Possible to get rid of the "Auto" trait in genetics?

M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
I was curious if this is possible as this would be my summer project to getting the Auto trait out of strains of sweet seeds.

So instead of Auto red posion I would just want red posion to keep the color and everything but make it a viable yielding plant.
 
AimAim

AimAim

Well-Known Member
Why would you even want to do this?

Autos are a bit weak to begin with. You are not going to be doing much of a "Summer Project" in one summer, as it takes a few breeding cycles to do anything.

But you know all this.
 
M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
Yea I've grown autos and know they are weak I'm not too concerned with that as I'm just after "Beauty" for this project.
I could possibly force a auto red poison to grow seeds and do scrog so that is a thought.

I was just curious if possible I could remove the auto trait and breed it with something like Critical Mass or Green Crack and give it a little more yield if possible and grow out a bunch of possibly red plants.
It's mainly to try something new, I love the weed I grow and it's all personal but I would like to have a colorful garden within the next 2 years then save all those seeds for whenever I want to do it again.
My next grow is going to be a bunch of well known dank strains so I should have enough stash to last me quite a bit as I don't smoke often, just as much to keep me happy while I try something new out.
 
lowrider2000

lowrider2000

Well-Known Member
not all autoflowering plants auto flower, just grow enuf of them and bread the ones that dont do what they were supposed to do you can even shok them but you might get hermies....im sure google could have told you that
 
M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
lowrider2000 said:
not all autoflowering plants auto flower, just grow enuf of them and bread the ones that dont do what they were supposed to do you can even shok them but you might get hermies....im sure google could have told you that
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I like this because at least you tried to give me a taste.
 
sativa indica pits

sativa indica pits

Active Member
It would take at least 5 generations imo. I have crossed auto females with regular pollen and the offspring show traits of, #1 mother, #2 the father, and #3 a mix of both of them. You would have to select the phenos which showed the trait that you want to keep. so say you grow 30 of them and cross with a regular, 10 will be straight auto, 10 will be straight regular photoperiod, and 10 will have the tendency to auto flower, maybe 16hrs of light will flower them. (this is a general idea, nothing scientific here just my experience with autos)

Now once you have grown them for at least 45 days do your first selection. Find one that does not flower under 24 hrs light. That selected pheno will have the auto trait still locked in her genes. Breed her with a regular strain for the second time. Again each time you cross regular into it the less of the auto flower trait it will have. grow 30 seeds again, 24hrs light, find one that doesnt flower under 24 hrs light within 60 days just to make sure the regular trait is dominate. Select the 3rd pheno, breed it with a regular again, same deal, grow 30 seeds, but this time dont run 24hr light, and find the one that doesnt auto flower under 18 hrs light. Now the last selection #4, you should grow them under 15 hrs light and see which one doesnt auto flower. Time for the back cross to stabilize the regular trait, take the original pollen, or original seeds from the "first" cross and back cross it into the 4th pheno. Your off spring should now have close to 90% regular dominate genes. so out of 100 seeds maybe 5 or 10 may auto flower, but its unlikely. And as far as every single auto flower plant being weak, is a myth. A good deal of autos will be weak and wear off quickly, but there is a percentage of them that will knock you on your ass!!

This is how I would do it. Im not saying im 110% right and you have to do it this way, this is just my opinion of how you could breed out the auto flower trait. There may be a faster way to do it in like 3 generations, I have studied autos and how they make them, so to "undo" the auto trait I would think you would reverse the process of how they make them. Im also not saying im better than everyone!! good luck man!!

And just to thro this in, I grew 5 generations of auto flowers from may to September to give you a time line close to what it would take,,,,, IMO!!
 
M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
sativa indica pits said:
It would take at least 5 generations imo. I have crossed auto females with regular pollen and the offspring show traits of, #1 mother, #2 the father, and #3 a mix of both of them. You would have to select the phenos which showed the trait that you want to keep. so say you grow 30 of them and cross with a regular, 10 will be straight auto, 10 will be straight regular photoperiod, and 10 will have the tendency to auto flower, maybe 16hrs of light will flower them. (this is a general idea, nothing scientific here just my experience with autos)

Now once you have grown them for at least 45 days do your first selection. Find one that does not flower under 24 hrs light. That selected pheno will have the auto trait still locked in her genes. Breed her with a regular strain for the second time. Again each time you cross regular into it the less of the auto flower trait it will have. grow 30 seeds again, 24hrs light, find one that doesnt flower under 24 hrs light within 60 days just to make sure the regular trait is dominate. Select the 3rd pheno, breed it with a regular again, same deal, grow 30 seeds, but this time dont run 24hr light, and find the one that doesnt auto flower under 18 hrs light. Now the last selection #4, you should grow them under 15 hrs light and see which one doesnt auto flower. Time for the back cross to stabilize the regular trait, take the original pollen, or original seeds from the "first" cross and back cross it into the 4th pheno. Your off spring should now have close to 90% regular dominate genes. so out of 100 seeds maybe 5 or 10 may auto flower, but its unlikely. And as far as every single auto flower plant being weak, is a myth. A good deal of autos will be weak and wear off quickly, but there is a percentage of them that will knock you on your ass!!

This is how I would do it. Im not saying im 110% right and you have to do it this way, this is just my opinion of how you could breed out the auto flower trait. There may be a faster way to do it in like 3 generations, I have studied autos and how they make them, so to "undo" the auto trait I would think you would reverse the process of how they make them. Im also not saying im better than everyone!! good luck man!!

And just to thro this in, I grew 5 generations of auto flowers from may to September to give you a time line close to what it would take,,,,, IMO!!
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Jesus I was hoping to be done in 2 years max.
Was thinking Red poison crossed with a GDP or Sour Diesel.
 
sativa indica pits

sativa indica pits

Active Member
well like I said I got 5 gen's in 5 months ( not counting the first veg period of 20 days or the last flower period) I started the seeds ass soon as they started to darken up, like 15-20 days from pollination. Not sure if it will be the same time line with reg pollen.

never heard of the red poison... who were the original breeders? Just try it man, Ive been working with auto's for 3 to 4 years now. Some are total shit!! but if you grow enough of them you will find, people will be asking.... where is that shit put me in my chair? lol!! good luck and report back!!
 
tip top toker

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
From a red poison test grow done by sweet seeds themself, why not just find a regular strain with similar colours? Plenty out there. (and their test grow harvest shots make the seedbank shot of red poison look slightly doctored)

Unless a serious breeder with aims of selling, seems like a waste of a few years to try and come up with a result that is already available in photoperiod form.
 
M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
tip top toker said:
From a red poison test grow done by sweet seeds themself, why not just find a regular strain with similar colours? Plenty out there. (and their test grow harvest shots make the seedbank shot of red poison look slightly doctored)

Unless a serious breeder with aims of selling, seems like a waste of a few years to try and come up with a result that is already available in photoperiod form.
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I tried looking and couldn't find the photo strain, why I was thinking about going through all this trouble to reverse engineer it.
I don't live in Cali where clones are available, nor local seedbanks where I can find it easily.
Normally for me, if attitude doesn't carry it, I don't try to look elsewhere as attitude has always done right by me.

I don't sell or anything, I just like the beauty and I don't smoke often. Just figured it would be nice to have a multi color grow.
Some Red Posions, Black Cream, GDP, Sour Diesel, and Trainwreck would sure look nice in one tent.
 
tip top toker

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
MedicatedGrow said:
I tried looking and couldn't find the photo strain, why I was thinking about going through all this trouble to reverse engineer it.
I don't live in Cali where clones are available, nor local seedbanks where I can find it easily.
Normally for me, if attitude doesn't carry it, I don't try to look elsewhere as attitude has always done right by me.

I don't sell or anything, I just like the beauty and I don't smoke often. Just figured it would be nice to have a multi color grow.
Some Red Posions, Black Cream, GDP, Sour Diesel, and Trainwreck would sure look nice in one tent.
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I'm not saying "the photo strain" I'm saying "a photo strain"

There are plenty of different strains, readily available, which will throw off the same kind of colours. Point being why get o fixated on trying to brred out some auto traits because a strain is red, as opposed to just buying a red strain that has no auto traits to start with?
 
M

MedicatedGrow

Active Member
tip top toker said:
I'm not saying "the photo strain" I'm saying "a photo strain"

There are plenty of different strains, readily available, which will throw off the same kind of colours. Point being why get o fixated on trying to brred out some auto traits because a strain is red, as opposed to just buying a red strain that has no auto traits to start with?
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This is true, I did look for a while for some color photos that catch my eye.
Almost all were Purple, Black, or deep purpleishblackish. I couldn't find the cool ones like Red, Pink, Blue, or a mix of Red & Black, or Purple & Black.
Almost all the cool looking ones were autos. I'm going to dig a little deeper this weekend see if I can find any.

In the mean time I do have a semi colorful grow in mind that I already have the seeds for.

Sour D, Trainwreck, Kosher Kush, Purple Wreck, GDP, GSC, Purple Trainwreck.
I just wanted a nice red one to go with them and start them all together.
 
JohnDee

JohnDee

Well-Known Member
MG,
Genetic traits can be dominant and recessive (as a simplification) and it is the auto-flowering characteristic of Ruderalis being a dominant trait that has allowed it to be bred into so many other strains. So you'd be fighting that...
JD
 
Farmer's Hat

Farmer's Hat

Well-Known Member
I think you are overthinking it.

Make some simple f1 hybrids, and grow out as many as you can. Find the girls that have the colors you want, and test them to see if they inherited the auto-flower gene.

Repeat this process until you find a good mother plant.


Also, I recommend you read THE CANNABIS BREEDERS BIBLE. It will help you a lot....
 
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