VRZ711
Well-Known Member
i am using frozen water bottles, also using subculture B and M hope it will help, thank you for your help on this.
Starting up DWC First time, need help with Nutes and enzymes.
- Thread starter VRZ711
- Start date
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- Tags
- cal mag dwc gh nutrient trio
do you make tea with your subculture?
i make a "tea" i guess it's called. i use a half gallon container that can be sealed. i dump 1/4 tsp each of M and B as well as a tbsp of molasses and toss in an air stone. let bubble for 2 days then refrigerate. add 1/2 cup per gallon per week. stays good for up to 10 days. it makes the subculture last waaay longer.
i use the GH flora in the reduced Lucas formula, armor SI, and calimagic in this ratio:
per gallon
2.5 ml armor si
4 ml flora micro
8 ml flora bloom
2.5-5 ml calimagic(depending on what water)
i use the reduced formula as the stronger solution is meant for more powerful lights. im currently using about 175 watts of cob lights. if i did more like 400w+ i would double the micro and bloom.
EDIT: the micro and bloom can be replaced by GH nova series bloom. or you could just use the 2 part for grow then bloom. the grow is just not necessary(as i understand) though.
EDIT2: with this setup your rez should be fine up to 75 degrees Fahrenheit.
i make a "tea" i guess it's called. i use a half gallon container that can be sealed. i dump 1/4 tsp each of M and B as well as a tbsp of molasses and toss in an air stone. let bubble for 2 days then refrigerate. add 1/2 cup per gallon per week. stays good for up to 10 days. it makes the subculture last waaay longer.
i use the GH flora in the reduced Lucas formula, armor SI, and calimagic in this ratio:
per gallon
2.5 ml armor si
4 ml flora micro
8 ml flora bloom
2.5-5 ml calimagic(depending on what water)
i use the reduced formula as the stronger solution is meant for more powerful lights. im currently using about 175 watts of cob lights. if i did more like 400w+ i would double the micro and bloom.
EDIT: the micro and bloom can be replaced by GH nova series bloom. or you could just use the 2 part for grow then bloom. the grow is just not necessary(as i understand) though.
EDIT2: with this setup your rez should be fine up to 75 degrees Fahrenheit.
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Wondering how you did you DIY chiller ?Why are you using top feed? No need with DWC. Hand water with a turkey baster a couple times a day for the first few days until roots are out of the net pots and they're fine. Need coloured lines if you are going to top feed. I run nutes from my tubs up into the cooler tank on my DIY chiller and they were getting that algae growing in them too but it didn't seem to hurt anything. Can always just wrap electrical tape around them.
I used to use peroxide to keep the nasties at bay until I built the chiller from a water cooler so don't do that any more. I've always used AN nutes since '01 and now with the pH Perfect stuff it's even easier and I never bother checking pH.
I've never use any of these inoculants so can't help you there.
Good luck!
Thanks in advance
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
I dug up a few pics for ya.Wondering how you did you DIY chiller ?
I was gifted an old water cooler that sat around for a couple years then I came up with an idea to use it as a nute chiller as my DWC tub was running too warm. First off took the plastic parts out of the cooling tank so I could run a coil of 3/8" plastic tubing inside to circulate the nutes thru from the tub. You need about 20' of the tubing as 6 - 8' will just be used to run from the tub to the cooler and back then the rest coiled up inside the tank. The two holes just to the left of the tank are to run the tubing thru but could just as easily gone out the back. Hindsight is always 20/20.
The fountain pump I got for this was my only expense and one a little bigger might work better but this did the job well enough. It's rated 110GPH/450LPH. To keep roots out of the pump I cut a piece of window screen and used a glue gun to stick it on. A larger piece of screen could be wrapped around the whole pump and secured around the outlet tube instead.
I packed wall insulation around the tank to keep the cool in, then filled the tank with automotive anti-freeze so it wouldn't freeze up in there. I used that insulation around the tub too and just wrapped baling wire around to hold it in place. The little pump runs 24/7 but there is a timer on the cooler as the nutes got too cold if it ran all the time. Had the timer on the pump first but the nutes froze up at the bottom of the tank and I had to wait a day for it to thaw out. Cooler would be on 15 min every hour when the lights were on and 15 every two hours when the lights were out. Kept it all between 65 - 68F nice and steady. The return line should be a little longer than needed to reach the bottom of the tub/rez so that it's not discharging right beside the pump and just going round and round.
That's about it. Easy-peasy.
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VRZ711
Well-Known Member
i am using springs water, it has cal mag already and using flora trio, recommended dose less than 5 ml of each per 3.5 gallons of water.
for the subculture, i add i spoon of each on every res change directly to the water, but i guess i will start doing your tea, for the molasses, can i replace with 1 cube of brown sugar ?
thank you so much for taking the time to help me.
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
You're not planning to use sugar in DWC are you? It usually ends in tears.
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
I've never used any beneficial bacteria in any of the many DWC grows I've done. If you can keep the nute temps 72F or below you should never get root rot. Grows I've seen that use them are usually OK too but when you toss sugars in the bacteria population can explode and it all turns into a gooey mess. I always used a bit of peroxide twice a week but stopped doing that with better nutes that contain organic compounds like amino acids that the peroxide can damage. If you do DWC with hydro nutes like Peters that are just salts then peroxide is fine.
The only time I ever got root rot was when I used real dirt to root cuttings that were supposed to go to a friend to grow in soil then he up and died so I used them in a tub. That was almost 14 years ago and I beat it back with peroxide and most of the plants survived and I still ended up with a decent yield.
I also never clean tubs out during a grow and have clear nutes when the grow is all done and I'm cleaning out the tub. I can almost always re-use my airstones too. No goo anywhere and a quick wipe with a soapy cloth is all it takes to clean it out. I think with bennies you end up with slime in there that usually doesn't cause a problem tho airstones tend to plug up.
A little buildup on the airstone about two weeks before cropping and the nutes had not got changed even once during that grow.
The only time I ever got root rot was when I used real dirt to root cuttings that were supposed to go to a friend to grow in soil then he up and died so I used them in a tub. That was almost 14 years ago and I beat it back with peroxide and most of the plants survived and I still ended up with a decent yield.
I also never clean tubs out during a grow and have clear nutes when the grow is all done and I'm cleaning out the tub. I can almost always re-use my airstones too. No goo anywhere and a quick wipe with a soapy cloth is all it takes to clean it out. I think with bennies you end up with slime in there that usually doesn't cause a problem tho airstones tend to plug up.
A little buildup on the airstone about two weeks before cropping and the nutes had not got changed even once during that grow.
kisiel
Member
Okay,I've never used any beneficial bacteria in any of the many DWC grows I've done. If you can keep the nute temps 72F or below you should never get root rot. Grows I've seen that use them are usually OK too but when you toss sugars in the bacteria population can explode and it all turns into a gooey mess. I always used a bit of peroxide twice a week but stopped doing that with better nutes that contain organic compounds like amino acids that the peroxide can damage. If you do DWC with hydro nutes like Peters that are just salts then peroxide is fine.
The only time I ever got root rot was when I used real dirt to root cuttings that were supposed to go to a friend to grow in soil then he up and died so I used them in a tub. That was almost 14 years ago and I beat it back with peroxide and most of the plants survived and I still ended up with a decent yield.
I also never clean tubs out during a grow and have clear nutes when the grow is all done and I'm cleaning out the tub. I can almost always re-use my airstones too. No goo anywhere and a quick wipe with a soapy cloth is all it takes to clean it out. I think with bennies you end up with slime in there that usually doesn't cause a problem tho airstones tend to plug up.
A little buildup on the airstone about two weeks before cropping and the nutes had not got changed even once during that grow.
View attachment 3876642
not sure but I think I get it, so the main way to deal with root rot is to have stable water temp, and in case when slime still shows sight of attacking, than its best to use H2o2 to thereservoir to clear organic matter including algas, NOT benebactrias because if there is already slime than it will "ONLY?" get worse if sugar is inside solution ?
And if our reservoir is full synthetic without sugar in it than would they fight with slim ?
And So the benefibacterias are to prevent of geting root rot but if we make a mistake and will add sugar stuff than it may end slimed instead.
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OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
Sugars are used in soil grows to feed the bacteria and fungus that make the food the plant needs to grow more than to feed the plant. If you use peroxide then hopefully no bacteria grow in the rez and everything runs clear all the time.
When you use hydro nutes bacteria aren't needed to convert organic matter into the salts that plants feed on. Hydro nutes supply those salts directly to the plant so no middle man is needed. I always used the 35% food grade peroxide at 0.5ml/L twice a week to keep everything clean.
If you are going to use bennies then you should go really easy with any carbohydrates like sugar or molasses. If the bacteria multiply out of control hit them with 4ml/L.
When you use hydro nutes bacteria aren't needed to convert organic matter into the salts that plants feed on. Hydro nutes supply those salts directly to the plant so no middle man is needed. I always used the 35% food grade peroxide at 0.5ml/L twice a week to keep everything clean.
If you are going to use bennies then you should go really easy with any carbohydrates like sugar or molasses. If the bacteria multiply out of control hit them with 4ml/L.
VRZ711
Well-Known Member
I will have my genetics seeds soon
, then i should not make any simple mistake, my first grow in DWC was ruined (was bag seeds so didnt care that much anyway), i didn't pay attention to the water temps, there was lots or light leaks, so i got root rot first day, so preparing for the new grow now, i have soaked Rockwool plugs into water and added Subculture b and m, less than 1 gram each and added a tiny bit of sugar, and added an air stone, ill let them sit for 48 hours, before i put my seeds in(after paper towel germination), what do you think boss? looks good? or i will mess things up ? now I'
m using iced water bottles to keeps temps in control. and using the tea just as extra protection.PS: i didn't put any drop of nutes, should i ?
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
I don't know about putting your beans in rw while it's soaking like that. They are usually just kept moist in a dome with pH adjusted water until they have good roots and some true leaves then put into net pots with an inch of hydroton balls under then so the cube isn't submerged in water.
But are just letting them soak for now and plan to squeeze out the excess water and put them in a dome when you put your seeds in them?
I don't use rw but I think a little bit of something like Thrive is used in the water so I don't know if what you're doing is OK for sprouts.
But are just letting them soak for now and plan to squeeze out the excess water and put them in a dome when you put your seeds in them?
I don't use rw but I think a little bit of something like Thrive is used in the water so I don't know if what you're doing is OK for sprouts.
what oldmeduser said.
i want to post some pics. they may help or you may ignore them. it is up to you, but i like to share. i also like to help.
these are pics of my root tea using the same microbes as you in this method >Link< i actually changed it a bit and bred them in my nute solution before filling my buckets. im doing this as a test and may never do it again or may keep it going for the foreseeable future. what i will say is that i have never gone through PH down faster.
here is how i start my seeds. i soak the rockwool in tap for 20 minutes, then toss the seeds in and cover them. i then put the cube under something that acts as a humidity dome and toss them on top of my fridge. the seeds shown are bell pepper seeds.
i want to post some pics. they may help or you may ignore them. it is up to you, but i like to share. i also like to help.
these are pics of my root tea using the same microbes as you in this method >Link< i actually changed it a bit and bred them in my nute solution before filling my buckets. im doing this as a test and may never do it again or may keep it going for the foreseeable future. what i will say is that i have never gone through PH down faster.
here is how i start my seeds. i soak the rockwool in tap for 20 minutes, then toss the seeds in and cover them. i then put the cube under something that acts as a humidity dome and toss them on top of my fridge. the seeds shown are bell pepper seeds.
i ran out of space for pics, but here is one of some tomato seeds.
as soon as the seeds sprout, i put them in their final media. for hydro, i would toss them strait into the hydroton, and for soil, i will toss them strait into their dirt. transplants may occur again if they outgrow their pot.
EDIT:
ill post some links every newb should have
https://www.rollitup.org/t/dwc-information-thread-for-everyone.473122/
http://www.growweedeasy.com/scrog-tutorial#topping
http://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/gardening-with-hydrogen-peroxide.html
http://www.lucasformula.com/ <be careful, there are two different strengths of this formula that depend on light and co2 levels. if you are running led, cfl, or <400w hps without co2, use the weaker strength formula. otherwise you will get bad nutrient burn.
as soon as the seeds sprout, i put them in their final media. for hydro, i would toss them strait into the hydroton, and for soil, i will toss them strait into their dirt. transplants may occur again if they outgrow their pot.
EDIT:
using bennies creates your own beneficial slime that will attack invasive species. they also help with nutrient uptake by breaking down and making nutrients easier to absorb without destroying the nutrients. they also allow you to run a much warmer system.
ill post some links every newb should have
https://www.rollitup.org/t/dwc-information-thread-for-everyone.473122/
http://www.growweedeasy.com/scrog-tutorial#topping
http://www.using-hydrogen-peroxide.com/gardening-with-hydrogen-peroxide.html
http://www.lucasformula.com/ <be careful, there are two different strengths of this formula that depend on light and co2 levels. if you are running led, cfl, or <400w hps without co2, use the weaker strength formula. otherwise you will get bad nutrient burn.
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VRZ711
Well-Known Member
yes sure thats what im planning to do, just soaking the rockwool until i get my seeds, i will use paper towel, then plant them and cover with dome, until they have little roots coming out, then ill transplant into the DWC
VRZ711
Well-Known Member
i would never ignore all your efforts, on the contrary i loved all the help and perfect info you have provided me with, and based on your comment earlier, i started brewing the tea with subculture m and b and little brown sugar, i want the bennnies to colonize inside the rockwool just before i put the seeds inside. and after that i can place them on my laptop charger.
To give more details about my setup,
- I have 10 Gallon res with 3 lids on top, completely light sealed using aluminum foil.
- im using hydroton as medium and rockwool plugs
- the area is well ventilated temps don't go above 70
- lights 250 watts MH for veg and 250 HPS for flower
- also i will add plenty of CFLs maybe 6 more
- i have small 15 watts LED, i will use also.
- there is plenty of CO2 in the air as im a smoker and the grow room ventilation will suck all the CO2 from my room to the grow room
- i have GH flora Trio only
- i have subculture B and M
- calibrated PH meter
- i use frozen water bottles to keep temps cool in the res
- i will grow Auto Caramelicious Feminized from MSNL
- Humidity is 35-50% as i live by the sea
- i have top feed line for the 3 pots
- i keep the grow room clean all the time
- and i use fountain water with cal mag in it PPM is 130
- 2 airstones with powerful 2 outlets air pump
and i appreciate your help for my first grow.
OldMedUser
Well-Known Member
That's good advice right there. With intense lighting and CO2 you can run way higher levels of nutes that would burn the crap out of your plants with lower light. Same thing with high temps and low RH. Nute levels need to be much lower as the plant is transpiring much more water and will pull in more nutes than it can put to use growing plant material so they get stored in the leaves leading to toxic salts buildup.
+++ Reps!
AlmightyKingSpider
Well-Known Member
Running that water cooler diy chiller. I run a 5x5 gorilla with 4 black square 4gallon pots with a 30 gallon outside of tent. Room 78 F 60 Rh. rez and plants from 55 F to 65 F is my highest with 16 T5 mixed spectrum 6400k5000k4100kWhy are you using top feed? No need with DWC. Hand water with a turkey baster a couple times a day for the first few days until roots are out of the net pots and they're fine. Need coloured lines if you are going to top feed. I run nutes from my tubs up into the cooler tank on my DIY chiller and they were getting that algae growing in them too but it didn't seem to hurt anything. Can always just wrap electrical tape around them.
I used to use peroxide to keep the nasties at bay until I built the chiller from a water cooler so don't do that any more. I've always used AN nutes since '01 and now with the pH Perfect stuff it's even easier and I never bother checking pH.
I've never use any of these inoculants so can't help you there.
Good luck!
AlmightyKingSpider
Well-Known Member
I've got the coil off the cup in double vacuum ziplock bags sitting in my rez on a timer that gives it 30 mins brakes. As low as 50 to the highest 65 F°I dug up a few pics for ya.
I was gifted an old water cooler that sat around for a couple years then I came up with an idea to use it as a nute chiller as my DWC tub was running too warm. First off took the plastic parts out of the cooling tank so I could run a coil of 3/8" plastic tubing inside to circulate the nutes thru from the tub. You need about 20' of the tubing as 6 - 8' will just be used to run from the tub to the cooler and back then the rest coiled up inside the tank. The two holes just to the left of the tank are to run the tubing thru but could just as easily gone out the back. Hindsight is always 20/20.
View attachment 3876519
The fountain pump I got for this was my only expense and one a little bigger might work better but this did the job well enough. It's rated 110GPH/450LPH. To keep roots out of the pump I cut a piece of window screen and used a glue gun to stick it on. A larger piece of screen could be wrapped around the whole pump and secured around the outlet tube instead.
View attachment 3876526
I packed wall insulation around the tank to keep the cool in, then filled the tank with automotive anti-freeze so it wouldn't freeze up in there. I used that insulation around the tub too and just wrapped baling wire around to hold it in place. The little pump runs 24/7 but there is a timer on the cooler as the nutes got too cold if it ran all the time. Had the timer on the pump first but the nutes froze up at the bottom of the tank and I had to wait a day for it to thaw out. Cooler would be on 15 min every hour when the lights were on and 15 every two hours when the lights were out. Kept it all between 65 - 68F nice and steady. The return line should be a little longer than needed to reach the bottom of the tub/rez so that it's not discharging right beside the pump and just going round and round.
View attachment 3876535
That's about it. Easy-peasy.