Scamming into the system

No doubt marijuana has legitimate uses as a medicine, and many of the people taking advantage of the system legitimately need it. Thats a good thing. Most of the people I know with cards however do not seem to have a legitimate reason, but rather have found a loophole to get their "medicine". Nearly all the clinics seem to be catering to recreational use also. When the bill first passed you needed one of the listed conditions, but as more time elapses more and more ailments are added to the list and there seems to be a general catch all with "severe and chronic pain" because it can be so subjective.

The system was set up with the intention of helping the seriously ill. Everyone that voted for that believes in that. However every stoner I know voted for it without any consideration to the actual medical use. I use marijuana every day recreationally and believe fully it should be outright legal. There is no need for me to research and see just how justifiable and effective medical use is for some conditions (even though I personally have - i'm speaking in generalities). It's a moot point; i'm voting for it anyway because i'm pro marijuana. I can't imagine someone being a recreational user yet opposing medical marijuana.

Whenever I see a discussion about "scamming" your way into getting a registration card people seem to get very upset and critical, and I don't understand why. I don't have a REAL reason why I NEED marijuana, I just want to get high. I just want to be able to grow my own and have the legal loophole protection that allows me to do so. That upsets a lot of people, but they never offer any valid reasons why its bad.

So what harm does it do to other patients, or anyone for that matter? I will not be taking away any resources from legitimately ill patients. If anything I will be increasing the overall supply. In fact if every stoner I know could back door their way into getting a card and being able to grow legally we would be inundated with medicine. Prices would be cheaper overall. Everyone who needs medicine would have it, and everyone who just wants to get high would also have it.

Why is medical grade costing $300/oz when you can legally grow it anyway? I could purchase that quality for that price before there were any provisions to allow for it legally. If I could legally grow 12 plants for myself I could produce it for FAR LESS than $300/oz (ok maybe not in the first couple grows if you account for initial start up costs and adhere to the 2.5 oz limit - but ive been using and buying/selling to close friends for years illegally, so i certainly wouldnt "discard" the excess above 2.5 oz. ).

I just don't see how this harms anyone besides maybe having the effect of making the whole system SEEM like its a farce. In my opinion it already looks like it is. As I stated clearly a lot of legitimate users, but the majority seem to be scamming the system.

Amen to that. +rep for so much typing lol

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currently as of may 2010 registered card holders: 16k

cost per card: 100$ medicaid 25$
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you should be happy with the $300 lids, i cant find that anywhere. exactly what would you consider reasonable cost for an oz? 100? 150? im just curious. i also think the prices are rediculous. i dont know id complain with $300 zips available. i think it should be 10 for grams, 200 oz, 120 half. this would be ideal for growers and patients.

the reason it gets so expensive with black market is, it goes from the grower to the big dog then down the line. everyone inflates the price and it gets to you and i for 5 times the price the big dog paid.

now its legal and greedy fucks now see how to make a killing, so none are dropping the price to an ideal, reasonable amount. im a patient and a caregiver for 3 people. i give them a free oz a month and 250 for each oz after that.

You know I just hate the word recreational when it comes to describing marijuana because I really dont feel that word fits the bill of 99% of marijuana users.

To me Recreational marijuana user: Implies that you use it very seldom and your just doing it for fun...like a kid..maybe you go out on saturday nights and 'party' with people and get high (likely your using ETOH or another drug primarily if your this type)...This bill doesnt really fit anyone except college and highschool kids.

To me Medicinal Marijuana user: You use it for theraputic reasons and for your health wisely and responsibly on a normal basis..like an adult in the privacy of your own home


I beleive controls should be in place on marijuana and I like that the 'most educated' in our society are responsible for this detemination (Doctors)

However, I dont think the doctor should look at it like here is the medicine I am going to treat you with for ____ Illness as allowed by law makers....

Hell NO!

The doctors should be looking at:

A) Is this individual a responsible adult? Can he use marijuana without causing problems for himself or others? Will he keep it out of the hands of children? Does he/she have children to begin with? What effect does marijuana have on their life socially and psychologically and is it really helping them cope? does this person have a serious problem with substance abuse or alcholism? Is he/she constantly in trouble with the law for domestic disputes, DUI, etc....
In general the determination should be: CAN THIS PERSON USE MARIJUANA RESPOSIBLY IN HIS OR HER OWN HOME IN PRIVACY!?!?!?!
...


Really its more of a social issue and I think it should be social worker or therapist that can act as a gatekeeper in addition to a doctor.

So Why can 'sick' people use marijuana but healthy people can't? It makes no sense really....

I think most people use maryjane for the same reasons ill or not: Relaxation, Pain Relief, and Theraputic value. It makes you at peace with your world. Everyone uses it for 1 or more of those reasons in additon to the other medical values one might need such as helping you to eat if you have a digestive disorder or helping fight cancer and aids, seizures, or treatment for the side effects of treatment, etc...the list goes on and on and on and on as Im sure you all know.

So yeah I think any 'marijuana' doctor with a brain realizes this and I think they look at character more then the medical condition when someone comes in for something like 'back pain' granted for legal reason they do look at the medical condition to protect their ass but their true focus should be on you and the impact marijuana has on you, if you see someone with a patient card and they don't have a serious condition then think about that for a minute.....Go in to your doctor and find any thing that you use marijuana for medically I am sure you dont just use marijuana to 'party on a saturday night'...maybe you get headaches or backaches or maybe you just use it to help you sleep..if you have good character and the doctor sees you as a resposible adult that is not a danger to yourself or society than damn right you should get that card. Is there anything wrong with that? Hell NO - But according to our laws right now - yes there is something wrong with that - you need X Medical condition to use it so the doctor must be able to document this honestly and legitimately and its pure sillyness in my view. Its just nice that we have 'chronic and severe pain' because that word can be tied to pretty much anything you might use marijuana for legitly.

I think the reason people are upset is that they have worked so hard to gain a favorable public opinion towards legitimate medicinal uses of cannabis that when every idiot with a hackysack claims they need their meds for IBS or some other bullshit they just end up serving as cannon fodder for the opposition.

Now that being said and before anyone gets their panties twisted, I do happen to own a hack and fart alot; I also have ptsd and post concussive syndrome/traumatic brain injury and this wonderful drug has significantly improved my quality of life as well as help treat many of my symptoms that none of the other 18 different medications that I have taken in the last 3 years could do. Not to mention that my only real side effects are emptying my freezer of anything that resembles ice cream and an addiction to the history channel.

I do believe in blanket legalization however, and that anyone should be able to grow any plant they want in their backyard free from persecution.

So here is my valid reason for me to not want people to abuse these laws: The people that actually use cannabis to maintain a reasonable quality of life in regards to medical care have a NEED for this medicine and casual users have a WANT for a natural mood elevator and treament of several temporary medical conditions that have no overall affect on their long term reasonable quality of life concerns.

To put it more bluntly: Just because I like to play basketball and don't like to run doesn't mean that I should go out and join a wheelchair basketball team.

about the prices yea it just KILLS me! Ever since this shit kicked in here anything remotely midgrade gets the boooooooooop Medical Grade 400$ an ounce stamp on it and is absolutely ridiculous lol...

Like RZZA says I totally agree with him on this - 200$ an ounce is the value of marijuana midgrade and up its the appropriate value for marijuana in michigan and its been that way for quite some time for us and still is the value. These 300$, 400$, & 500$ price tags are incredibly inflated, THIS IS NOT CALIFORNIA or AMSTERDAM all the sudden...Everything is more expensive in california and amsterdam and that price is appropriate for them but its not for us.

"All cannabis use is medicinal" - Dennis Peron

The only difference between someone using cannabis to mellow out and someone using valium for the same purpose is that cannabis use is probably safer and better for you. If people want to end any perceived abuse of medical cannabis all they need to do is end prohibition. Ask me no more questions, I'll tell you no more lies.

They lied to make it illegal in the first place. They continue to make up new lies to continue prohibition. If people have to backdoor the system to prevent themselves from being sent to jail based on lies, fine by me.

200 for swag is going agreed...i dont see 300 for good shit as being a problem...these guys in the copassion clubs chrging 400++++++ is just silly....there silly for selling it that high, and peeps are silly for paying it....for 400 an oz...i better half to take a knee after smelling it
The #1 problem i see around here...people harvesting to early...buds are imature and dont really reak...but there still trying to get 300-400 an oz...300 is a good price....if the shits up to par....but 400 for early ak...seems to happen to much these days

Teejay13 said:

I think the reason people are upset is that they have worked so hard to gain a favorable public opinion towards legitimate medicinal uses of cannabis that when every idiot with a hackysack claims they need their meds for IBS or some other bullshit they just end up serving as cannon fodder for the opposition.

Now that being said and before anyone gets their panties twisted, I do happen to own a hack and fart alot; I also have ptsd and post concussive syndrome/traumatic brain injury and this wonderful drug has significantly improved my quality of life as well as help treat many of my symptoms that none of the other 18 different medications that I have taken in the last 3 years could do. Not to mention that my only real side effects are emptying my freezer of anything that resembles ice cream and an addiction to the history channel.

I do believe in blanket legalization however, and that anyone should be able to grow any plant they want in their backyard free from persecution.

So here is my valid reason for me to not want people to abuse these laws: The people that actually use cannabis to maintain a reasonable quality of life in regards to medical care have a NEED for this medicine and casual users have a WANT for a natural mood elevator and treament of several temporary medical conditions that have no overall affect on their long term reasonable quality of life concerns.

To put it more bluntly: Just because I like to play basketball and don't like to run doesn't mean that I should go out and join a wheelchair basketball team.

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If playing basketball *NOT* in a chair was illegal though, would people fault you for joining a wheel chair league? It's either that or give up your love of playing basketball. Or go to jail. Would the legitimately handicapped resent you for playing against them, even though you remain in the chair leveling the playing field, thereby not taking anything away from them? More participants on a level playing field means more games and more flexibility to schedule those games. And if you have to use your arms to shuffle around and cannot stand up just like the others, why couldn't/shouldn't you be able to play with them?

Some hip lawmaker needs to add "sex drive" to the list of acceptable symptoms.
Hell, it makes my husband happier than me, and he's not the smoker.

Deprave, you have some really good points there. I am really enjoying reading the thoughts in this Michigan group; I'm seeing the issue from a lot of different perspectives. I loved Michigan before the MM laws came into question; now I love it even more.

420.Ganja.Girl.420 said:

I loved Michigan before the MM laws came into question; now I love it even more.

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<<<<<hated michigan with every ounce of soul before ......Will stay here now.

How many of you are actually letting you meds go for $200 a zip?

That in my eyes is reasonable for both patients, and caregivers.

Bud grows out of the ground, why should it cost more than patented designer drugs?

cuz the cost to grow it is (dependant on the grow room) alot. in my situation its costing me a shit load but ALOT of it is in the initial investment. plus a whole lotta work (believe it or not). my patients get free oz a month and 250 after that.

<<<<<hated michigan with every ounce of soul before ......Will stay here now.

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couldnt agree more.

Just got back from the THCF clinic. Gonna mail my application in this afternoon.

You guys dont know how lucky you are, in the UK marijuana will NEVER EVER be legal, in fact they moved it to class B drug recently, one below heroin. And 300 USD oz? How about you try £250 GBP for a decent oz, thats like 400 USD, plus it will probably be sprayed, have glass in it, and wont actually weigh a oz, cause half will be stem. Thats IF you can get a oz, normally probably be paying 30 USD for like 1.8 Grams. Oh and if you get caught with it, you could be getting jail time, never mind growing!

thanks for reminding us. we do have it quite good