thanks, i have heard many things about ppm, some say 30, some say 50, some say no less than 15, all say they get balls and thus seeds, i have read a few posts, i needed the info, lol, but what i use is marked at 16-20ppm so hence why i am spraying so much, it has done something, but seems to have made them sexless, nothing at all, only leaf and new leaf starting, i am thinking i might be keeping them too waterlogged, so i will see how it goes if i stop spraying now, they have gotten over 3 weeks of spray, so according to most people that is enough, some say 4 weeks and others say till they form balls, just not 100% sure what to do, for everyone, do i stop spraying, or keep going? rither way i will clone these again and try again, cant hurt, lol, make my own CS next time too, bought it cheap enough, but yea still cheaper to make