ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
And who makes most of their income from capital gains?
Thoughts on the "Fair Tax"
- Thread starter BigNBushy
- Start date
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
Relevance?
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
it's the rich trying to fuck you
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
A consumption tax, based on actual consumption with an equal rate on capital gains hurts the rich FAR more due to their higher overall consumption and higher dependence on capital gains for their wealth.
Stop being such a lefty-douche, you're smarter than their retarded talking points.
Analyse it for yourself, use numbers and come to your own conclusion.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
Please by all means. Give an example of a consumption tax or flat tax that includes capital gains.
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
I'm proposing one, I'm not the first either.
Corporations would still pay Corporation tax too...
Why the hostility to making people pay at the till rather than before they recieve the money they traded their labour for?
You also would have the effect of taxing EVERYONE equally, including those who earn their money from "dodgy" sources.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
It wouldn't tax everyone equally and it would shift the burden of paying for society to the less economically advantaged. Which is why Rich bastards like Steve Forbes and mitt Romney advocate for them
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
Ok so you are stupid.
I said I'd propose a fair tax with an equal level of capital gains and corporate tax.
A fair fair tax.
Comprende?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Voluntary giving is good. The kind of "giving" you advocate isn't really giving, because first somebody has to forcibly steal the money to "give" it away. Why do you like government force so much?
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
Sorry the Big guys who Bankroll the "Fair Tax" initiatives in congress wouldnt get what they been trying to pay for
Which would be elimination of the Capital gains tax
How come I never hear the Rich Tax evaders advocating for a reduction in the employee part of the payroll tax?
I
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
Here's where I differ from most on the right concerning capital gains. If I sell my house it's a capital gain, if I flip houses for a living (more than 50% of my income comes from flipping houses) the tax rate charges change from capital gains to income. If more than 50% of my income is from investments, it should be called income, not capital gains. The Buffets of the world essentially have zero income to tax under our present system when it's obviously their sole income.
For most of us capital gains are not income as Harrekin says and should most definitely not be taxed. Those multi-gazillionaires who's only income is from capital gains should be treated the same as the real estate guys when defining income.
I realize i'm very much in the minority here with my reasoning and I realize those select few brokers have helped write the tax code.
Fun fact, Berkshire Hathaway is currently fighting the IRS over billions (BILLIONS) of unpaid taxes. The same guy who claims he should be paying a higher rate while in front of cameras.
Edit: so in answer to Cheesus's question (good to see you back posting man) I think capital gains should be taxed at 0 in our present system, but if it's your income, it should be taxed as income. Under my system there would be no income tax, that should answer your question. It's not only immoral to tax production, it's counter-intuitive, it's lazy, and it's damaging to incentive to produce.
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
Wait, do you understand what the Fair Tax is? It would REPLACE income tax. I would say they are very much advocating for a reduction to payroll tax for their employees. In fact, they want to reduce it to zero, nilch, nada. Does that change your mind about it?
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
I wa saying in lieu of the various flat/fair tax scamnarios that do nothing but shift the cost of our society on those less fortunate.
Payroll tax doesnt affect Romney at all as he hasnt drawn a paycheck in years
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
True, and a way to make sure Romney pays more than all of us is to eliminate income tax and replace it with a consumption tax.
When our economy is built and propped up by borrowing so we can consume this is a frightful thought. I get that. I just think our system of borrowing to consume is unsustainable long term.
Also, you went from saying all those fair tax guys are just trying to eliminate capital gains, then you say in lieu of fair tax... It's hard to keep up with what you are arguing.
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
I worked for too many millionaires that never bought anything
-company house, car, motorcycle,boat
ginwilly
Well-Known Member
I'll try one more time then let someone with more stamina take over.
Under a consumption tax, those items would be taxed, not written off as expenses like we do presently. You keep making damn good arguments FOR the Fair Tax, you just don't seem to understand what it is.