stem strength

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

1st grow
party cups
seedling soil
foxfam trio and superthrive
white widow and UFO
2ft 4bulb t5ho.
about 3 inches tall
14 days from when the plant showed above ground
there are the 2 coyts, the first leaves, the second leaves which are now sprouting their trips. and theres another set of leaves about 1cm long coming out. the top of the plants look great, growing fast (to me) and there seems to be only one problem, the stem seems to be slightly weak for all the leaves up top. the fan i have blowing on them is on low and there quite a bit of swinging going on.. is there any special nute i should try?? or just leave them be?

any help appreciated,
S-D-T

eidt : plants are actualy only about 1-2 inches tall.... they stand on their own fine, just have loads of swaying, and im concerned.

also, where should these plants be in their development in the 14 days after they have sprouted

mj123 · Nov 4, 2010

I use those little shscubob.stic`s thay work great..... :leaf:

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

mj123 said:
I use those little shscubob.stic`s thay work great.....

thanks!.. i really do not want to have to support them, ive heard from numerous growers that you shouldnt have to support them, what am i doing wrong?

Smucker G · Nov 4, 2010

sourdieseltech said:
1st grow
party cups
seedling soil
foxfam trio and superthrive
white widow and UFO
2ft 4bulb t5ho.
about 3 inches tall
14 days from when the plant showed above ground
there are the 2 coyts, the first leaves, the second leaves which are now sprouting their trips. and theres another set of leaves about 1cm long coming out. the top of the plants look great, growing fast (to me) and there seems to be only one problem, the stem seems to be slightly weak for all the leaves up top. the fan i have blowing on them is on low and there quite a bit of swinging going on.. is there any special nute i should try?? or just leave them be?

any help appreciated,
S-D-T

eidt : plants are actualy only about 1-2 inches tall.... they stand on their own fine, just have loads of swaying, and im concerned.

also, where should these plants be in their development in the 14 days after they have sprouted

Put the light closer and they wont stretch as much.

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

Smucker G said:
Put the light closer and they wont stretch as much.

the light is roughly 2 inches from the tops of the plants.... even closer??

Brick Top · Nov 4, 2010

Thin stretched stems normally are the result of lighting being too high off the tops of the seedlings and or lack of sufficient air movement causing lateral motion which causes stems to increase in size, caliper size. Weak seedlings can be staked but not as in tied tightly to a stake, something like a small stake with a loose piece of plant tape or thin yarn looped around the stems but not holding the stems tightly to the stakes. The seedlings need room to sway so the stems will increase in thickness/caliper size.

Another option is to replant the seedlings so there is roughly a quarter inch to a half inch of stem remaining above the soil. The rest of the weak replanted stem that is then below the soil level will push out roots increasing the plants root-mass.

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

Brick Top said:
Thin stretched stems normally are the result of lighting being too high off the tops of the seedlings and or lack of sufficient air movement causing lateral motion which causes stems to increase in size, caliper size. Weak seedlings can be staked but not as in tied tightly to a stake, something like a small stake with a loose piece of plant tape or thin yarn looped around the stems but not holding the stems tightly to the stakes. The seedlings need room to sway so the stems will increase in thickness/caliper size.

Another option is to replant the seedlings so there is roughly a quarter inch to a half inch of stem remaining above the soil. The rest of the weak replanted stem that is then below the soil level will push out roots increasing the plants root-mass.

Thanks! I guess i have no choice but to lower the light.. they light is about 1 inch from the tops now

Smucker G · Nov 4, 2010

As long as it's not burning them it's not too close.

rhino1111 · Nov 4, 2010

if your vegging with fluorecent 1"-1.5" is perfect. 2" shouldnt make them stretch alot though.

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

rhino1111 said:
if your vegging with fluorecent 1"-1.5" is perfect. 2" shouldnt make them stretch alot though.

personally i dont think they have stretched that much, they arent that tall yet there just seems to be more leaf than stem lol

Smucker G · Nov 4, 2010

Can you post a pic?

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

Smucker G said:
Can you post a pic?

i will put up a cell phone pic, my neighbor has a good camera and when he gets home i will borrow it for better pics..

give me a few mins an ill put up the cell pic

rhino1111 · Nov 4, 2010

sourdieseltech said:
personally i dont think they have stretched that much, they arent that tall yet there just seems to be more leaf than stem lol

stems are very weak until the 3rd node of leafs develop. then the stem starts to harden. as long as the seedling can support itself its fine. maybe move the fan further away for less wiggle. move the fan closer when the 3rd node set start coming in.

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

rhino1111 said:
stems are very weak until the 3rd node of leafs develop. then the stem starts to harden. as long as the seedling can support itself its fine. maybe move the fan further away for less wiggle. move the fan closer when the 3rd node set start coming in.

now THATS what i wanted to hear!... i will do that also.

im going to put the light at 1 - 1/4 inches from the plants and move the fan a little further away..

rhino1111 · Nov 4, 2010

sourdieseltech said:
now THATS what i wanted to hear!... i will do that also.

im going to put the light at 1 - 1/4 inches from the plants and move the fan a little further away..

keep us updated man.

GL and HF

Brick Top · Nov 4, 2010

sourdieseltech said:
now THATS what i wanted to hear!... i will do that also.

im going to put the light at 1 - 1/4 inches from the plants and move the fan a little further away..

With the additional info added I would say your lighting is not too high and what you might have are vibrant seedlings that are leafing out quicker than others do and the stem strength - leaf weight ratio is just not what is needed. I would keep the fan fairly close but aim it not directly at the plants and instead make it swirl around them, or oscillate back and forth across them so the leaves to not act like sails and catch too much wind and risk forcing them over. That or replant deeper as I mentioned earlier. That is simple and safe to do with seedlings so it is a viable option and the new stem growth will be stronger.

I did not notice, possibly because I missed it, but if they are an indica strain and have fat little leaves they will catch a bunch of wind and could be blown over, so a swirling wind or oscillating wind might be better in this case than a constant direct wind.

rhino1111 · Nov 4, 2010

Brick Top said:
With the additional info added I would say your lighting is not too high and what you might have are vibrant seedlings that are leafing out quicker than others do and the stem strength - leaf weight ratio is just not what is needed. I would keep the fan fairly close but aim it not directly at the plants and instead make it swirl around them, or oscillate back and forth across them so the leaves to not act like sails and catch too much wind and risk forcing them over. That or replant deeper as I mentioned earlier. That is simple and safe to do with seedlings so it is a viable option and the new stem growth will be stronger.

I did not notice, possibly because I missed it, but if they are an indica strain and have fat little leaves they will catch a bunch of wind and could be blown over, so a swirling wind or oscillating wind might be better in this case than a constant direct wind.

moving the fans closer would make it worst if the stems cant support the foliage. but i agree planting them deeper for more support would be smart.

Brick Top · Nov 4, 2010

rhino1111 said:
moving the fans closer would make it worst if the stems cant support the foliage. but i agree planting them deeper for more support would be smart.

I did not say, "moving the fans closer." I said; "I would keep the fan fairly close but aim it not directly at the plants and instead make it swirl around them, or oscillate back and forth across them so the leaves to not act like sails and catch too much wind and risk forcing them over." That is different than; "moving the fans closer." It means keeping the fan or fans where they are but aiming it or them differently and or making them oscillate, if they are oscillating fan or fans of course.

Canabian420 · Nov 4, 2010

just keep the fan blowing on them but not 24/7 turn it on for a few hours..then off. then back on etc..that will better stimulate the wind and thats with any plant.

sourdieseltech · Nov 4, 2010

Smucker G said:
Can you post a pic?

here are the girls... i hope

The runt (white widow)

White Widow 1

UFO (sourcream)

Dont know where the yellow/white tips came from, any help is appreciated.

S-D-T

EDIT: Dont mind the pics of the smaller seedlings, that was last attempt.

stem strength

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