Replacing my 300w epiled panels

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backtotheremedy011

Member
Sup RIU,

I don't consider myself a lighting expert and thought I'd try to get some opinions before pulling the trigger on my next sizable LED purchase. I have 2 300w full spectrum panels with epiled diodes I got off eBay about 2yrs ago for 120 a piece. They're ok for my setup but don't yield much and aren't very efficient, from the amount of heat they produce, you'd think I was running HPS :clap:

Im about to start up again with 2 plants and would like to upgrade to pref 1 panel that gets the job done for around 300-350 bucks. Now I've read that Hans 80w and A51 RW75 panels are ideal for small setups, just not sure on which is better in terms of an AIO solution, I'd rather try to get away with one panel this time if I can. Specs on each fall within the space I have to work with, or so they say.

Would either of these be suitable for a 2'x2' tent - 2 plant setup, or should I bite the bullet and go with the Hans 150w or A51 RW150 to be safe?
 
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churchhaze

Well-Known Member
Do you have a lot of ceiling space?

Bigger cobs, or cobs driven at higher currents are better for high profile setups with tall ceilings (HPS replacement)

Smaller cobs or cobs driven at lower currents are better for low profile setups with lower ceilings. (growtent/stealthbox)

Look into cree cxa3070, cxa3590, and vero 10, vero 12, vero 18, vero 29.

cxa3590 and vero29 (extra large eggs) for medium to high profile setups, while the rest can be used in any type of setup.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
caverage said:
and is really easy to , well... Do it yourself

https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/diy-led-with-cobs-small-medium-and-large-grows.64252/ This is the thread I found originally that made me decide to build my own and not purchase some inferior chinese led product
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Thanks for the link but I'm a skeptic when it comes to this, after all the time spent on research and cost of tools/materials, its gonna be close to higher end panels minus the build quality. I'd rather spend the extra money to have something that has a warrentey and works out of the box, not to mention the community support and case studies behind them.. Just my 2 cents.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
churchhaze said:
Do you have a lot of ceiling space?

Bigger cobs, or cobs driven at higher currents are better for high profile setups with tall ceilings (HPS replacement)

Smaller cobs or cobs driven at lower currents are better for low profile setups with lower ceilings. (growtent/stealthbox)

Look into cree cxa3070, cxa3590, and vero 10, vero 12, vero 18, vero 29.

cxa3590 and vero29 (extra large eggs) for medium to high profile setups, while the rest can be used in any type of setup.
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If I were to roll my own, I'd be building for a DR60 cuz that's just what I'm used to, more of a hobby than anything, any idea of how much, ballpark?
 
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churchhaze

Well-Known Member
You should look at that guide from SupraSPL. He's also here in the LED section and has a thread on cxa3070, and many other informational threads.

For that tent, I would use either vero 18 or cxa3070 to base a build on. All 3000k 80cri for flowering.

30W/sqft is plenty. A vero 18 at 700mA consumes about 20W of power, so (6x) vero 18 would be perfect for that space.

cxa3070 would be more expensive, but slightly more efficient. They are both great building options.

Look into getting a big ass heatsink or 2 from http://heatsinkusa.com/ to mount the cobs on.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
caverage said:
I hear yah. Not everyone's a diyer. I just love mine and want to spread the joy they give me lol
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Haha I would if I had time for a side project and wasn't so lazy, kinda just looking for something that gets the job done that'll also be a true hps replacement. I'm leaning more toward a51 cuz I hear they have better canopy penetration.. Just undecided on either 75 or 150, both specs coencide with the space I have, just wondering if the 75 will be sufficient enough.
 
caverage

caverage

Active Member
backtotheremedy011 said:
Haha I would if I had time for a side project and wasn't so lazy, kinda just looking for something that gets the job done that'll also be a true hps replacement. I'm leaning more toward a51 cuz I hear they have better canopy penetration.. Just undecided on either 75 or 150, both specs coencide with the space I have, just wondering if the 75 will be sufficient enough.
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Once I got my parts in the mail I had 240 watts in my 2x2 tent within a few hours. And I was taking my time . Maybe spent a lil under 300
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
churchhaze said:
You should look at that guide from SupraSPL. He's also here in the LED section and has a thread on cxa3070, and many other informational threads.

For that tent, I would use either vero 18 or cxa3070 to base a build on. All 3000k 80cri for flowering.

30W/sqft is plenty. A vero 18 at 700mA consumes about 20W of power, so (6x) vero 18 would be perfect for that space.

cxa3070 would be more expensive, but slightly more efficient. They are both great building options.

Look into getting a big ass heatsink or 2 from http://heatsinkusa.com/ to mount the cobs on.
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Well y'all have brought me over to the dark, or light, side lol.. I'm starting to consider giving this a go and I'm going back on what I originally planned on, 2 panels instead of 1, reason being I have a 4 gal/4 spot Rubbermaid tote I use for autos thats about 1 1/2ft tall and a 5gal/1 spot bucket I use for photoperiods thats about 3ft tall, both dwc. So I think 2 panels that cover an equal amount of space (1sqft each) would be ideal for height differences.

That being said I guess a good starting point would be to figure out for a single panel that covers 1sqft powered by 1.4a drivers and cooled by CPU fans, how many cxa3070s would I need? And can I use these for veg/flower, should I look into dimmable drivers? Thanks!
 
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churchhaze

Well-Known Member
Making a panel for veg (or autos) is the best way to save money because the lights are on for a longer period of the day, and the 5000k leds are more efficient than the 3000k leds. You need very little power to veg.

For 1sqft, it would be hard to use more than 1x cxa3070 3000k. I'd get either Z4 (middle bin) or AB (top bin) 3000k for flowering, as that's where the proven results are.

The HLG series of mean well drivers are dimmable, but the closer you are to 100% load, the closer you get to rated driver efficiency, so you want to pick a driver that can handle slightly more power than you need (for slack).

Are you sure you only have 1sqft of area to cover per panel? so 2sqft total? Just trying to confirm because that's just so little area. That's basically 2x cxa3070 at 500mA!
 
BigEasy1

BigEasy1

Well-Known Member
Get a couple of the Area 51's. You won't be disappointed. I think a few small ones are better than one big one because you have more flexibility. I bought two W-100's to replace my BlackStar. Each W-100 puts out more lux than the Blackstar 270 Chrome according to my Dr. Meter lux meter. I'm considering getting a couple of the RW-75's as well and getting out my 4X4 tent.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
churchhaze said:
Making a panel for veg (or autos) is the best way to save money because the lights are on for a longer period of the day, and the 5000k leds are more efficient than the 3000k leds. You need very little power to veg.

For 1sqft, it would be hard to use more than 1x cxa3070 3000k. I'd get either Z4 (middle bin) or AB (top bin) 3000k for flowering, as that's where the proven results are.

The HLG series of mean well drivers are dimmable, but the closer you are to 100% load, the closer you get to rated driver efficiency, so you want to pick a driver that can handle slightly more power than you need (for slack).

Are you sure you only have 1sqft of area to cover per panel? so 2sqft total? Just trying to confirm because that's just so little area. That's basically 2x cxa3070 at 500mA!
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Well I guess in reality its 1x2ft per panel, the autos I don't really bother sticking to a schedule, they usually get one month 16/4 and another of 12/12, pretty much whatever schedule the photo is on, unless I'm running all auto, then its 20/4 strait thru.

I kno, 5 plants in a 2x2 tent is crazy but honestly the autos only yield about an oz each if that which I'm ok with, the last moth I usually have a nice sized flowering photo running solo.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
BigEasy1 said:
Get a couple of the Area 51's. You won't be disappointed. I think a few small ones are better than one big one because you have more flexibility. I bought two W-100's to replace my BlackStar. Each W-100 puts out more lux than the Blackstar 270 Chrome according to my Dr. Meter lux meter. I'm considering getting a couple of the RW-75's as well and getting out my 4X4 tent.
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This was what I was originally going to do, but it looks like new a51 with cobs won't be available until q3 or later so its either wait, or diy. Not a fan of buying last gen tech lol.. And these Chinese panels are on their way out.
 
BigEasy1

BigEasy1

Well-Known Member
backtotheremedy011 said:
This was what I was originally going to do, but it looks like new a51 with cobs won't be available until q3 or later so its either wait, or diy. Not a fan of buying last gen tech lol.. And these Chinese panels are on their way out.
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Or you could look at it from the perspective that the current Area 51's have great reviews and the rumor is that the new models will use Bridgelux and not Cree. Since the current models work so well I don't think there will be such a leap forward in the new models technology that leaves the old models obsolete. If your goal is to grow great smoke you don't need to wait. If your goal is to show off the latest and greatest gear to your buddies, then wait.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
BigEasy1 said:
Or you could look at it from the perspective that the current Area 51's have great reviews and the rumor is that the new models will use Bridgelux and not Cree. Since the current models work so well I don't think there will be such a leap forward in the new models technology that leaves the old models obsolete. If your goal is to grow great smoke you don't need to wait. If your goal is to show off the latest and greatest gear to your buddies, then wait.
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Lol.. I'm a bit of a tech geek, but if what you say is true I guess there really is no down side to going with current gen. Just looking at the results ppl are getting with cobs, its kinda hard to resist :bigjoint:

I wonder if I would just go with an a51 rw150 instead of two rw75 panels. The min recommended coverage on the 75 is 18"x18" which is gonna put me over 2'x2' with two panels. Its just the autos are gonna be lower than whatever is in the 5gal bubble bucket, but I also noticed theres a 6"-1' variance in height they recommend for both veg/flower so maybe if I keep the 150 as close as possible to the 5gal bucket, it would be sufficient enough to reach and cover the 4gal tote? Decisions decisions lol.. Starting to wonder if I should ditch the dr60 and go with something a little wider.

Thanks for the replies everyone!
 
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churchhaze

Well-Known Member
I mean honestly, I'm more distracted by all the other details going on inside that tent. For such a small area, you should only have 1 strain.

The decisions for such a small area is trying to get round numbers with large expensive cobs like cxa3070. For example, you could probably cover that tent with 2x cxa3070 3000k 80cri AB, but then you'd have to keep them farther away from the lights. I guess this is fine for autos, but with short ceilings, having to keep the lights farther away from the canopy is a major con.

4x cxa3070 3000k 80cri AB at half the power each would be more efficient, as well as allow you to keep it closer to the canopy, but costs double in cob. So there are a lot of tough decisions.

Also, for each choice you can make, you have to pick out "the perfect driver" for that choice. That can be somewhat maddening.. lol. Sometimes you'll think you found the perfect setup, only to find the driver you want powers 3 instead of 4, or 9 instead of 8.

A cheaper, but less efficient option would be getting 4x vero 18 and running them at 1050mA

Or you could get 6x vero 18 and run them at 700mA! The possibilities are endless! All of this is assuming there's a good driver for the job.. it could be that 7x makes more sense for the driver but 6 makes more sense for the panel.... or something like that.
 
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backtotheremedy011

Member
churchhaze said:
I mean honestly, I'm more distracted by all the other details going on inside that tent. For such a small area, you should only have 1 strain.

The decisions for such a small area is trying to get round numbers with large expensive cobs like cxa3070. For example, you could probably cover that tent with 2x cxa3070 3000k 80cri AB, but then you'd have to keep them farther away from the lights. I guess this is fine for autos, but with short ceilings, having to keep the lights farther away from the canopy is a major con.

4x cxa3070 3000k 80cri AB at half the power each would be more efficient, as well as allow you to keep it closer to the canopy, but costs double in cob. So there are a lot of tough decisions.

Also, for each choice you can make, you have to pick out "the perfect driver" for that choice. That can be somewhat maddening.. lol. Sometimes you'll think you found the perfect setup, only to find the driver you want powers 3 instead of 4, or 9 instead of 8.

A cheaper, but less efficient option would be getting 4x vero 18 and running them at 1050mA

Or you could get 6x vero 18 and run them at 700mA! The possibilities are endless! All of this is assuming there's a good driver for the job.. it could be that 7x makes more sense for the driver but 6 makes more sense for the panel.... or something like that.
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That's a lot to think about, I'll have to do some research and get back to you. Drivers aside, what are your thoughts on a hybrid panel with 4x cxa3070 3000k 80cri AB at half power, and maybe I add enough Cree XTEs or similar for veg, and have separate veg/flower modes on a single pole switch. When I'm ready to flip, I could switch on the cxa3070s.

Just a though, it'd be badass if I could swing this.. Not too concerned about cost as long as I can keep it below $500 seeing as that's about as much I'd spend on A51 panel(s) and cobs will most likely out perform the rw series during flowering.
 
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