Taxation without representation.....seems so.

burgertime2010 said:

We can agree on that, I never supported any ruling device as the constitution holds on. People, seem to use it when they need it....especially when it comes to the kind of rights I keep referring to. I see freedom as acheiveable when a compromise must be reached, or relatively speaking. The standard you set is unreal, you will always feel let down, the logical conclusion is that someone always will.

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The standard I set has not been met yet, that is true. That doesn't mean it is unreal or incapable of happening or more importantly untrue in the concept. If freedom is worth having, it should not be compromised or it would seem those that accept the compromise are the ones that will be let down.

Thank you for discussing this politely. Time for me to go disobey some bad laws.

burgertime2010 said:

Dissassociate how exactly?

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Governments are not formed for the purpose of ensuring freedom, regardless of any flowery drippy statements that may be made about them and their organization.
They are formed and perpetuated to ensure that those that run them are in a position to use a given government as a vehicle to control the populace in a defined geographical area.

If a person is said to be free, a logical question then would be , "free from what"? Or, "free to do what"? Any real freedom would include the freedom to interact with others and should also include freedom NOT to interact with others or to disassociate. If it didn't, the freedom is then a so called freedom and nothing more.

Rob Roy said:

Governments are not formed for the purpose of ensuring freedom, regardless of any flowery drippy statements that may be made about them and their organization.
They are formed and perpetuated to ensure that those that run them are in a position to use a given government as a vehicle to control the populace in a defined geographical area.

If a person is said to be free, a logical question then would be , "free from what"? Or, "free to do what"? Any real freedom would include the freedom to interact with others and should also include freedom NOT to interact with others or to disassociate. If it didn't, the freedom is then a so called freedom and nothing more.

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The American government was formed to protect people's freedoms. The constitution is intended to be a limitation on government. It has been perverted into what it is today by the very people the founders warned us about.

Hopefully the experiment happens again sometime.

Rob Roy said:

Governments are not formed for the purpose of ensuring freedom, regardless of any flowery drippy statements that may be made about them and their organization.
They are formed and perpetuated to ensure that those that run them are in a position to use a given government as a vehicle to control the populace in a defined geographical area.

If a person is said to be free, a logical question then would be , "free from what"? Or, "free to do what"? Any real freedom would include the freedom to interact with others and should also include freedom NOT to interact with others or to disassociate. If it didn't, the freedom is then a so called freedom and nothing more.

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Nobody is going to stop you if you want to disassociate. I hear "I don't want to pay tax" and droning about what freedom means to you is part of all of it, but perspective is missing. Your politics don't excuse others to get the benefits without citezinship. I have no idea.....I hope you land softly.

Rob Roy said:

Governments are not formed for the purpose of ensuring freedom, regardless of any flowery drippy statements that may be made about them and their organization.
They are formed and perpetuated to ensure that those that run them are in a position to use a given government as a vehicle to control the populace in a defined geographical area.

If a person is said to be free, a logical question then would be , "free from what"? Or, "free to do what"? Any real freedom would include the freedom to interact with others and should also include freedom NOT to interact with others or to disassociate. If it didn't, the freedom is then a so called freedom and nothing more.

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Freedom is an illusion......it lies in ones mind. You can disassociate.

Rob Roy said:

A true crime is when there is a demonstrable victimization of another individual(s).

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So if I go rob a bank, I'm not actually committing a "true crime". Those individuals who put their money in the bank are insured, so customers are not victims. The employees of the bank will still have a job the next day, so they aren't victims. The FDIC that will give the bank the money it lost in the robbery is only slightly affected, but two variables to consider are, one, the FDIC is not a person or persons, and two, the money being paid out is insurance money paid in, nothing demonstrable. Which leaves only the bank itself. Which we all know is not a person.

So you are either saying corporations are people or it is completely OK to rob a bank. Neither of which I can support.

NLXSK1 said:

The American government was formed to protect people's freedoms. The constitution is intended to be a limitation on government. It has been perverted into what it is today by the very people the founders warned us about.

Hopefully the experiment happens again sometime.

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I wonder if all the Fishes and Mooses have all their Freedoms?

NoDrama said:

Let me get this straight. People think Democracy is romantic? I don't get it. Democracy is 2 wolves and 1 sheep voting on whats for dinner, as long as 50.0001% of the other half vote one way, what we or anyone in the 49.9999% wants, frankly, doesn't matter.

So if 50.00001% of the people vote to have the other 49.99999% shot, and their wealth divided amongst the others, well that is what will happen. No one has any rights under Democracy.(Dumbocracy)

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Doesnt matter anyways, i believe many states were in favor in mmj legalizing and still its not ok. Voting doesnt really matter when the people who see the votes say fuck it and vote how THEY want. Not what WE want.

Talk about taxation without representation.

The top 5% of federal income tax paying Americans pay 70% of all the income taxes.
47% of American tax filers pay ZERO.

So when it comes time for elections on the federal government level, senators, congressmen and the executive branch who BTW, dictate US tax policy, the top 5% are overwhelmingly outnumbered.

The left know this and they also know people will elect politicians to go after the top tier tax payers because it won't effect their finances.
Democrats have been winning elections like this for years, it's like a dog trainer and dog, give um a treat, they'll do what you ask, tail wag and all.

beenthere said:

Talk about taxation without representation.

The top 5% of federal income tax paying Americans pay 70% of all the income taxes.
47% of American tax filers pay ZERO.

So when it comes time for elections on the federal government level, senators, congressmen and the executive branch who BTW, dictate US tax policy, the top 5% are overwhelmingly outnumbered.

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While bailing them out when they make terrible financial decisions. It seems you forget about those MASSIVE bailouts all those poor, put upon rich folk got.

kpmarine said:

While bailing them out when they make terrible financial decisions. It seems you forget about those MASSIVE bailouts all those poor, put upon rich folk got.

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Bro, none of the people in the 5% were bailed out of anything, to the contrary, they paid for the brunt of it.

NLXSK1 said:

The American government was formed to protect people's freedoms. The constitution is intended to be a limitation on government. It has been perverted into what it is today by the very people the founders warned us about.

Hopefully the experiment happens again sometime.

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If it makes you feel good to think that, I won't be the one to tell you there really isn't an Easter Bunny.

burgertime2010 said:

Nobody is going to stop you if you want to disassociate. I hear "I don't want to pay tax" and droning about what freedom means to you is part of all of it, but perspective is missing. Your politics don't excuse others to get the benefits without citezinship. I have no idea.....I hope you land softly.

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Your first statement is factually erroneous.

If you were listening you might hear that I don't think anybody should be forced to serve another, but all should have the opportunity to either provide or purchase services from whomever they want to. I don't want a person to be forced to pay for incarcerating others or killing others either, how about you?

If I'm droning turn your television off, although I'll admit deciphering what I'm saying might be harder than a soundbite on a platter from the idiot box.

My "politics" are the kind that don't rely on threats, so they are a bit unusual in the primitive day and age we live in.

burgertime2010 said:

Lately, the idea of Americans losing their voting priveledge while in a correctional facility or on parole seems to be fair enough for little outrage to surface. Despite the consequences prescribed at trial, loss of citezinship and having no input, no place to voice his part of this, are we acting ethically? Is this taxation without representation? I am at a place with this where the amount of unfit voters is not contested by American Democracy but never does this type of silencing get brought up. When did the biggest cornerstone of this country become part of a penalty? This system exists with taxation and without representation. I don't like it.

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Voting rights NEED to be restricted in a REPUBLIC, which is exactly what we are, NOT a democracy.

Why?

For the same reasons kids don't have a say, some people don't know any fucking better, and can't think beyond their next meal.

If you don't pay into a system, and simply LEECH off the system, than why in the fuck should your dumb ass have a say in where ANY tax dollars go? You shouldn't.

If you can't even speak the fucking language, let alone read it, why the fuck should you have any say about written law?

Voting today is nothing more than a contest between which side can get the most morons to vote them into office, and that's a fucking STUPID way to run a nation.

But what the fuck do I know, right?

rob roy ruins another thread with his teenage angst.

the only taxation without representation happens in washington DC.

/thread.

UncleBuck said:

rob roy ruins another thread with his teenage angst.

the only taxation without representation happens in washington DC.

/thread.

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If wisdom was weed, you'd be a roach.

Rob Roy said:

If it makes you feel good to think that, I won't be the one to tell you there really isn't an Easter Bunny.

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No matter what you think there has to be some form of government.

Rob Roy said:

If wisdom was weed, you'd be a roach.

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*were

it's a matter of proper verb tense agreement.

Wilksey said:

Voting rights NEED to be restricted in a REPUBLIC, which is exactly what we are, NOT a democracy.

Why?

For the same reasons kids don't have a say, some people don't know any fucking better, and can't think beyond their next meal.

If you don't pay into a system, and simply LEECH off the system, than why in the fuck should your dumb ass have a say in where ANY tax dollars go? You shouldn't.

If you can't even speak the fucking language, let alone read it, why the fuck should you have any say about written law?

Voting today is nothing more than a contest between which side can get the most morons to vote them into office, and that's a fucking STUPID way to run a nation.

But what the fuck do I know, right?

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Correct now run along

NLXSK1 said:

No matter what you think there has to be some form of government.

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Sure, you should have your form of government, I'm all for you to have the kind you want.