Putting bubbles in your 'ponics

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
quick question. is there an advised net pot and rockwool size to use. the plants would only be having say 2 weeks vegging, maybe 3, before giong into their 12/12 so not massive plants i'm growing. i currently have what look like 2" pots with 1" rockwool cubes, should i be looking for bigger pots like i see others using? (looks like 5-6") or will mine surfice? i'll grab a picture later if it's needed
 
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I have read this from top to bottom and have learned alot. I have grown with dirt on all my other grows and will be starting my first dw set up. This being said I have some probably stupid questions to ask. I was going to use 2 30gal res (tote) and have 6 plants in each i am getting the impression that this may be too big???Should i use a smaller res? My grow space is 4.5ft x 3 and 5ft tall and was going to use 1000hps I dont want to run out of head room so smalller tote may save me some room. When you put your rock wool in the pot do you cover it with grow medium because you dont want the light getting through to the water???
Thanks guys want to same myself head aches.
5 ft isn't much because you have the res on the bottom and clearance for the light on top. Your plants will have to stay fairly small by design so you won't need a large res for the rootspace. I think 10 gal of water would be fine and save you a lot of work and money for nutes on res changes. Look for a tote that has a lot of surface area to spread plants out, but not so much unneeded depth. Those can be hard to find.

I put a layer of hydroton on the bottom of the netpot, set the cube or plug in, then surround it on the sides to stabilize it. Don't cover the top with hydroton. But when you see green use a netpot cover to keep light out. You can buy them or make them. I use rubber stoppers for flat drains and cut in to the center, then a hole.
 
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Illegal Smile

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quick question. is there an advised net pot and rockwool size to use. the plants would only be having say 2 weeks vegging, maybe 3, before giong into their 12/12 so not massive plants i'm growing. i currently have what look like 2" pots with 1" rockwool cubes, should i be looking for bigger pots like i see others using? (looks like 5-6") or will mine surfice? i'll grab a picture later if it's needed
2 inch pots might be cutting it close but 3 inch should be fine. If there is no real reason to have them smaller, then go with the slightly bigger ones.
 
This is how I ensure correct feeding of seedlings in a simple tote-based DWC. It's nothing new, DWC growers have been doing this for years. I'm not going to trademark it as "Bubble-Dro" or start a club. I just get a lot of questions about it and am tired of typing the same answer over and over.

First, I have nothing against drips. A well-designed and calibrated drip system can water very reliably. I just don't like submerged pumps and feeder tubes and think it best to eliminate them when they provide no advantage. For a small growing area built around a bucket or a tote, this is easier, less costly and works better. I'm not describing the entire system here. I'm assuming a tote with holes cut for netpots and the use of hydroton and rockwool cubes or Rapid Rooters (which I prefer).

This approach is the "real" bubble-based hydroponics because it relies on and is powered by the bubbles, not a pump and tubes. So the heart is a good pump. I use a 600 gph Sunleaves that runs 30-40 dollars. You can get by with less but the aquarium pumps are usually not adequate. Next comes the airstones. I use two different totes, a 10 gal and a 15 gal. For the 10 gal, I use 3 airstones and for the 15 gal I use 4. I get 12 inch stones, the kind that are all stone not a piece of stone inlaid in plastic. Check them in your kitchen sink to make sure they bubble well. Scrubbing them with a brush if needed. These get clogged so check them often once you get started to make sure you have the needed bubble action. I use new ones for each grow. You can get a manifold with multiple outlets and shutoff valves for your pump. Those are good but if you have a 4 way splitter with no shutoff and only running 3 stones, run a tube from the 4th and leave it outside and clamp it off well.

How do you know if you have enough bubbles? Hold your hand about 2 inches above the water. You should feel tiny bubbles breaking on your hand. If not you need more air pressure. So now you have your bubbles and you're ready to put them to work. You want to be able to control exactly how wet your pots are getting and to be able to dial it up and down. You can do that with water level. I start by setting water level 2 inches below the bottoms of the netpots. I then load a netpot with hydroton and a rockwool cube or rapid rooter, but no seed. I use this to monitor wetness because I can easily pull it out, open it up and check the wetness. It should be damp but not sopping wet. You have to develop a feel for how damp/wet with experience but too wet can cause stem rot. Too wet, lower the water, not wet enough, raise the water (in small increments). I recommend you leave this monitoring netpot in the system for the first couple weeks of your first grow, but after that you will have the idea and won't need it.

When roots start emerging they are being watered/fed by the breaking bubbles in a fine mist not unlike an aeroponic spray. The airspace between the water and the lid, the space where the root system grows, is a 100% humidity environment that is about as good as you can get. I start light nutes on day 7. Once the roots are well into the water the bubbles are no longer critical for feeding but are still maintained for oxygenation of the water.

Compare this to a submerged pump driving water through tubes that clog and don't allow reliable control over how wet the cube is. In my opinion, the only thing worse than a Frankenstein-ish mess of tubes on top is the same mess hidden in the reservoir. It costs more, it creates heat, it breaks down, it clogs. You may see so-called comparisons set up to prove that pumps and tubes lead to faster growth. There is no logical reason why they would and such results are easily obtained simply by, intentionally or unintentionally, doing the DWC side of the comparison wrong.

You can start a seed this way, I germinate mine until they crack first just to make sure they are viable seeds. No approach is right for every grower. But if you want a small grow system that is as easy as it gets to make and set up, and that veteran DWC growers have gotten great production from, try this! It costs next to nothing, the only real additional expense over what many of you are using now or contemplating, is a robust pump which you really should have anyway.

Hey Bro - awesome post!

Have a question for you - right now I'm using 20 gal roughneck tubs, with 2 air stones and a water pump with micro sprayers in pvc tubing (aeroponics). I have tubs with 6 & 8 holes for 3 3/4" net pots. my question is about changing from my method to yours. Right now my roots are way down in the nutrient solution with the air stones so it doesn't seem it would be that big of a change. But not having to deal with clogged sprayers seems to be a huge advantage.

all I would need is a bigger pump and more stones?
So how often do you need to change the res?
Now I change every 2 weeks


Thanks Bro
 
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Illegal Smile

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Hey Bro - awesome post!

Have a question for you - right now I'm using 20 gal roughneck tubs, with 2 air stones and a water pump with micro sprayers in pvc tubing (aeroponics). I have tubs with 6 & 8 holes for 3 3/4" net pots. my question is about changing from my method to yours. Right now my roots are way down in the nutrient solution with the air stones so it doesn't seem it would be that big of a change. But not having to deal with clogged sprayers seems to be a huge advantage.

all I would need is a bigger pump and more stones?
So how often do you need to change the res?
Now I change every 2 weeks


Thanks Bro
You really do need a robust pump for this and how many stones depends on the setup and the stones and the pump, just have to trial and error it. It should be an easy switch to a more simple system for you. if you back up this thread to #149 I give my reasons for why I change the res weekly, but that's just my way.

I agree there's no point in doing it now but let us know how it goes when you do!
 

woof

Active Member
I fooled around with some aquarium pumps that didn't do the job before breaking down and spending $60 on a sunleaves. Well worth it.
 

HookedOnChronic

Well-Known Member
wicked post IS! just wondering whats the weakest pump you could run this with

obviously u need enough power to clear the 3-6 inches from water level to the top of the pot, just wondered if u knew what works
 
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wicked post IS! just wondering whats the weakest pump you could run this with

obviously u need enough power to clear the 3-6 inches from water level to the top of the pot, just wondered if u knew what works
I use this http://www.discount-hydro.com/productdisp.php?pid=412&navid=8 in only 6 gal of water and it is more than enough. I think more than enough is desirable though. I haven't seen any aquarium pumps I thought were adequate. The pump is the heart of this approach and not a place to skimp.
 

doowmd

Well-Known Member
hello I.S. .....was needing to know how important using an r/o filter is, and whether or not it makes a big difference as far as yield/bud quality? found a link to a fairly cheap one(didn't check on the shipping cost tho.), but i can't afford to blow money unnecessarily , so was wanting your opinion. thanks
 
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hello I.S. .....was needing to know how important using an r/o filter is, and whether or not it makes a big difference as far as yield/bud quality? found a link to a fairly cheap one(didn't check on the shipping cost tho.), but i can't afford to blow money unnecessarily , so was wanting your opinion. thanks
Good water is important but it need not be distilled or ro. If your tap water is not too high in ppms and doesn't contain anything problematic, it may be fine. You can ask your water company for a copy of regular tests they have to do on that. I don't know about cheap ro units, they may be more costly in the long run. We also use it for drinking so it is well worth the $179 I paid for mine.
 
5 ft isn't much because you have the res on the bottom and clearance for the light on top. Your plants will have to stay fairly small by design so you won't need a large res for the rootspace. I think 10 gal of water would be fine and save you a lot of work and money for nutes on res changes. Look for a tote that has a lot of surface area to spread plants out, but not so much unneeded depth. Those can be hard to find.

I put a layer of hydroton on the bottom of the netpot, set the cube or plug in, then surround it on the sides to stabilize it. Don't cover the top with hydroton. But when you see green use a netpot cover to keep light out. You can buy them or make them. I use rubber stoppers for flat drains and cut in to the center, then a hole.
Thanks for the reply should . Should the res be at least a foot deep or can it be shallower? Thanks again
 

HookedOnChronic

Well-Known Member
thanks alot IS!!

just curious then

for this set up to work you need a $40 pump, a tote, air pots, hydroton, some air stones and nutes?
also noob question, can u grow hydro without nutes? or do they need em
 
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Illegal Smile

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Nero, small plants could be ok in a shllower res but at the most you save yourself a few inches. And it should elevated at least a little, more makes draining easier.

Hooked, don't forget lights, a pH meter, calibration solution pH down. Fans. Humidifier? dehumidifier? space heater? And yes you need nutes and they should be good hydro nutes. And good seeds. To do a small closet grow right building it yourself but not skimping - You should plan at least 300 to start and probably 500 by the time youare done. But if you get a modest 6 oz dry from that, was it a bad deal? And your cost for the 2nd grow will be under 100.
 
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Illegal Smile

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Plants growing in water need nutes. There are natural nutes in soil, not in water.
 

sixstring2112

Well-Known Member
has anyone tried using a little pancake air compressor with a regulator to control the out pressure?
i think your on to something,i have both right next to my grow.just dont want that thing running all the time. there might be a small amount of oil in the air but i do have a air dryer on my setup
 

skinnyone

Well-Known Member
I don't think it would really have to run very much. I may have to do a test. If you could find one quiet enough.
 
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