cost has been.

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Prop 215 grows are not subject to the same laws and regulations as Prop 19 grows. Even if they were ... if you can't grow tons of marijuana in a 25sft area (the equivalent of about 32 5 gallon buckets) you shouldn't be growing in the first place.

tc1 said:

Prop 215 grows are not subject to the same laws and regulations as Prop 19 grows. Even if they were ... if you can't grow tons of marijuana in a 25sft area (the equivalent of about 32 5 gallon buckets) you shouldn't be growing in the first place.

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You obviously have never grown Cannabis.

I currently provide meds to myself and three others. My garden is over 300 sq. ft. I need that space. If 19 passes, I'll find out where you live and take your crop, along with 10 other prop 19 supporters.

My wife's good health is far more precious to me than your life.

Your short sightedness and lack of understanding of the current system will cause you a lot of grief if you think you'll benefit from this bill.

If I'm forced to reduce my grow, I'll be spending whatever it takes to have this law overthrown.

It can't pass muster with the California Supreme Court. To many loopholes and deception is evident if you read Prop 19 and the Health and Safety codes as they are currently written.

This might require some literacy on your part. A difficult thing to find among prop 19 supporters.

tc1 said:

Ehhh.... you can have as much marijuana as you want within the privacy of your own home.

You're only allowed to travel with 1 ounce of marijuana on your person. (Unless you are a prop 19 patient)

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so they say..if it passes we'll have to see i guess..i just dont want them to make a big deal if i wanna grow 10-20 plants and right now i only have space for 1-6 but in the future i wanna do it bigger..what i read said u can POSSES one Oz (28g)..

veggiegardener said:

You obviously have never grown Cannabis.

I currently provide meds to myself and three others. My garden is over 300 sq. ft. I need that space. If 19 passes, I'll find out where you live and take your crop, along with 10 other prop 19 supporters.

My wife's good health is far more precious to me than your life.

Your short sightedness and lack of understanding of the current system will cause you a lot of grief if you think you'll benefit from this bill.

If I'm forced to reduce my grow, I'll be spending whatever it takes to have this law overthrown.

It can't pass muster with the California Supreme Court. To many loopholes and deception is evident if you read Prop 19 and the Health and Safety codes as they are currently written.

This might require some literacy on your part. A difficult thing to find among prop 19 supporters.

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Let me know Ill help you overthrow 19 all the way.