Tags High Efficiency Lighting Garden

I have been super busy and haven't got my shit quite together. I'm really just waiting to get some good clones at this point. No sense in starting with something just to get going. I want this to be an epic run.

In the meantime, I got my couple of bean genetics to play with that I left with PG while I was getting settled. I told him to not stress about them too much and just keep them alive. He probably only watered them once by the look of them. They were all in pretty bad shape, but technically alive.

When I left there were 4 conspiracy kush's, 4 professor chaos's, a nurse jackie clone in a 2gal and the nurse mainlined mom in the 5gal. Some males have shown and I just killed a runt chaos for space so it's 3 conspiracies and one chaos, plus the jackies(clone and ML'ed mom).

I toped the mom to start 16 heads before I left but PG put it into flower right after I topped it/left. He had it on the outside of a 4x4(so in the 5x5 space) of a 600hps...so it was really lacking light. It is about 5 weeks into flower and looks lame and super small. But it smells up my whole yard so it has potential. Here it is yesterday(first day I got it). I split a fork when covering it for the drive home but it should be fine.

I will just leave it outside and see how it finishes up. She was getting 1300+µmols at about 9am this morning. Amazing how much light is outside. Even the bests 1000w struggle for that.


It's not much, but they give me something to look at and play. As pithily as they look, I have actually noticed a difference in just one day of being outside and under a at120 getting ≈700µmols, but I have been taking them outside during the day. PG really neglected them, but did me a favor and kept them alive. I really just want a solid female of the conspiracy kush.


Nurse Jackie clone from the ML'ed mom. It was in with PG's moms so it was the best of them all. I will mom her out and be my go if I can't get good clones soon enough. I really like the leaves of her and the smell of the one flowering.


Professor chaos#2. Only chaos I wanted to keep. The leaves were just so nice I had to keep it. It was topped before I left it...and now after the second node post topping, it is staggering already. One of the healthier ones and is doing well in direct sun already.


Cospiracy #2. It was in a 2inch pot when I got it. It barely fit the rock wool cube in it. Like I said I just want a great conspiracy female so lets hope for this one.


Conspiracy #3. Not sure on sex and thought about killing. Decided to just deep hack top it and try to get it to mainline. Still could be a boy though, it was the biggest/tallest and pretty stretched out(pre-hacking).


Consiracy #4. The only confirmed female. It's topped before I left it but now I lolled just because it was so scraggily and I wanted to get the tops to start growing again. If it is the only girl, I will just get enough clones to make a run and not even test the mom(sketchy but I want it).


Platinum cookies. Just to keep the genetic quiver interesting. Also was in a 2inch pot when I got her.



All these girls could use some of the indagro ESC treatment but I am saving it for my real run.

Franjan I will babble about Apache here,

You are right about apache's best costumers, they are people/companies that buy 20-100 lights at a time. And those are the people that apache really targets and deals with mostly. When buying that many lights, AT has no problem giving the better price. The discount I get(rbk331) is literally just a few dollar over cost on the AT600. They are not a very good money making company...more like a great write off. They keep the big costumers happier(Stanford, NASA, greenhouses) and they keep AT a float enough to still make the best lights. Sad they aren't totally pushing the business side of it, but that's the way it is. The lights still kick ass.


And speaking of greenhouses, I can see why supplemental is still so important even with the almighty sun.
Today was cloudy...

Yesterday at the same time it was hitting over 1300µmols.

So I was at home depot and couldn't help myself, they had all the cree globes displayed. I needed bulbs for normal house lights so I got one of each cree globe color(SW, WW, CW) to see what one we liked. Mostly just to see the diff in WW and SW. The CW I knew I wanted for my clones.
The WW and SW were $7.89 and the CW was like $13. I am not sure if these are the good ones that captain is killing with. They had a high cri version...will probably get it for normal house lights. But the normal cri versions were cheaper probably have higher output.


Are these the good ones with the xt-e's


Wasn't even trying but the silicone coating pealed right off



I grabbed my quantum meter and took a few measurements to see what's up. All the test were done at 12" from sensor to the bulb(up in the reflector)



Cool White Cree single globe

Center: 281µmols
6" out: 45µmols


Warm White Cree single globe (took it late so forgot the outside measurement). I was pretty surprised to see the WW putting out more µmols than the CW. Not a huge diff...but considering the higher lm/w of the cw...but now that I think about it the WW has more diodes in the tower right?? that would be why...and maybe the .5w. So I guess they are pretty similar just depends on the spectral needs.

Center: 318µmols




Cool White CFL single bulb

Center: 143µmols
6" out: 34µmols




Twin CFL's- surprising low when bulbs in this position...and it doesn't get better anywhere in the foot print.

Center: 99µmols




Twin Cree's 1CW and 1WW. I though that they would be really good in this position but they were no where close to the single bulb in the vert position.

Center: 87µmols




The reflector could have to do with the lower performance in the 45* position compare vert but still it's pretty big difference.

After seeing these numbers I think 2-3globes/sqft would give some solid µmols with a good coverage.

Next little experiment is to pop the globe off and see if it improves output to changes spread. And to make sure I got the xt-e's. This whole switching chips is fucking with us.

Nice . .. Been waiting for par measurements. I can't tell which diodes. Try taking a reading from the sides with no reflector. They screw right off those clamp lights easily.

hyroot said:

Nice . .. Been waiting for par measurements. I can't tell which diodes. Try taking a reading from the sides with no reflector. They screw right off those clamp lights easily.

Click to expand...

That was my first thought and why I thought the 45* twins would be good. But measuring the side didn't make a difference. I got within inches of the side of the single CW while up in the reflector(should be even higher reading) and the highest it got to was 800µmols...that was literally like 2"-3". I am thinking the globe is doing it. I will play more tomorrow when the GF isn't giving me the stare down for playing with lights all the time.


The one thing that is for sure is the output power so much better than cfl's. Which will make many budget growers happy to know for sure. How many newbies(and some not so new) are growing with cfl wen they could do the same setup with these and get some great performance. For the same price as a CFL too is hard to argue. Truly game changers. Glad to see it for myself.

EDIT:
quick thought/note to self... getting 70% of light from all the chips in the vert position might be better than 99% of the light from just half the chips in the horizontal or angled position.
More testing is needed.

tags420 said:

So I was at home depot and couldn't help myself, they had all the cree globes displayed. I needed bulbs for normal house lights so I got one of each cree globe color(SW, WW, CW) to see what one we liked. Mostly just to see the diff in WW and SW. The CW I knew I wanted for my clones.
The WW and SW were $7.89 and the CW was like $13. I am not sure if these are the good ones that captain is killing with. They had a high cri version...will probably get it for normal house lights. But the normal cri versions were cheaper probably have higher output.


Are these the good ones with the xt-e's
View attachment 2876096

Wasn't even trying but the silicone coating pealed right off
View attachment 2876103


I grabbed my quantum meter and took a few measurements to see what's up. All the test were done at 12" from sensor to the bulb(up in the reflector)
View attachment 2876112


Cool White Cree single globe

Center: 281µmols
6" out: 45µmols
View attachment 2876097View attachment 2876098View attachment 2876099

Warm White Cree single globe (took it late so forgot the outside measurement). I was pretty surprised to see the WW putting out more µmols than the CW. Not a huge diff...but considering the higher lm/w of the cw...but now that I think about it the WW has more diodes in the tower right?? that would be why...and maybe the .5w. So I guess they are pretty similar just depends on the spectral needs.

Center: 318µmols
View attachment 2876105View attachment 2876106



Cool White CFL single bulb

Center: 143µmols
6" out: 34µmols


View attachment 2876100View attachment 2876101View attachment 2876102

Twin CFL's- surprising low when bulbs in this position...and it doesn't get better anywhere in the foot print.

Center: 99µmols

View attachment 2876107View attachment 2876108


Twin Cree's 1CW and 1WW. I though that they would be really good in this position but they were no where close to the single bulb in the vert position.

Center: 87µmols

View attachment 2876110View attachment 2876111


The reflector could have to do with the lower performance in the 45* position compare vert but still it's pretty big difference.

After seeing these numbers I think 2-3globes/sqft would give some solid µmols with a good coverage.

Next little experiment is to pop the globe off and see if it improves output to changes spread. And to make sure I got the xt-e's. This whole switching chips is fucking with us.

Click to expand...

Great post, man!

Yes! Brother tags you and I are on the same wavelength my friend. I want to see how much of a rise in PAR we can get out of supping with these badboys when taching them onto our main source..

basically stacking in between tops

it is wild about he WW, even just the fact of more phosphor is used to create them is enough to guess less umols, I thought.

PetFlora said:

tag420, Awesome 411

How about posting it under CFLs, too.

I am always getting on those boys about the environmental problems with cfls. Even mention that the led globes have much better umols + extreme long life, but your work here, should open more eyes. Hope the mods make it a sticky

Click to expand...

That's a good idea. I want to do some more test and then get it together and possibly throw a video together. Then it might even be sticky worthy...specially if some of you guys who have growth experience chime in too. I would also like to make sure I know what chips are in mine and then later on maybe get the other and test it too.

Scotch089 said:

Yes! Brother tags you and I are on the same wavelength my friend. I want to see how much of a rise in PAR we can get out of supping with these badboys when taching them onto our main source..

basically stacking in between tops

it is wild about he WW, even just the fact of more phosphor is used to create them is enough to guess less umols, I thought.

Click to expand...

Totally agree bro.
I only tested the CW at first because I thought it was the no brainer it was the better output...then when I started doing the 45*twin's I needed another cree and all I had was WW or SW(SW seemed the warmest of all to me haven't tested it yet though) so I grabbed WW and thought it would bring the reading down...and the reading was so much lower than I expected, I tested the WW solo to see how much it was holding it back...but as we saw, it was the superior output, even with the extra phosphor.

They really are perfect supplement lights. Hyroots tower in the middle would be killer with all globes. Or putting it at the base/forks of a mainlined plant pointing up. Endless ways to use these.

I really wasn't expecting them to get those good of numbers. I remember testing the t8 tubes...they did about the same as t5's, but half the wattage...really good but not exactly changing the world fast enough, specially at 3X-8X the cost of a t5 bulb. But the globes are a serious steep up from the old tech counterparts. 3X the output using 1/3 the wattage and same price(sometimes cheaper)...what's not to love.

A little more playing.

The CW has the XB's(damn it). AT the base of the bulb I can see up in it.



I can't see up into the WW and I want to take the globe off without just breaking it, so I can't see what chips are in it.
How do I get the globe off cleanly???

I put the WW in a socket with no reflector to do the side testing. I may not know the chips but based on last nights test, I figured I use the winner.

Here is just a couple inches away but level with the chips...it really was holding steady at ~480µmols, but did spike a few times like below(584µmols) and up to ~700µmols once.



About 12" underneath like I did last light...only 6µmols



Here is about 12" like I did last night but level with the chips...35µmol.



I draw a few hypothesis from all these little test.
-The tower design is what is holding these back. Because of the omni-directional nature, there is no way to let the light blend/add up from all the chips. Pretty much the light is being dispersed too much.
-You need to run them extremely close(which is possible, heat wise) to really see a benefit from the horizontal position. I did not test it with a reflector for the side face away(what would be reflector) like the custom one sided ones, but it could make a big difference(Sounds like I found my next test).
-The cheap clamp light reflector with a single bulb vert style was actually a pretty effective and did make a substantial in what is directed at the canopy.

225* in oven for 20 min. I held the bottom with oven mit and twisted top off slowly with dry rag. Just be careful taking the bulb off and not hitting diodes. If it doesn't twist off easy then it's not ready. After melting awhile you might be able to look up inside if you want to leave globe.

RedCarpetMatches said:

225* in oven for 20 min. I held the bottom with oven mit and twisted top off slowly with dry rag. Just be careful taking the bulb off and not hitting diodes. If it doesn't twist off easy then it's not ready. After melting awhile you might be able to look up inside if you want to leave globe.

Click to expand...

Perfect...that's what I read on the tear down article, but I was thinking they said put it in 200*water in the oven for 20min...but that just seemed so wrong...must have been stoned(go figure). All makes sense now.

Thanks

I tried 200 for 30 min and it wasn't enough.

Well out of the four WWs I got 3 XBs and one XT.

EDIT: Sorry meant CW

RedCarpetMatches said:

Well out of the four WWs I got 3 XBs and one XT.

Click to expand...

That is not what I want to hear. WHY CREE WHY!!!

tags420 said:

That is not what I want to hear. WHY CREE WHY!!!

Click to expand...

I'm going to call and bitch tomorrow. Nice guys finish last. I'll just say three of the four bulbs look awesome and one looks like shit. I might take the XT apart and try to mod it to make the lights forward facing.

Sounds like the reflector with one bulb above the canopy seems to be the way to go. Vert you would have to have them close like cfl's . For the cw that spectrum looks better with the x- be's . The ww looks better with the xt-e's Im not anywhere near any country. When I get paid I'll grab a few and see. I'm thinking of startin a 3x3 tent for new strains and use a combo of cw and ww in white reptile reflectors. That will be in Jan probably when I get new strains.

I think they work great in the white reflectors!!! The white reflectors are pricey tho. 2 fit just right with an extender and Y. These would be great for growing. I was thinking about a scrog with Ys tied to the net so they don't move from fans. Reflectors on top and Ys near canopy.

hyroot said:

http://ledsmagazine.com/news/10/9/6

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What a minute...should we be leaving the globes on?! Maybe I'm missing something here.