Unclebaldrick
Well-Known Member
I wonder if they realized...
The "D" day pool, best guess as to when Trump is out
- Thread starter DIY-HP-LED
- Start date
DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
It's a pretty good double entendre and describes the situation very succinctly, besides I laughed my ass off. I figure Pecker is fucked, Bezos can afford his own space program with spare change, and if Pecker can be sued over this, he will be, for every dime he ever had and then some. He might have even flushed his squeal deal, along with his life and fortune down the toilet, it's gonna get crowded under Donald's bus real soon. It couldn't have happened to a more deserving bunch of clowns and I figure the judges are gonna max out on sentencing these assholes.
Pecker and AMI were just another example of the many ways that Donald cheated his way to the POTUS, Russian hacking and help in several forms including tens of millions of dollars funneled through the NRA. Using the Trump organization and foundation in election fraud is yet another, along with Roger Stone and his coordination with Russian hacked email sources. I figure Trump cheated at least a dozen different ways to win the 2016 election, not including conspiring with the Russians.
The good part is I figure Uncle Sam has got this whole circus of clowns by the balls and we are about to see him squeeze.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Oh, I don't know. I see plenty of promising people around me. I like some of the new generation of politicians in Congress too. Trump, Trumpkins, some of the old guard in the Democratic leadership ranks all suffer from hubris. Calamity follows them. They won't last much longer.
But you and I see the world differently. Same world, different planets.
Hubris and the danger of leaders with extreme self-regard
We do not have to look far to find widely recognized “hubrists” from the worlds of politics and business. In the recent past, these include former US president, George W Bush, who, along with then British prime minister Tony Blair, overreached himself in the 2003 invasion of Iraq. Or the former and final CEO of Lehman Brothers, Richard Fuld, who in his overreaching transitioned from Wall Street royalty to, in the eyes of many, the pariah of the financial crisis, bringing down Lehman Brothers with him.
While there is no shortage of hubrists in the public sphere today, hubris is far from a 21st-century phenomenon. Alexander the Great and Napoleon Bonaparte – while peerless as leaders in their time – both fell prey to hubris. The Ancient Greeks recognized its hazards and counselled against hubris in their myths and tragedies, often tying it to a reckoning meted out by the goddess of retribution and vengeance, Nemesis. But perhaps the most well known of the Greek myths to warn against hubris is that of Daedalus and Icarus.
It would be hubris to think the US is all that special in the history of civilization.
http://theconversation.com/hubris-and-the-danger-of-leaders-with-extreme-self-regard-71548
DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
If you want a better society and the kind of country that results from it, start at the beginning of a new generation's lives, it takes 20 years to really see the results, but there are few short cuts in life. Do what is proven to work, only Trumpers say, "we don't need no stink'n edumacaton". Other countries have good ideas too and teaching civics and history might be a good start. The short school days would be an issue in a society where people need schools to provide daycare because both parents have to hold down two jobs to make ends meet though. With a school shooting in the US every couple of weeks, it would be helpful if the kids weren't worried about being slaughtered in their classrooms too.
Other places might have better ideas, ya can't argue with top results, Canada needs more of these ideas and the US can use them even more. If you want better citizens and fewer Trumpers then start with the education system. Schools are more evenly financed in Canada across the provinces and there are no dramatic differences between neighborhood schools, though we still have private schools.
Remember America is a much richer county than Finland (not because America does things better either).
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Why Finland has the best education system in the world
A segment on the approach to education in Finland taken from "Where To Invade Next" by Michael Moore.
Other places might have better ideas, ya can't argue with top results, Canada needs more of these ideas and the US can use them even more. If you want better citizens and fewer Trumpers then start with the education system. Schools are more evenly financed in Canada across the provinces and there are no dramatic differences between neighborhood schools, though we still have private schools.
Remember America is a much richer county than Finland (not because America does things better either).
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Why Finland has the best education system in the world
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i doubt hubris is going to be much of an issue. trump is out of office is 2020....have absolutely no idea who is going to take over the shit pile he leaves behind, but they're going to have a LOT of work to do, undoing 4 years of trumps fucked up idiocy.....don't even think about hubris until whoever replaces trump goes into a second term...they simply won't have time to "over reach" themselves, they'll be entirely too busy refunding pbs, nasa, national arts programs, the national parks, kicking developers out of any federally owned land, tearing down trumps border wall (wouldn't that chap the motherfuckers asses? tear it down the day the cocksucker leaves office.....if he ever gets a foot of it built to begin with)
hubris simply shouldn't be an issue for at least two terms after trumps gets his fat fucking orange ass out of the whitehouse
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Its an issue right now though. Not just Trump but the people who support him. The reason I mentioned it was the comment by LED that Americans are dumb. I still believe our problems aren't lack of ability, it is something else. I said hubris, which is certainly evident in Trump among other failings. Is it that his followers suffer from the same or do they suffer from a lack of humility or do you think its something else?
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I thought you said we had to fix our constitution first.
DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
There are holes in the constitution that Trump and crew drove right through, much has to be settled by the SCOTUS because you've never had a president as unfit as Trump. Nobody is perfect, even the founding fathers and the way it's evolved in the USA the president has more power than the founders envisioned. A third of the government depends on the character of the POTUS and the other third depends on the character and courage of the congress to enforce the constitution. The current problem with America lies with the enforcement of the constitution, not the document its self, ya gotta go with what ya got.
The old Soviet Union had a wonderful constitution, but Stalin and the communist party enforced it, and I'm sure the Russian federation has a wonderful founding document too, but Putin and his cronies are enforcing that one too. A constitution is just paper and words ya need living people with character and courage to interpret and enforce it, qualities the republicans in the senate lack.
Right now it kinda looks like Trump is above the law and can't be indicted, this is a matter for the SCOTUS to determine not the DOJ, the constitution is unclear.
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Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
hubris yes...but trump and nearly everyone he appoints are massively lacking in ability to accomplish the tasks that need to be accomplished...so i stick with "both"....
although i do hope that there are at least a few in the upcoming crowd that stand out....but, you know, i'm not nearly as optimistic as you
Herb & Suds
Well-Known Member
That girl bears an uncanny likeness to a witch
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I can't go there comparing Soviet Union to the US.
I'm not going to dispute the need to erase the Electoral College if that's what you mean about needing to fix the Constitution. I simply state that without the large number of people who voted for Trump, the EC wouldn't have been a factor. 42% voted for him when as you say, it was obvious from the beginning he is unfit for office. He maintains about the same amount of support today. Maybe a little less. Those same people would object to your ideas on upgrading our social systems. They also applaud Trump's actions. The control Republicans have across the country in state houses and for the past two years in Washington stemmed from old white reactionary voters who I believe voted Republican because they couldn't stand having a black man in office and then a woman taking office after him. They show up to vote too.
So, I don't think we have a problem with the constitution. Nor do I think upgrading our social systems is just a matter of listening to somebody from Canada. I think we have a hangover of old, previously entitled white people who are stuck in the past. The problem today is with our people, not an old piece of paper.
It's just a matter of time. I think there is a change in demographics and understanding that both drove the wild swing toward reactionary right wing politics and is now driving the correction towards the kind of society you envision for us. I think a Democrat will be in charge of the WH in 2021, Democrats will maintain control of the House and by 2024, we will have scourged the Senate of the old racist white men who call themselves Republicans but are in fact traitors.
The presidency is a powerful position, more so than in countries with Parliamentary style government. I admire the current government in Canada but parliamentary style government isn't exactly why Canada's system is working so well right now. Government doesn't seem to be working all that well in the UK, for example. They, along with the US are dealing with a generation that is older, racist, bigoted and right wing populist in their leanings. The problem is with these people, not a piece of paper.
rkymtnman
Well-Known Member
yep. my dad is a trumptard and one of his latest comments was that he just wants America to be the same as when he was growing up. (post WW2) dad works, mom cleans and cooks, white picket fence, etc. blacks use a separate water fountain. sad but true.
and he definitely hated the black POTUS and the thought of a woman was too much.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
When Americans are polled about attitudes regarding race, 60% of white people answer in ways that show they have racist tendencies. Mostly older white They wouldn't say they are racist but answer yes they agree when asked if black people don't experience hardship due to racism. Those people are Trump's base. Along with their racism comes a whole basket full for right wing beliefs and baggage. In ten years, demographic shifts to millenials and larger proportion of brown people will take those people out of power.
So, no, I don't think the problem is the Constitution. It's people who want the Constitution to only apply to them. Our education system did us proud when they educated the millennials who will soon displace those older whites.
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DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
Putting Ivanka on the house hot seat will get Donald's attention and if she's indicted, it will get her a pardon too. She was involved in the Moscow Trump tower business up to her eyeballs and there are lots of other very interesting questions that she might not want to answer honestly. If she is indicted for perjury and pardoned, congress will bring her right back in and ask the same questions plus a few others and she will have to answer, but hey, daddy can always come through with another pardon if she lies again. Watching her and the rest of these slim balls squirm under oath will be entertaining TV.
Congress ain't done with Matt Whitaker yet either and he is gonna spend long hours in front of the house judiciary committee with extended time for detailed questioning under oath, no 5 minute time limits here, no running out the clock either. Matt is gonna squirm, dance & sweat on the hot seat cause the heat is gonna be turned way up and his ass is gonna be on it for a long time.
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DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
I did not mean to compare the US with the soviet union, but was trying to illustrate that a constitution is only as good as those who intrepid it and enforce it's provisions, like the emoluments clause for instance. The GOP house and senate were acting more like Putin's party than like a US constitutional body whose duty it was to provide oversight and constitutional enforcement. That situation was partly remedied during the last election and hopefully the cure will be complete with the next one.
The US constitution has been amended several times and will be again, more perfect union stuff and all that. I figure Trump's presidency will cause the SCOTUS to settle some heavy constitutional questions like indicting a sitting president among others. I've found that the structure of a government matters less than integrity and good will of the elected officials who run the government. A constitutional monarchy seems to work as well as a republic for most things. BTW Canada has lots of constitutional issues too
I agree that global change and technology are exacerbating America's existing social ills, racism and xenophobia are not exclusively American issues. Every country on earth has about a third of the population who are absolute assholes, America's current advantage is that Trump has concentrated almost all of them within the republican party!
What we are seeing is the not too distant rumblings of a technological storm that is gonna make the majority of people unemployable. Technological & political change, increased communications, ease of travel, civil wars and other forms of violence and disruption are causing global mass migrations of people. This situation is gonna stress most of the societies on our planet and it's only gonna get worse.
I think the republicans are finished for a few years and after that demographic changes will play an increasingly import role in US elections. Donald will lead to the demise of the right in America, the only question is how far will the pendulum swing to the left. At the rate middle aged white guys are dying off you won't have long to wait, most Trumpers lead shitty lifestyles, many like to drink, a lot!
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DIY-HP-LED
Well-Known Member
Agreed, about the 40%, history and a tribalistic political structure (party registration and primaries reinforce political identity) has expanded the 33% of assholes present in almost every society a bit. However many whites are repulsed by Trumpism, and along with frightened and alienated minority populations of every description, they should form a solid majority.
Good ideas about education can come from anywhere, Finland is #1 in education, so it would be a good place to look. Most of the reason there are disparities in the American education system is that many Americans are afraid the brown folks might get some. Its the same reason Americans don't have universal healthcare, brown folks might get some. Good public education and affordable or free higher education are prime causes of social mobility, for everybody with brains, including brown folks. There's an old saying that's appropriate to the situation, "Cut yer nose off to spite yer face"!
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Fogdog
Well-Known Member
There is another saying: If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. I get it. The problem we face is, those 60% that are racist also oppose what you propose.
Two more years until we can get rid of the Republican presidency.
Six more years until we can get rid of Republican controlled Senate.
Universal healthcare can't be made into law until those happen. Even then,
It's simply not something that will happen overnight. I don't think it should, either. Not if the Bernie's Medicare for all plan is what gets enacted. We have to do better than that.