There is a crack in everything...

I have done small 1.5 - 2 ft tall plants, with short veg. I really think the longer veg can help but has resulted in some drastic differences in how the garden looks and acts.

Instead of 6 - 4.5 gal that could go 3 or more days between waterings thats 3 - 4.5 gals that have to be watered/fed every other day and can't be moved easilly.

I think to get the longer vegged older sexual mature plants i want mainlining is a style that will be more managanle for me. Was thinking something like 12/12 from rooted clone in 2 gal pots is what I will try next. Seems a lot of people are having good success optimizing leds that can be distributed over a large footprint and minimizing the amount of trimming that has to be done with this method too.

SSGrower said:

I have done small 1.5 - 2 ft tall plants, with short veg. I really think the longer veg can help but has resulted in some drastic differences in how the garden looks and acts.
View attachment 4127001
Instead of 6 - 4.5 gal that could go 3 or more days between waterings thats 3 - 4.5 gals that have to be watered/fed every other day and can't be moved easilly.

I think to get the longer vegged older sexual mature plants i want mainlining is a style that will be more managanle for me. Was thinking something like 12/12 from rooted clone in 2 gal pots is what I will try next. Seems a lot of people are having good success optimizing leds that can be distributed over a large footprint and minimizing the amount of trimming that has to be done with this method too.

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Those are some healthy happy looking plants!!! I know what you mean about watering, small pots or long veg times/big plants will drink considerably more.

I've found that with 12/12 from seed, because of the natural symmetrical pattern of branches, mainlining has fewer benefits. I think that one of the benefits of mainlining is that veg is prolonged -- allowing the roots and main trunk to thicken up -- without the plant taking up a huge amount of space while that's happening. Then when you do flip, you have a more mature plant and a really solid platform for the remaining branches to grow from. I haven't tried doing a 12/12 from a rooted clone, since clones sex is already established I'd imagine they would go right into flower and end out pretty small. I also have not yet tried mainlining clones, but I've seen others do it and I think most of the benefits can be achieved.

I've read enough reports from people here that say they've successfully up-potted after the plants show sex (i.e. 7-10 days after flipping to 12/12), that I think I might try that next time. I might put pretty much all of my remaining (store bought) seeds into 1 gallon pots and run them 12/12 from seed. After I see how many germinate, and then how many boys I have, I'll up-pot the remainder into 2 gallon pots. I can squeeze a dozen 2 gallon pots into my 3x3 for a short run, but 9 two gallons is a better fit.


On a different note, here are some of the boy-flowers and seeds I found as I did the second trim on the LSD. I'm going to have to inspect my plants much more closely moving forward. If I had been on top of this I probably could have plucked the male flowers before they matured (since they were not nanners but actual hanging flowers) and this whole plant would not be in the hash pile right now. It's a shame, LSD is one of the best smelling and most potent strains I've grown so far.

Humanrob said:

I've read enough reports from people here that say they've successfully up-potted after the plants show sex (i.e. 7-10 days after flipping to 12/12), that I think I might try that next time.

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On this subject, I've been holding them in 1gal pots regardless of how long they take to sex (some can take forever!), at least to the point where I think they're females. Then up-potting them and flipping them at that point. Not that I'd shy away from up-potting after they're flipped, but I'd rather not if it's avoidable, just for the potential stress. The fabric pots seem to be forgiving when keeping them in smaller pots longer than usual.

I'm comfortable enough to up-pot/flip same day and haven't seen any issues. This current round are 10x 2gal's that were up-potted and flipped same day. Another pheno hunt coming up and plan to do the same unless the bitches show me their pubics first

GroErr said:

On this subject, I've been holding them in 1gal pots regardless of how long they take to sex (some can take forever!), at least to the point where I think they're females. Then up-potting them and flipping them at that point. Not that I'd shy away from up-potting after they're flipped, but I'd rather not if it's avoidable, just for the potential stress. The fabric pots seem to be forgiving when keeping them in smaller pots longer than usual.

I'm comfortable enough to up-pot/flip same day and haven't seen any issues. This current round are 10x 2gal's that were up-potted and flipped same day. Another pheno hunt coming up and plan to do the same unless the bitches show me their pubics first

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As always, nice looking plants!

I guess I've never vegged a plant from a seed long enough to have them show sex. Even in outdoor runs where I put a bunch of plants of unknown sex in the ground, I won't see any sign of sex until August and then it's usually the boys that show up first. I'm sure I'm just missing something.

In this case, if I'm doing a 12/12 from seed, as far as I can tell they are going to show sex as they go directly into flower, so even if I knew how to pre-sex them I don't think there will be any chance/time to do that...?

How many weeks of vegging does it usually take before they show sex?

Humanrob said:

As always, nice looking plants!

I guess I've never vegged a plant from a seed long enough to have them show sex. Even in outdoor runs where I put a bunch of plants of unknown sex in the ground, I won't see any sign of sex until August and then it's usually the boys that show up first. I'm sure I'm just missing something.

In this case, if I'm doing a 12/12 from seed, as far as I can tell they are going to show sex as they go directly into flower, so even if I knew how to pre-sex them I don't think there will be any chance/time to do that...?

How many weeks of vegging does it usually take before they show sex?

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Cheers, excited about some of those, two new strains/crosses going in there, always fun wondering what will come out of a new batch

When you go 12/12 from seed they'll typically show sex around the 30 days mark, more or less depending on strain but 4-5 weeks is what I've seen when doing it. I've used it to participate in some contests here but otherwise I don't do 12/12 fs because you can't really get clones off them and I try and clone everything in case it turns out killer. Of course they could be re-vegged but that seems like an opportunity for stress and questionable time-wise by the time they re-veg.

From seed they'll typically take 5-6 weeks from when you plant the seed. At that point most show something, of course as in anything there are exceptions. I've been able to identify 1 fem of 6 from one strain coming up next and they just hit 4 weeks from planting. The round that's flowering now, I flipped two that hadn't shown me shit after 7 weeks so I up-potted to 2gal's and took a chance with the flip, one of the two turned out to be male, that one is now flowering in a separate tent.

To get accurate with sexing can take some practice, a loupe definitely helps. A lot of males start showing around 4 weeks from seed I've noticed, tiny little balls you'd never see with the naked eye, that's where the loupe comes in handy. I grabbed a 6x magnifier at the dollar store and it's been great having it for that purpose alone.

GroErr said:

Cheers, excited about some of those, two new strains/crosses going in there, always fun wondering what will come out of a new batch

When you go 12/12 from seed they'll typically show sex around the 30 days mark, more or less depending on strain but 4-5 weeks is what I've seen when doing it. I've used it to participate in some contests here but otherwise I don't do 12/12 fs because you can't really get clones off them and I try and clone everything in case it turns out killer. Of course they could be re-vegged but that seems like an opportunity for stress and questionable time-wise by the time they re-veg.

From seed they'll typically take 5-6 weeks from when you plant the seed. At that point most show something, of course as in anything there are exceptions. I've been able to identify 1 fem of 6 from one strain coming up next and they just hit 4 weeks from planting. The round that's flowering now, I flipped two that hadn't shown me shit after 7 weeks so I up-potted to 2gal's and took a chance with the flip, one of the two turned out to be male, that one is now flowering in a separate tent.

To get accurate with sexing can take some practice, a loupe definitely helps. A lot of males start showing around 4 weeks from seed I've noticed, tiny little balls you'd never see with the naked eye, that's where the loupe comes in handy. I grabbed a 6x magnifier at the dollar store and it's been great having it for that purpose alone.

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I'll have to make some notes for myself so I remember this -- it's highly likely that I'll only do one indoor run next winter, so it might be November before my next opportunity to check this out.

Another little update... but I'm not sure this counts. Update: my GG4 from a clone hermied. I'd said I've never had a hermie from a clone before. BUT... not sure it counts because of that whole "clone only" thing with GG4 I've read about ("Because GG4 (f.k.a Gorilla Glue #4) came from a hermaphroditic plant, so be aware that pollen sacs can develop from this strain."). In my case it was just one branch, just two sets of male flowers, resulting in about 20 seeds.

Humanrob said:

Another little update... but I'm not sure this counts. Update: my GG4 from a clone hermied. I'd said I've never had a hermie from a clone before. BUT... not sure it counts because of that whole "clone only" thing with GG4 I've read about ("Because GG4 (f.k.a Gorilla Glue #4) came from a hermaphroditic plant, so be aware that pollen sacs can develop from this strain."). In my case it was just one branch, just two sets of male flowers, resulting in about 20 seeds.

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Found some suspicious growths under the canopy on one plant, a f1. Was very low but really looked like a sac preflower. I trimmed up the lowest buds.
This is the cleanest under canopy I have ever ran.

Will report back on what happens

SSGrower said:

Found some suspicious growths under the canopy on one plant, a f1. Was very low but really looked like a sac preflower. I trimmed up the lowest buds.
This is the cleanest under canopy I have ever ran.

Will report back on what happens

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I look forward to hearing about it.

I'm not going to do a scrog or use SIPs for a while. On my next grow I want to be able to take all of the plants out, put them up on a table one at a time and inspect them 360º. There seems to be a window of time in the first few weeks of flower where -- like you -- if I can catch them early I can remove them, and with a lot of plants that seems to be all I'd need to do to stop them from producing seeds. Until I find out an actual cause and solution, at least I'll still be producing. I had a lot fewer this last run, so I think I'm on the right road.

Humanrob said:

I look forward to hearing about it.

I'm not going to do a scrog or use SIPs for a while. On my next grow I want to be able to take all of the plants out, put them up on a table one at a time and inspect them 360º. There seems to be a window of time in the first few weeks of flower where -- like you -- if I can catch them early I can remove them, and with a lot of plants that seems to be all I'd need to do to stop them from producing seeds. Until I find out an actual cause and solution, at least I'll still be producing. I had a lot fewer this last run, so I think I'm on the right road.

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IMO strains like gg4 and many other sought after strains with a what used to be black market mystique, now a comercialized synthisization, where mystery seeds and accidental polinations provide the base for a story of "rare dankness". IDK if I trust any legal souce over a grey market one, in fact the grey market seems the most open of options. I'll be running some testers from a chucker on here later this fall. I also bought another bach of seeds from the dispensary I got mtn thunder from, I wanted another batch of mtn thiunder but that dosent seem likely so I got "pirate radio" (somali taxi driver x sour bubble).
The clone I have off a mom that threw nanners is still looking good, I kept a cut and will continue it if this one flowers out well. I like the smoke and have more seeds, but I want to see what happens with this round before getting started on the next.

Part of the reason I vegged longer was to make it easier to inspect with them being taller. I think next time I will run more plants with minimal side branching, removing these that were topped/trained is going to become impossible in a couple more weeks.

Still got a nut to crack. The plant that had suspicious flowers got chopped to make room, while trimming found a few seed sacs but not much evidence of male flowers or nanners. Isolated to buds that were saved for light, pale and spindly. I did not prune near enough before flower and they got root bound early in veg.

SSGrower said:

Still got a nut to crack. The plant that had suspicious flowers got chopped to make room, while trimming found a few seed sacs but not much evidence of male flowers or nanners. Isolated to buds that were saved for light, pale and spindly. I did not prune near enough before flower and they got root bound early in veg.

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Some of the male flowers I've found were not uncovered until the buds were either trimmed hard or being broken up to be smoked, because it appears they started so tightly under the forming bud that the bud enveloped them. In those cases there would just be a couple of seeds in that bud, but no real spread of the pollen.

Humanrob said:

Some of the male flowers I've found were not uncovered until the buds were either trimmed hard or being broken up to be smoked, because it appears they started so tightly under the forming bud that the bud enveloped them. In those cases there would just be a couple of seeds in that bud, but no real spread of the pollen.

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I think my next run will be something like 12/12 or 13/11 from seed.

Was just reading thru your thread in the advanced section and followed here.
Glad I did.

Lucky Luke said:

Was just reading thru your thread in the advanced section and followed here.
Glad I did.

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From my end it feels like I'm asking a lot of questions and there are no clear answers, but its nice if some of the conversations I've started have been interesting or helpful. Mostly I'm just poking around in the dark, and it's a good thing these plants are as resilient as they are.

I also grow in an uninsulated shed so I can relate to some of your issues.

Lucky Luke said:

I also grow in an uninsulated shed so I can relate to some of your issues.

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Another 5 days +/- and the last of my starts will be out in the yard, then I can shut everything down in there until next November. That’ll be a good feeling.

Winter here and I'm battling cool temps. Only a few months ago I was battling hot temps. Ahhh the cycle of life.

I don't know if I've just never noticed this before, or if it's actually unusual for cannabis... I've been noticing some of my young plants track the sun -- they lean towards the east in the morning and by late afternoon they are leaning towards the west. Not all of them are doing it, just some.

a senile fungus said:

I bought a motorized damper for around $80 plus a cheapo thermostat from.hardware store for $20.

When the temps.in.the room rise above the set limit, the damper opens and allows cold air into the room to cool it down some. I run a humidifier to.battle the dry cold air.

It works really well for my winters here in MI. My room has been within ten degrees all winter, and I'm running about 2kw constantly in various rooms, building is 22'x11'.

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Could you post pics our describe more of your set up. This has been a concern of mine going into this winter. It's my first grow and want to set things up right. I built a small insulated room inside a cold storage shed. How do you regulated temp without running the heater 24/7.