lol.... maybe so med... i like obama even though i'm more of a conservative... if i'm anything... i hope he's all he is cracked up to be i'd vote for him... unless he really wants to pull our troops out... i'm not going to vote for anyone who would fuck our country like that just to get elected... but thats off subject... and i've had my stuff stolen by drugies before that really pisses me off so yeah let them have all they can handle and overdose... good for the bastards...
Thanks to Bush's tax cuts ...
- Thread starter ViRedd
- Start date
medicineman
New Member
As long as they assimilate the HMOs And Insurance Co.s and a few CEOs, oh yeah, and VIs taxes~LOL~, before he blows a gasket!
ViRedd
New Member
So far, all I've heard Obama say is that he is for "reform." He talks a good game UNTIL he is asked HOW he would pay for the reforms he espouses. That's always the big buggaboo for most politicians ... the big HOW of things. Like you, Med ... you have some great ideas about reform ... like single payer medical insurance, providing for the poor, limiting the salarys of top executives, pulling the troops out of Iraq and leaving the Middle East to fend for themselves. All good ideas ... but NEVER have you ever answered even one question as to HOW or what the ultimate ramifications of your ideas would be. Not dissing you here, Med ... you're in very good company. The people you vote for have all the WHY questions just like you do ... but when it comes to the HOW, all you hear is that pebble falling into the bottomless well I keep talking aobut.
Vi
Vi
medicineman
New Member
Well, Vi, if no-one had any "good" ideas, and no-one tried any solutions, nothing would ever change. At this point in political idiocy, I believe most any of these Ideas are worth trying. "Rome wasn't built in a day" but someone had to lay the cornerstone. The Bushco Ideaologies are bankrupting this Great Nation with the rich getting obscenely richer while everyone else is losing ground and the poor are getting decidedly poorer. This, I must assume, is your idea of paradise. Well it is certainly not mine or the majority of the middle class as they watch their lifestyle slip into the pockets of fat assed CEOs. So, yes, change is good.
medicineman
New Member
As I've already stated in response to your Hugo Chavez thread, It's his country and the people love him, leave old Hugo alone and worry about you're own country that is running rampant on the planet. Please step back and look around. We (USA) are the bad guys to most of the rest of the world, does that bother you or are you just stupid?
ViRedd
New Member
Yes, and the people of Red China loved Mao as well. They loved him so much that 30,000,000 of them were starved to death while he tried one failed marxist idea after another. Chavez is on the same path ... and he's using YOUR ideas to accomplish it too Med.
Vi
medicineman
New Member
Thats funny, He never ask me for advice, in fact I've never even met the man, why don't we let History be the judge of Hugo Chavez?
ViRedd
New Member
We don't need history to be the judge, Med. History has already said plenty about where Chavez's path will lead. He's using the very same ideas that you keep espousing in this forum to lead his people. They are on the path to economic destruction. Read the article and face the truth, Med. Your marxist ideas are old news.
Vi
Vi
first of all i only like obama as a person not a politician... second i'm going to have to agree with vi communist ideas will never work... med have you ever stopped to think why the poor are poor??? most of them are drug addicted or lazy or both... people who would rather steal then work an honest day... the problem with socialism (which is just a nice word for communism minus an evil dictator) is that the people that work hard keep the leeches of society alive via free healthcare school food etc... that is why the social reform in this country is truly leading to this decline you talk about... the ceo's and insane salaries has something to do with it but not anywhere close to what these social programs are doing... capatalism is a great thing and med i'm sure if you came up with some great invention or worked your ass off to become head of a big company u wouldn't feel so warm giving all of your money away to a bunch of lazy good for nothing drugie bastards who don't deserve to breathe... the democrats have a bunch of great ideas but they would only work in a perfect world where everyone was the same... they want everyone to get the same benefits and that means that everyone should contribute equally unfortunatly this will never happen...
medicineman
New Member
Think about this: A worker barely makes enough to feed and house his family. He is one of the 40+ million un-insured (medical) workers in the country. His child gets sick and he takes him to the emergency room. They check his insurance status and deny treatment Only offering a "bandaid" like aspirin or some other simple remedy, he tries to make payment arrangements but he has no credit, he drags the child to Dr. after Dr. but with no insurance or money he is denied treatment. The child gets worse and dies. This is the state of medical in the USA, the richest nation on earth. Here's the alternative: We eliminate the HMOs and The insurance companies and take a tax out of everyones pay to fund single payer Medical. everyone is covered and the child lives. Hey, the rich assholes can get all the special treatment they think they're deserving of. No-one should be denied the best of medical treatment in this day and age, It's barbaric. For one child to die so some HMO CEO assholes can make multi-million dollar salaries is unexcusable. Call it socialism or just call it compassionate medical, It's time has come!
i see where your coming from med i really do... but the problem is that guy that takes his child in and the doctor does everything he can to save the child and the child dies because it is out of the doctors hand and then the dad sues the doctor... this drives up insurance and medical costs etc... the problem isn't with the rich its with the get rich quick poor people... oh not to mention the illegals and people who get free medical and are also on welfare... you are not seeing the whole picture only what you want med... the real problem lies with humanity and the fact that most people want things they don't deserve and will do any underhanded thing to get them... in a day and age where people sue and win over the drop of a dime its a no brainer to me why things cost so much... if people would stop suing for nonsense and the lazy bums on welfare were made to get a job and support themselves oh yeah and they got rid of all of the illegals who are bankrupting our system then insurance would be affordable for everyone... its just like with this raise in the minimum wage... democrats want to have all of these programs but they fail to see the consequences that will result because of humanity... people are getting fired because the middle class and small business can't afford the new minimum wage but thats ok right med??? the rich has nothing to do with it... it is because of the poor lazy and sue happy that insurance is so rediculous... you must remember that these rich people are responsible for the funding so that we can have the medical breakthroughs that we do... oh yeah and who would want to be a doctor if it didn't pay well... do you suggest they get pay cuts also... then what happens when no one wants to be a doctor because of the constant risk of being sued and the shitty salary... like vi said democrats have plenty of good ideas but no sane way of implementing them... they just want what they want and to hell with the consequences... and i promise you those consequences are very very bad just think about it...
ViRedd
New Member
Med sez ...
"... he drags the child to Dr. after Dr. but with no insurance or money he is denied treatment. The child gets worse and dies."
So, the father has never heard of the County hospital? AND .... in emergencies, hospitals are forbidden by law from turning anyone down.
Vi
PS: Frthnker ... your last two posts were great.
"... he drags the child to Dr. after Dr. but with no insurance or money he is denied treatment. The child gets worse and dies."
So, the father has never heard of the County hospital? AND .... in emergencies, hospitals are forbidden by law from turning anyone down.
Vi
PS: Frthnker ... your last two posts were great.
medicineman
New Member
What you guys fail to see is the fact that single payer medical is very similar to VA, and you can't win a VA lawsuit for malpractice, because you sign a waiver when you sign up, so the malpractice arguement is off the table. The arguement about quality is also negated by the availability of private dr.s that will not participate. Maybe the care would not be top drawer, but some care is better than none. and as for the county hospital scenario, they will treat you for emergency only, if you have a disease that needs constant attention, too bad. I can't see the merits of your arguements unless you work for one of the current providers, and then hell yeah, cause you'll be out of a job.
med the lawsuit is not off the table... i'm just stating the facts and those facts are it is not the fault of those with money that insurance is so unaffordable... if insurance was affordable then we wouldn't be having this argument... but you just can't give things away for free... it will never work and you know that in your heart... you seem like a smart guy so listen up... when people have nothing to work for they become degeneret... if you just gave everyone everything they wanted what would be the point in working for anything... the fact is that would create anarchy that is why you can't have a government ruled completly by the people you have to have someone that has some sense and knows that their actions have consequences... most people in america no longer understand this... back when this country was founded people understood what it was to work to survive... but because of the ignorance of our politicians people think america is a free ride and why should they have to do anything if its going to be given to them... med i'm sure you've met many people in your lifetime just imagine everyone you know and now imagine them being given 5 million dollars... who the hell would do anything who would be a policeman a fireman a world class surgeon i mean whats the point??? if everything is going to be given to you on a silver platter then why do anything at all... this is called human nature and if the politicians and those of us with half a brain don't do something about this soon we will continue to see rising crime and a decline in america till we no longer exist as the great country we once were... even a blind man could see this med can you???
medicineman
New Member
even a blind man could see this med can you??? I can see a lot of things. I see a government intent on waging war instead of taking care of it's citizenry. I see a government sending troops into battle and re-deploying them 3-4-5 times into the killing zone and then cutting Veterans benefits. I see CEOs making such extravagant salaries while people are being locked out of factories and jobs are being shipped overseas faster than greased lightening. You want to talk about the old America, My America, where a man had a shot at a decent living without a college degree, I'll talk about that one. You are right, we (the government and corporations) have created a class of do nothing lazy assholes. When there are no jobs or hope of jobs you kind of lose focus. Kinda like "When you're up to your ass in aligators, it's hard to remember you came here to drain the swamp". With the globalization of corporations, there are not enough jobs to supply the citizens, let alone all the cheap labor from down under. So scream at me if you will about lazy no-good do-nothings, but your innattention to the corporate shennanigans has let this transpire, So don't shoot the messenger, just look for truth in the madness!
medicineman
New Member
And what does the great War hero VI know about VA care. I schedule my appointments and see a Dr. regularily every 6 mos for a semi annual checkup. If I had larger problems, I could go more frequently. If you have an emergency, (heart attack or stroke) call 911 and Va picks up the tab. My VA doctor has been my regular Dr. for 15 years and he prescribes all my medicines which come to my house by mail and cost 8.00 per 30 day script. a more convienent system I've not heard of. I could go to him for colds and flu symtoms etc., but use my med. Ins. for quick visits, like an ingrown toenail that I have now. the last time I used Va for this type of service, it was actually faster than my HMO. I think you are misinformed about VA health care. The thing now is People like me with combat exposure are not getting the benefits that I have. I got my benefits locked in 40+ years ago. Now they are turning away vets unless they have major bodily damage, shameful! BTW if you need a major operation, from Vegas, you go to UCSD medical center near San Diego. They have state of the art equipment and the best Dr.s They are scheduled to complete a state of the art hospital in Vegas by 2012. Don't knock it unless you try it. They have improved service in Vegas by 1,000 percent in the last ten years. I have no complaints.
ViRedd
New Member
Then why are you complaining about the health care system? Sounds to me like you're doing fine. Don't bother going to the VA for medical help in Arizona. My buddy there tells me it sucks.
And by the way, the fact that you served in the military and I didn't is nothing more than another red herring thrown up by you to deflect argument from the other side ... so stop with the bullshit already.
Vi
And by the way, the fact that you served in the military and I didn't is nothing more than another red herring thrown up by you to deflect argument from the other side ... so stop with the bullshit already.
Vi