trayvan martin

UncleBuck said:

no, because in addition to fearing either death or great bodily harm, zimmerman must have exhausted all reasonable means to escape. that's not possible due to the location of the murder. and a bloody nose is by no means "great bodily harm", unless of course you are an apologist pussy for zimmerman.

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According to the police report Zimmer was bleeding from nose and head and the back of his shirt was wet. The eye witness account was that Trayvon was on top of Zimmer beating him, consistent with the police report. I don't know if Zimmer tried to escape but if he did he was not successful because he wound up on the ground under Trayvon. The law say nothing about a bloody nose, it only says, "...the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm...". I think I am a reasonable person and if I were being pummeled by a guy, I would reasonably believe that I was in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm.

That is a pretty strong defense in my opinion.

UncleBuck said:

too bad they collected absolutely ZERO evidence of this fact. all we have is the word of an obviously corrupt police force with a questionable history of treatment towards blacks.

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Yeah, let's see you argue that one in court in front of a jury. Pure speculation on your part and it would not be admissible.

RoninAmok said:

And said hypothetical beating would never have occured had Zimmerman followed standard procedures and protocols , right down to what the dispatcher was telling him..........


GAME SET MATCH........

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Probably true, but you are wrong about the GAME SET MATCH part. Read the law for which UB very helpfully provided a link, 776.041 2a gives Zimmer his walking papers.

Funny how Zimmerman was on his back when he shot Trayvon in the chest. Zimmerman was supposed to be directly underneath him. Why wasn't he covered in Trayvon's blood? The chest? Where the heart is? No blood? All that was wrong with Zimmerman was a bloody nose a scrape on the back of his head and grass stains. What about blood stains?

Keep defending the sorry bastard. Oh and the police chief was forced to step down by the city manager after pressure was put on the the city manager by the city council. The city manager said this himself during an interview.

Two female eyewitnesses stated that after the shooting Zimmerman stood over him with his foot planted in his back. Trayvon was face down. Didn't try any CPR or any means to resuscitate him. He just stood over him like a fucking hunter with a trophy. If Zimmerman shot him in the chest he would have to push Trayvon off. Why was he face down?

RoninAmok said:

And said hypothetical beating would never have occured had Zimmerman followed standard procedures and protocols , right down to what the dispatcher was telling him..........


GAME SET MATCH........

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procedures and protocols are not laws.

"we dont need you to do that" is not a lawful order .

the dispatcher never even said don't follow him she said "we don't need you to do that"

"Funny how Zimmerman was on his back when he shot Trayvon in the chest. Zimmerman was supposed to be directly underneath him. Why wasn't he covered in Trayvon's blood? The chest? Where the heart is? No blood? "

That is actually a pretty good point. Now you are thinking like a prosecutor.

cliffey501 said:

procedures and protocols are not laws.

"we dont need you to do that" is not a lawful order .

the dispatcher never even said don't follow him she said "we don't need you to do that"

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He said. The dispatcher was a man.

cliffey501 said:

Someones on top of you raining haymakers to your face while you scream for help isn't a threat of great bodily harm? how can you escape from your back? The beating stopped because of the bullet.

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you accuse others of jumping to conclusions, yet talk like it's a certainty that this was the case.

if zimmerman was getting beat so bad, there would be evidence of it. as it is, there is no evidence that zimmerman was assaulted at all. none.

not to mention, he has 100 pounds on the kid and had 360 degrees of open space around him to run away, if you believe this unfounded and ludicrous tale that this kid turned into the incredible hulk.

desert dude said:

Probably true, but you are wrong about the GAME SET MATCH part. Read the law for which UB very helpfully provided a link, 776.041 2a gives Zimmer his walking papers.

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I've read the law , I'm also (again) familar with the Sanford area , the PD in question and it's treatment of black citizens and the tensions between the black and latino communities.


Zimmer is free at the moment , I believe he will be indicted. The problem now being that since politicos had to just make convenient hay and slimeballs like Sharpton have felt it necessary to grab their share of the spotlight that indictment may be more politicaly driven than justice driven.

And therein lies part of that darker picture I spoke , a kid is dead and certain forces are exploiting his death as a convenient political ploy.


And that's just flat freaking disgusting right down to the rotten , putrid ,pulchritudinous core.

"pulchritudinous"?? cn

"if zimmerman was getting beat so bad, there would be evidence of it. as it is, there is no evidence that zimmerman was assaulted at all. none."

Read the police report. Read the account of the eye witness. UB, you are entitled to your own opinions but you are not entitled to you own facts. Zimmer walks under 776.041 2a.

desert dude said:

According to the police report...

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yes, the police report. which we know is of course the acme and pinnacle of all honesty.

keep citing the report from a corrupt and crooked police force with a history of racial injustice. genius.

desert dude said:

...Zimmer was bleeding from nose and head and the back of his shirt was wet.

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there is zero evidence of this. got a photo of that bloody nose? got a photo of that wet shirt? no? then it never happened.

desert dude said:

The eye witness account was that Trayvon was on top of Zimmer beating him...

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an anonymous "witness" who was contradicted by other accounts which the police felt the need to "correct".

desert dude said:

consistent with the police report.

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suddenly, people on a pot website are defending what's on police reports. what a world.

desert dude said:

I don't know if Zimmer tried to escape but if he did he was not successful because he wound up on the ground under Trayvon.

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unfounded.

desert dude said:

The law say nothing about a bloody nose, it only says, "...the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm..."

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that is not the only thing the law says, genius. that has to be paired with and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant

zimmerman had 360 degrees of escape options available to him. the important part is the AND, it means BOTH must be true. neither was true.

desert dude said:

Yeah, let's see you argue that one in court in front of a jury. Pure speculation on your part and it would not be admissible.

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what? speculation?

it is fact that they did not collect any evidence of any "wet shirt" or "bloody nose".

until you can show me evidence of said things, YOU are the one speculating.

UncleBuck said:

you accuse others of jumping to conclusions, yet talk like it's a certainty that this was the case.

if zimmerman was getting beat so bad, there would be evidence of it. as it is, there is no evidence that zimmerman was assaulted at all. none.

not to mention, he has 100 pounds on the kid and had 360 degrees of open space around him to run away, if you believe this unfounded and ludicrous tale that this kid turned into the incredible hulk.

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Ya no evidence besides the witness "john" saying he seen zimmermen getting beat.
The injuries on his head and nose would backup "johns" story.
The injuries of which were documented by police and also Fire department.

desert dude said:

"Funny how Zimmerman was on his back when he shot Trayvon in the chest. Zimmerman was supposed to be directly underneath him. Why wasn't he covered in Trayvon's blood? The chest? Where the heart is? No blood? "

The problem with that line of thinking is the eye witness account of Trayvon on top of Zimmer and beating him. That eye witness account corroborates Zimmer's claim that he was being beaten.

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eyewitness accounts are unreliable in a court of law. the account means jack shit, especially since the cops were "correcting" other accounts.

UncleBuck said:

yes, the police report. which we know is of course the acme and pinnacle of all honesty.

keep citing the report from a corrupt and crooked police force with a history of racial injustice. genius.



there is zero evidence of this. got a photo of that bloody nose? got a photo of that wet shirt? no? then it never happened.



an anonymous "witness" who was contradicted by other accounts which the police felt the need to "correct".



suddenly, people on a pot website are defending what's on police reports. what a world.



unfounded.



that is not the only thing the law says, genius. that has to be paired with and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant

zimmerman had 360 degrees of escape options available to him. the important part is the AND, it means BOTH must be true. neither was true.

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Poor UB. On the losing side of yet another argument, shouting unfounded assertions that are contradicted by the police report and an eye witness. Zimmer walks. What he did was remarkably dumb, but legal under the law.

desert dude said:

"if zimmerman was getting beat so bad, there would be evidence of it. as it is, there is no evidence that zimmerman was assaulted at all. none."

Read the police report. Read the account of the eye witness. UB, you are entitled to your own opinions but you are not entitled to you own facts. Zimmer walks under 776.041 2a.

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lol, now stoners are defending police reports. the police report doesn't mean shit when they coached other people into making the statements they wanted.

eyewitness accounts are all but meaningless in a court of law.

no pictures or any evidence whatsoever of any injuries, no assault ever happened. period.

UncleBuck said:

eyewitness accounts are unreliable in a court of law. the account means jack shit, especially since the cops were "correcting" other accounts.

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I agree that eye witness are unreliable, even notoriously so, but they are admissible as evidence. In this case the eye witness account is corroborated by the observations of the responding policeman and documented in the policeman's written report. Zimmer walks.

GAME SET MATCH... unless some other actual evidence emerges.

cliffey501 said:

clearly you have no idea the legal definition of "stalking".

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and clearly this has never happened to you or anyone you love.