UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
What the hell is this under the toilet paper stuck to my shoe?
Oh my...
stop dicking us around and just render judgment on red's claim.
or, if you can find where he got that ridiculous claim from, let us know.
you dick.
Satellite data proves Earth has not been warming the past 18 years - it's stable
- Thread starter sheskunk
- Start date
stop dicking us around and just render judgment on red's claim.
or, if you can find where he got that ridiculous claim from, let us know.
you dick.
Buck, from my reading here is what I saw.
Dr.K found the following information and cited it...
Water vapor makes up 10 times more of the atmosphere than co2.
Water vapor is more effective at trapping ir than co2.
Now, both of those are given as fact by the information Dr.K linked to.
So why isn't there much information on the greenhouse effects of water vapor?
You don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
There is little or nothing man can do about water vapor.
Our society is based on producing co2.
climate change is keeping more climate scientists employed than would be if it weren't happening.
Scientists like to be able to feed their children.
The earth is warming, and co2 is the only thing aiding that eventuality that we have any control over.
Dr.K found the following information and cited it...
Water vapor makes up 10 times more of the atmosphere than co2.
Water vapor is more effective at trapping ir than co2.
Now, both of those are given as fact by the information Dr.K linked to.
So why isn't there much information on the greenhouse effects of water vapor?
You don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
There is little or nothing man can do about water vapor.
Our society is based on producing co2.
climate change is keeping more climate scientists employed than would be if it weren't happening.
Scientists like to be able to feed their children.
The earth is warming, and co2 is the only thing aiding that eventuality that we have any control over.
sheskunk
Well-Known Member
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
you forgot how long CO2 hangs around.
DonAlejandroVega
Well-Known Member
the poor janitor at Buck's school. having to clean up all those Snak-Pak pudding cups, thrown against the wall of the Special Ed room.
DonAlejandroVega
Well-Known Member
mountain oysters!
Nutes and Nugs
Well-Known Member
those?
Harrekin
Well-Known Member
That's completely irrelevant, the water vapour levels remain relatively consistent.
DonAlejandroVega
Well-Known Member
small ones.........appetizers
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
exactly.
water vapor doesn't accumulate over hundreds and thousands of years like that other greenhouse gas which is so unimportant, the one that corresponds almost precisely with temperatures over time.
water vapor is the main greenhouse gas, and the other greenhouse gas that doesn't blow away in the wind amplifies it. it is called a feedback cycle.
Nutes and Nugs
Well-Known Member
heckler73
Well-Known Member
I don't know where he got it from (it could just be one of those sound bites that resonate in his head, like Sapporo Ichiban yoooo does in mine)
But from my understanding, CO2 has peculiar absorption bands; "baskets" or "bins" where certain "colours" of temperature can have an effect.
Those happen to be as shown:
Or this one might be more easier to see and check out that erection Ozone has!
Note that band in red. The lower the number, the higher the temperature. CO2 hardly registers in that band.
If you want to know how the numbers actually translate into temperature, use this calculator from HyperPhysics:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/wien.html#c2
(you may have to scroll down half a page)
Enter the lowest temperature you've felt outside, then enter the hottest you've felt outside...errr... I just noticed it's in celsius...
-40 C is around 12.5 microns (well before CO2's favourite number 15)
+45 C is around 9.1 microns...again, well out of the influence of CO2...
This is the problem, Buck... CO2, by definition, can't warm the atmosphere in the range we care about most, to the extent claimed. At best, it can act as a buffer in the event of temperatures plummeting down to -80 C (I think that would freeze my pecker through three layers of thermal underwear).
Really, CH4 and N2O are technically worse, from what I can see.
DonAlejandroVega
Well-Known Member
nice.......comes with a complimentary change purse
Nutes and Nugs
Well-Known Member
That's true, but it's irrelevant.
CO2 might stay in the atmosphere a long time, it builds up. And in the 160 years since the industrial revolution started, it's still only a fraction of water vapors levels.
I would suspect the amount of water vapor in the atmosphere is near constant. It's a true cycle. But it's always there.
How is the fact that co2 stays longer even remotely relevant?
Does co2's longer air time reduce water vapors power?
The oceans eat co2. Plants turn it o2 and other goodies that we build houses with.
With the super crazy amounts of water vapor, and it's superior efficiency at trapping heat compared to co2, it's almost like pissing in the wind.
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UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
I don't know where he got it from (it could just be one of those sound bites that resonate in his head, like Sapporo Ichiban yoooo does in mine)
But from my understanding, CO2 has peculiar absorption bands; "baskets" or "bins" where certain "colours" of temperature can have an effect.
Those happen to be as shown:
View attachment 3172969
Or this one might be more easier to see and check out that erection Ozone has!
Note that band in red. The lower the number, the higher the temperature. CO2 hardly registers in that band.
If you want to know how the numbers actually translate into temperature, use this calculator from HyperPhysics:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/wien.html#c2
(you may have to scroll down half a page)
Enter the lowest temperature you've felt outside, then enter the hottest you've felt outside...errr... I just noticed it's in celsius...
-40 C is around 12.5 microns (well before CO2's favourite number 15)
+45 C is around 9.1 microns...again, well out of the influence of CO2...
This is the problem, Buck... CO2, by definition, can't warm the atmosphere in the range we care about most. At best, it can act as a buffer in the event of temperatures plummeting down to -80 C (I think that would freeze my pecker through three layers of thermal underwear).
Really, CH4 and N2O are technically worse, from what I can see.
i did notice that post of yours in the other thread, also a heinz hug (gotta be a fake name) contribution to the debate. i actually came across it while trying to check out Dr. Heinz Hug (i mean, really? is that really his name?).
are there any other, more well known publications about how CO2 is only a worry in ranges (or bands or baskets) it doesn't commonly appear in, thus minimizing its importance?
because from what i see, CO2 and temp over time usually do go hand in hand.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
because it is tied so closely to temps. it is a greenhouse gas, and it is present in higher amounts now due to human activities.
no, CO2 increases temps and thus water vapor present, leading to a feedback cycle.
this is not rocket science, this is 3rd grade level kinda stuff here.
You're not wrong on anything you said there, but there isn't a point made by any of it.
Water vapor is more potent, you've denied that previously, thus the debate, you came very close just now to admitting that.
Perhaps, since oceans eat co2, more ocean surface area will eat the extra co2.
I got a feeling the earth has the ability to maintain equilibrium.
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
water vapour is One Hundred Times More Abundant than Co2
~4% water vapour in the global average vs 0.035% Co2
thats 100 times more
water is ~20x more powerful at trapping heat mole for mole than Co2, but "baselining" for evaporative cooling, and water/cloud/ice/snow albedo brings water to ~5x more effective than Co2 by the statisticians at the global warming brain trust.
Co2's effect on the greenhouse system is vanishingly small
Dr Kynes
Well-Known Member
and yet, as the ocean warms, it is well established that it gases off MORE Co2 and when the ocean cools, it sucks in Co2.
Co2, over geologic time Follows rising temps, lagging by a few hundred years, as the oceans slowly warm, and then as the oceans cool, co2 levels drop.
you have placed the cart before the horse, and the cart is an illusion.