pH UP! and pH Down! Can you have too much?

The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
Hi guys,

This is maybe a stupid question but I was thinking and would like to know the answer.

Okay so lets say you need to adjust pH and you mess up, you add too much pH down so then you need to add pH UP to get things balanced out.

Basically my question is, can you have too much off these chemicals???

Lets say you really F*** up and you add a total of 10 drops of pH down and 12 of pH up and finally get it right.

Lets assume that gets you to the magic number of 6.5 for your soil grow. Does all of that chemical get cancelled out?? OR even though the pH is right, do those chemicals still affect something?

I assume it does but I also am no scientist haha.

I am asking this about a soil grow, I feel I am adding to counteract a bit much. Not the total of 22 by a LONG shot but just wondering if it can have a adverse effect.

Hope that makes sense!:joint:
 
akboarder

akboarder

Well-Known Member
Depends on your nutrient/water dose or barrel size. That shouldn't really be a problem though. The acid counteracts the base and brings it to a average. The only thing it will do is up your overall PPM (parts per million) of total dissolved solids in your water but it should not matter much really, not enough to do harm. In hydro, there have been plenty of times I've gone too far and had to come back with the opposite ph adjuster and i've noticed no issue. You'll be fine i'm sure.
 
Internode

Internode

Well-Known Member
An answer from experience. Dump and redo especially if you have salt based nutrients in the mix. These nutrients will precipitate out when you do this with ph up and down causing problems.
 
The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
akboarder said:
Depends on your nutrient/water dose or barrel size. That shouldn't really be a problem though. The acid counteracts the base and brings it to a average. The only thing it will do is up your overall PPM (parts per million) of total dissolved solids in your water but it should not matter much really, not enough to do harm. In hydro, there have been plenty of times I've gone too far and had to come back with the opposite ph adjuster and i've noticed no issue. You'll be fine i'm sure.
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Yeah this is what I have been doing in soil, counteracting with alkaline. More along the lines of lets says 3-5 pH down 1-2 pH up just depends on what nutes I have in there at the time.

Was just wondering of overtime some chemical reaction happens that can throw the pH way off or something. As I have a problem plant and trying to work out if this could be why.
 
The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
Internode said:
An answer from experience. Dump and redo especially if you have salt based nutrients in the mix. These nutrients will precipitate out when you do this with ph up and down causing problems.
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Are you talking about both hydro and soil?

In regard to having to dump if I have went to far with one of the pH adjusters and would require the opposite.

How can someone hit that magic 6.5 in soil if lets say I added a drop of pH down and it brought me to 6.7 but I know another drop would push me under 6.5. Is there a trick I'm missing or would the solution be to mix my feed in a bigger container so pH down has less impact?
 
Lucky Luke

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
I think in one of your questions your asking is about a lock out of a Nuet? If you are then yes you can and here is a chart.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=cannabis+ph+chart+soil&rlz=1C1ASUT_enAU412AU434&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=667&tbm=isch&imgil=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM%3A%3B8XipfuBj79JWtM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.growweedeasy.com%252Fph&source=iu&pf=m&fir=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM%3A%2C8XipfuBj79JWtM%2C_&usg=__fAMot56Szx7dgL2tA0xXGrerHHY=&ved=0ahUKEwjtjsfKjuHOAhVII5QKHciOCx4QyjcIKA&ei=t0bBV63XL8jG0ATIna7wAQ#imgrc=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM:
6-7 is the key

Adding a Tablespoon of Dolomite Lime (inexpensive and available at any garden place/ hardware store in powder form) to every 5 liters of soil (little less is fine.Dont use much more). Its is basically a mix of Cal/ Mag and a kind of PH buffer (7PH). You wont get a Cal/Mag problem and it keeps ur PH very stable. Perticly fantastic if ur water PH is under 7. (which mine is at 6.6)
 
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The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
Lucky Luke said:
I think in one of your questions your asking is about a lock out of a Nuet? If you are then yes you can and here is a chart.

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=cannabis+ph+chart+soil&rlz=1C1ASUT_enAU412AU434&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=667&tbm=isch&imgil=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM%3A%3B8XipfuBj79JWtM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.growweedeasy.com%252Fph&source=iu&pf=m&fir=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM%3A%2C8XipfuBj79JWtM%2C_&usg=__fAMot56Szx7dgL2tA0xXGrerHHY=&ved=0ahUKEwjtjsfKjuHOAhVII5QKHciOCx4QyjcIKA&ei=t0bBV63XL8jG0ATIna7wAQ#imgrc=sDHLSu5UxF5QcM:

Adding a Tablespoon of Dolomite Lime (inexpensive and available at any garden place/ hardware store in powder form to every 5 liters of soil (little less is fine.Dont use much more). Its is basically a mix of Cal/ Mag and a PH buffer. You wont get a Cal/Mag problem and it keeps ur PH very stable. Perticly fantastic if ur water PH is under 7. (which mine is at 6.6)
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So does this Dolomite Lime keep the pH stable at whatever pH it is muxed with? Or at the 6.5 mark?

Water from my tap is more like 7.5 - 8.0
 
The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
Steelsurgeon said:
In the revs book on true living organics, he claims that the ph adjusters severely, negatively, impact micro life. He offers suggestions on natural oh adjusters, I'll look them up later
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I'm no scientist or anything but I could see such a thing. Harsh chemicals messing with microbiology, yeah I can see it.

I would appreciate if you could find that man!:bigjoint:
 
Lucky Luke

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
The-Budster said:
So does this Dolomite Lime keep the pH stable at whatever pH it is muxed with? Or at the 6.5 mark?

Water from my tap is more like 7.5 - 8.0
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It helps (greatly) the PH going above 7 and keeps it more stable and adds Cal and Mag. A few good growers here on the site use it. To much Is Very bad. But in correct dosages seems to work really well. Im using it this year but to early to tell for me. (season just startin)

Do a few google searches (canna and tomato etc)
 
The-Budster

The-Budster

Well-Known Member
Lucky Luke said:
It helps (greatly) the PH going above 7 and keeps it more stable and adds Cal and Mag. A few good growers here on the site use it. To much Is Very bad. But in correct dosages seems to work really well. Im using it this year but to early to tell for me. (season just startin)

Do a few google searches (canna and tomato etc)
Click to expand...
My water is as soft as a Nuns nipple anyway so I will be needing that Cal-Mag!

I will read up on this shortly! Thanks dude:clap:
 
Internode

Internode

Well-Known Member
The-Budster said:
Are you talking about both hydro and soil?

In regard to having to dump if I have went to far with one of the pH adjusters and would require the opposite.

How can someone hit that magic 6.5 in soil if lets say I added a drop of pH down and it brought me to 6.7 but I know another drop would push me under 6.5. Is there a trick I'm missing or would the solution be to mix my feed in a bigger container so pH down has less impact?
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When your talking about 1 or 2 drops back or forth, that isnt such a big deal.. You were talking about going 10 ph down, then 12 ph up, that is a wild swing especially if there are already nutrients in the mix. I was also talking hydro or soil, doesn't matter, if you are ph-ing a nutrient solution and swinging back and forth there will be problems. Honestly, just be patient with the mix, usually it will drift back up after 24 hours on its own as opposed to reacting with ph up, just let it sit. With my water, it is 8.4 from the tap, Ill ph down to 6 and by the next day it is 6.5 and Ill add a tiny more ph down and get to 5.6, the next day it drifts to 5.8 and I use it (hydro).
 
akboarder

akboarder

Well-Known Member
Also a pointer for you man, as said before, nutrients are absorbed better at different points on the pH scale. Plants also do different things to the root zone pH during different phases of growth, for instance becoming more basic in Veg and more acidic in Bloom (my hydro experience). If you have some swing, it is actually more healthy than a single stationary pH in my opinion. In hydro, I alternate my ph. One ph, i'll be low, maybe 5.7. The next, i'll go more basic, like maybe a 6.2. I'll also anticipate what's going on in the root zone and tend to make nutrients more basic in flower and more acidic in veg. It's been years since i've played in soil. So basically, you can mix up a brew that is a little lower than 6.5 and it will be no problem. There are lots of people who don't bother with pH! (they're silly to me) There is also the factor of natural soil pH variability such as in nature where, to my knowledge, God doesn't hang out above all plants and adjust their pH ;) If you have your heart set on 6.5, you can also water down some pH adjuster. Use a glass, put a drop in, then add 6 ounces of water. If you pour in 3 ounces, that will be equivalent to half a drop (the pH of your water may partially counteract pH down at this small of a measurement). Play around like a mad scientist a little and there's no reason you shouldn't be able to get the pH exactly where you want it. A good idea also is to check your runoff pH to get an idea of what's going on in the root zone. This can help guide you to which side you should make your water/nutrient pH. If the runoff is low pH, make your water on the high side and vise versa. The Dolomite lime is a great idea too and is used by lots of growers for the nutrient and the pH balance. Have fun, be safe :)
 
akboarder

akboarder

Well-Known Member
Ps- I use beneficials in my coco hydro set up and they are very much alive, despite the fact I use pH up all the time. These adjusters may not be beneficial to microbes, but if they are at all, i'd say they are minimally antimicrobial. Many people use physan 20 or H2O2 or any number of cleaners run in their system to act as antimicrobial agents. If it was as simple as just use some pH adjuster, i'm sure people would be on to that. That would be also incredibly strong as your usage rate for adjusters is usually quite small- I use maybe 2ml adjuster in a 15 gallon reservoir. Think what you will, but I wouldn't worry about your small amounts of pH adjusters wreaking any havoc on your rhizosphere. Just my opinion based on my observations.
 
growman3666

growman3666

Well-Known Member
akboarder said:
Also a pointer for you man, as said before, nutrients are absorbed better at different points on the pH scale. Plants also do different things to the root zone pH during different phases of growth, for instance becoming more basic in Veg and more acidic in Bloom (my hydro experience). If you have some swing, it is actually more healthy than a single stationary pH in my opinion. In hydro, I alternate my ph. One ph, i'll be low, maybe 5.7. The next, i'll go more basic, like maybe a 6.2. I'll also anticipate what's going on in the root zone and tend to make nutrients more basic in flower and more acidic in veg. It's been years since i've played in soil. So basically, you can mix up a brew that is a little lower than 6.5 and it will be no problem. There are lots of people who don't bother with pH! (they're silly to me) There is also the factor of natural soil pH variability such as in nature where, to my knowledge, God doesn't hang out above all plants and adjust their pH ;) If you have your heart set on 6.5, you can also water down some pH adjuster. Use a glass, put a drop in, then add 6 ounces of water. If you pour in 3 ounces, that will be equivalent to half a drop (the pH of your water may partially counteract pH down at this small of a measurement). Play around like a mad scientist a little and there's no reason you shouldn't be able to get the pH exactly where you want it. A good idea also is to check your runoff pH to get an idea of what's going on in the root zone. This can help guide you to which side you should make your water/nutrient pH. If the runoff is low pH, make your water on the high side and vise versa. The Dolomite lime is a great idea too and is used by lots of growers for the nutrient and the pH balance. Have fun, be safe :)
Click to expand...
Well well said.
 
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