Rockwool PH and other challenges... Automated Top Feed Drip...Crop Steering

Those 2 things don't necessarily go together.
Feed often, especially once the root system is established.
Feed the EC that your plant needs.

Frequent feeding at a low EC doesn't create a cumulative effect for the plant. 1.0 EC =1.0 EC, no matter if you are feeding once per day or 5x per day
Its the nutrient holding capacity of the medium that causes problems with grows, and we use rockwool so we don't have that nutrient stacking issue, as long as we are watering to appropriate levels of runoff each day.
Okay I think I understand. Is there anything I should know for early veg? Wen the plant isn't really sucking up any of that water, so the block stays saturated. Should I keep watering or give it a couple days to get that dryback
 

Triplefastaction

Well-Known Member
That's the hard part at first. All I can suggest is start in small blocks and don't upsize blocks until you've got some good roots going. Elevate your blocks to increase evaporation. Increase airflow. Run higher temps to start. You are going to have a very humid micro climate around the tops of your blocks, so don't chase high humidity in veg like you need to do with dry soil mixtures. Lower room humidity should also increase evaporation, but don't get too crazy with this tactic if you see burning problems.
 

Qsound

Active Member
You are definitely correct about the plant size and they can handle multi feed and thanks for beating it in my head LOL...of which I began this morning!!! I've been so paranoid of root rot and oversaturation because of the first run experience, I waited a bit too long to go multi feed. Anyway...I did try a bump in nutes and it was too much, so I gave some PH'd water last night to knock it down, and this morning they look much better.

I started separate timers/probes for each strain. (4 lights - 4 Strains). The following is what have set up for evaluation

Growlink - initial setup VEG = Last feed 5pm - lights off 8pm
Lights on 2AM - First feed 5AM (this is to judge the overnight and morning dry backs)
10 second shots every hour until I see full saturation with runoff
I estimate about 7-10 shots needed to get to run off, but will make adjustments as needed

When I know where the run off spot is, I will create timer schedules to get to run off at mid light cycle, with a few hours or so of maintenance shots with run off till last feed. Would love to hear suggestions and input around this from the group....


Hopefully this post will help Phantom as well, as I made some changes that should fix my problem, (thanks to all the help I have received here) along with answering the block prep oversaturate issue for Phantom. Yes the block soak/flush...then 2 day dry back is the culprit for EC and PH spikes, which in turn had the DEF's beginning to show their face. I also noticed that as the plant grew and root zone became more established...that the plants demand for nutrients grew as well... obviously...so in turn any root zone imbalance had a quicker effect on the plant showing DEF's, that may not have shown up initially while plant was smaller.

So here is what ended up working for me with getting rooted clones, to root out a 4x4 block

I'm not saying this is correct way or the only way...just what ended up working for me

*Prep block by soaking at 5-PH overnight - then lay blocks out and rinse through .8 EC solution solution, and I add 1/2 tsp P/G recharge, PH'd at 5.5 (so long as not stronger EC than what the rooted clones were receiving...I like to transplant into a bit lighter EC than what clones were getting
*Let blocks rest and then put on towel to pull out 25% excess moisture
*transplant
*let dry back until feels pretty light...(for me it took 4-5 days going into 4x4x4. (after 1st dryback I saw roots coming out bottom) plants looked good
*second feed went in at same EC as long as plants looked good..."BUT"... lowered PH to 5, because the PH climbed during dryback
*fed second feed with plenty of run off...maybe 4-6 back to back feeds or so at 8-10 oz per. This pushed out salts and dropped PH to good range
*second feed took 3-4 days to dry back...plants still looked good and happy
*root started poking out the sides a bit...and then fed according to how they were doing using same philosophy etc...
*after they were drying back by next day I transplanted into next block and so on...

Sooooo. where I went wrong in this was waiting to long as the plant got larger to convert to Tripplefast's suggestion of frequent daily feeds to runoff.... It was certainly not way too long, nor became a bad problem that wasnt quickly fixed (one benefit of RW)...however, like Tripple told me over and over....as soon as the plant is established enough (which was sooner than I thought)...get to a frequent daily feed with runoff' which will keep the PH and EC consistent and balanced, so it can get dialed in. This in itself will likely solve most DEF issues, providing...EC, RH, PH, Temp, etc are correct. If RW is not fed in this fashion...it will be a never ending chase for DEF's etc...
 

Qsound

Active Member
Okay I think I understand. Is there anything I should know for early veg? Wen the plant isn't really sucking up any of that water, so the block stays saturated. Should I keep watering or give it a couple days to get that dryback
Hey Phantom...see the open post I just did here... I tried to answer what worked for me around that, as well as other things that may be helpful to you... I came from years of Promix and this is now my second RW run...
 
Hey Phantom...see the open post I just did here... I tried to answer what worked for me around that, as well as other things that may be helpful to you... I came from years of Promix and this is now my second RW run...
I can't thank u enough for all the help u have been! One more question for now, when u talk about 25% or 50% dryback are u actually taking the weight of a fully saturated block and waiting until it's 3/4 or 1/2 the weight? Given it's the same size block. I would like to be as perfect as possible w starting a new media, especially when I might not know how the blocks feel. Like the difference between fully saturated or half sat or 3/4 so on
 

Qsound

Active Member
I can't thank u enough for all the help u have been! One more question for now, when u talk about 25% or 50% dryback are u actually taking the weight of a fully saturated block and waiting until it's 3/4 or 1/2 the weight? Given it's the same size block. I would like to be as perfect as possible w starting a new media, especially when I might not know how the blocks feel. Like the difference between fully saturated or half sat or 3/4 so on
No worries brother...yes, when you soak/saturate the block and let it rest....it will have a weight to it. If you have a scale, you can can measure. If not just lift and feel. I would let my initial dry back get very light...which you will be able to sense for sure. Its like lifting a wet towel, vs one that just came out of the dryer. When I switched to RW (starting second run now) I was in the same boat as you...felt like running blind, and can take some time to gather input online. It would have been great to have an RW hotline LOL. Anyway... if you ever want to talk on the phone, I'm happy to. Just let me know and I will get you my number. I'm in the Boston area
 
No worries brother...yes, when you soak/saturate the block and let it rest....it will have a weight to it. If you have a scale, you can can measure. If not just lift and feel. I would let my initial dry back get very light...which you will be able to sense for sure. Its like lifting a wet towel, vs one that just came out of the dryer. When I switched to RW (starting second run now) I was in the same boat as you...felt like running blind, and can take some time to gather input online. It would have been great to have an RW hotline LOL. Anyway... if you ever want to talk on the phone, I'm happy to. Just let me know and I will get you my number. I'm in the Boston area
Yea that would be awesome! Right now it's all kind of theoretical because I haven't started yet. I just popped beans about a week ago so once I have some real problems instead of just possible outcomes I will definitely come running lol
 

Qsound

Active Member
LOL...gotcha. I did the same as you long before I cracked the beans as well. Just hit me up if ya need help with something. I am starting to get the RW curve down and have started automated feed today actually...which is a whole other school to attend! I was so used to feeding 1000-1800 ppm with botanicare into Promix...So it's strange to be feeding at 4-500, or .8-1.0 EC in veg. Yeah...I hit em way too hard in the beginning
 
LOL...gotcha. I did the same as you long before I cracked the beans as well. Just hit me up if ya need help with something. I am starting to get the RW curve down and have started automated feed today actually...which is a whole other school to attend! I was so used to feeding 1000-1800 ppm with botanicare into Promix...So it's strange to be feeding at 4-500, or .8-1.0 EC in veg. Yeah...I hit em way too hard in the beginning
Well good luck with all your future endeavors!! My experience has always been in dwc where I don't EVER go higher than 700 so it may be slightly easier to transition but I'm definitely expected a whole slew of other problems. So I will definitely be calling. Thank u and good luck again!
 

Qsound

Active Member
Well good luck with all your future endeavors!! My experience has always been in dwc where I don't EVER go higher than 700 so it may be slightly easier to transition but I'm definitely expected a whole slew of other problems. So I will definitely be calling. Thank u and good luck again!
I assume that your EC transition will be similar based on what it has been like for me so far with RW. I have my girls on timer feed now with ramp up, and maintenance shots....with mid day runoff. This has made a huge difference with dialing in nutes, PH, EC, etc...
I 'll get some pics up here soon
 

Turpman

Well-Known Member
Just a tip on RW. Im not a RW grower per say but do some cloning and seed starting in RW. Soak in your prefered ph balancing liquid with whatever additives you use, then into the salad spinner. You can remove almost all the water without distorting the cube.
 

Qsound

Active Member
Just a tip on RW. Im not a RW grower per say but do some cloning and seed starting in RW. Soak in your prefered ph balancing liquid with whatever additives you use, then into the salad spinner. You can remove almost all the water without distorting the cube.
Thats funny you mentioned that...I was thinking of throwing them in the washing machine on spin for a few seconds!! Great idea with the salad spinner...
 

lusidghost

Well-Known Member
Sit it on top of another moist rockwool cube or a piece of fabric. It will drain out all of the excess water. It's pretty crazy how well it works.
 

Qsound

Active Member
Sit it on top of another moist rockwool cube or a piece of fabric. It will drain out all of the excess water. It's pretty crazy how well it works.
I think you were the one that turned me on to the towel thing and has been my go to now, so thanks... Bought some good microfiber towels, folded twice into square...1 towel pulls 7-8 oz quickly. I use these because I can throw one under each plant easy and regulate the pull....

 

lusidghost

Well-Known Member
I think you were the one that turned me on to the towel thing and has been my go to now, so thanks... Bought some good microfiber towels, folded twice into square...1 towel pulls 7-8 oz quickly. I use these because I can throw one under each plant easy and regulate the pull....

That was someone else, but I was in that conversation.
 

Qsound

Active Member
Right...you are in an RW run now and not the greatest run. Just like my first RW run that I cut last week and drying as we speak.
How is the run going now? Any better?
 

lusidghost

Well-Known Member
Right...you are in an RW run now and not the greatest run. Just like my first RW run that I cut last week and drying as we speak.
How is the run going now? Any better?
It's not going to be a horrible harvest, but a lot of the buds are small. Half of the tent is doing really well, But the other half either got too much or too little light. I just pulled the most burnt plant yesterday and it was surprisingly resinous. Going straight to the hash bin.
 
Just a tip on RW. Im not a RW grower per say but do some cloning and seed starting in RW. Soak in your prefered ph balancing liquid with whatever additives you use, then into the salad spinner. You can remove almost all the water without distorting the cube.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding right. So u soak it in let's say 400ppm nutrient solution pH to 5.8 then u remove most/all of that water prior to transplanting into the new block?
 

Turpman

Well-Known Member
I cut 1x1x2" blocks to clone in or start seeds in. These are the ones I spin out. Then add back a mill or 2. I use a bit of peroxide in the soak. The cubes are way too wet for cloning in after soaking, after the spin they are about right. Nice and light. Spinner is not big enough for a big cube.
 

Qsound

Active Member
It's not going to be a horrible harvest, but a lot of the buds are small. Half of the tent is doing really well, But the other half either got too much or too little light. I just pulled the most burnt plant yesterday and it was surprisingly resinous. Going straight to the hash bin.
That is exactly my situation with my harvest. Small, tight, resinous. Same plan for hash!

I'm curious what EC sweet spot have you dialed in for late veg? I am automated drip...trying crop steering with roughly 15-20 shots per day. That being said I'm bumping now from 1 EC to 1.2...Jacks 321. Very different than the 10 years of Promix with Botanicare.

Would love to hear from others as well running Jacks or other...regarding EC levels in RW during Veg and Flower
 
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