Outback - Australia, Stealth grow: first crack at the whip in grow closet.

odlaw said:

subbed man nice to see another aussie growin

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Hey, Thanks mate. You too.
I'm learning alot here. I've a grand plan , let's call it a three year plan.
A bit like doing a trade..you know..apprentice first, learn from mistakes etc.
Thanks for your input too, and for stopping by.

Battling Betty is Buried. It was the heat that did it for sure, she was just too young.
Hindu Kush is still going , even though it was born with that deformed cotyledon.

hey Odlaw, You'r right about my light set-up.
It was staring me in the face the whole time and I just didn't jerry onto it. Thanks mate.

The Problem was that I was using lots of 2700 (Flowering spectrum) rather than the vegetating growth spectrum as you pointed out, however while I'm waiting for my orders to come in I'll just use the 5000k globes, not sure if it's as beneficial but it's better than nothing I reckon.

Thoughts on the 5000k globe?

Answering my own queries, but I though others may have similar questions:

Found this - 85 Watt CFL Grow Light Bulb 5000K by Longstar Lighting is designed for the growing and vegetative stage of your plants. This high lumen full spectrum self-ballasted lamp emits in the blueish spectrum. It produces an amazing 4,200 lumens directly onto your plant. We recommend that you mount the this light approximately 15 to 20 inches from the plant.

Better explanation with charts of the light spectrum were found right here on RollItUp:
https://www.rollitup.org/cfl-growing/46014-ask-kelvin-he-knows-secret.html

I was really happy to learn of this as it pertains to my 25000k bulb (130watts), I had just turned it off thinking it was a flowering light but wrong..it's way up there with the blue waves (and a little red) so it's extremely beneficial for vegetative growth. Perfect. I also read about this frequency on some Orchid growing site.

Needless to say the light is back on.

Day 17
After some dramas with the heat I thought the girls were recovered, however Lucy seems to be in dire straights now that I have had a better look (14 hours later).

She has discolouration on the leaves, yellowish on the outside tips through the veins also. It looks like nute burn but may be associated with the heat factos. i've raised the lights and fed her some alkaline water to flush a few nutes out.


They aren't due for a feed for another four days.
Ruby looks better than Lucy does but her tips have kinda curled a bit too.
Henrietta seems sunburnt but otherwise she's ok (to me anyway), Ihope others can provide some guidance on this.
Point t self - in future use slow release ferts in the soil or get yourself a proper Ph, pen.

Here's Ruby:

What's up YYarns? The plants are looking good in the pictures minus the little yellowing, you gotta be careful with the nutes though man, what kind of soil are you using, and also what kind of nutes. your soil should contain some nutes in it to get your plant by for atleast 1 month, once your cotyledons yellow and die off that's when i think it's time for there first low dose of nutes, it's hard not to pamper them when there so small and sensitive you just want to give them the best start in life, i'd give them straight water for now until they hit 1 month old, by then they would be bigger and stronger to withstand alot of shit lol once you past the baby stage these plants can take alot of crap but when there small it's real easy to kill them

MasterHemp said:

What's up YYarns? The plants are looking good in the pictures minus the little yellowing, you gotta be careful with the nutes though man, what kind of soil are you using, and also what kind of nutes. your soil should contain some nutes in it to get your plant by for atleast 1 month, once your cotyledons yellow and die off that's when i think it's time for there first low dose of nutes, it's hard not to pamper them when there so small and sensitive you just want to give them the best start in life, i'd give them straight water for now until they hit 1 month old, by then they would be bigger and stronger to withstand alot of shit lol once you past the baby stage these plants can take alot of crap but when there small it's real easy to kill them

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MasterHemp,
Thanks for the input and advice, it's re-assureing to know that my own diagnosis wasn't too bad for a noob.
And of course I plead guilty to "over-loving" the plants. I will back off for a another two weeks so as to let them grow.

I've been following your grows too and I've learnt from your reports as well. Good on you for that.


One Love, Jah Bless.
Yarndi.

Day 18
In just a few hours after the nute over-dose and the heat drama we have:
Ruby - looking fine to me, she actually appears to be out growing her sister now, and she's growing at an angle which will make it easier for me to try the LST techniques
Ruby Right. (Easy Ryder)



Lucy Left (Easy Ryder) Yellowing tips appear to be receding after just 36 hours, all I did was give her about a litre of alkaline water straight away. Gave her a little more today.



Henrietta (Hindu Kush) - Apart rom the burnt cotyledon she seems good as rain! I reckon it's because she wasn't exposed to the same lumens as the others, thus escaping the majority of the heat factor when the A/C broke down.


Learning experience - I've figured that my exhaust fans are inadequate, and the positive pressure inside the box hinders the cool outside air from maximum flow inward. I've opened up the outlet holes on the top and placed a picture in front of it to hide from view and the force coming out of that hole was significant.
Soluton - Ordered another 80mm fan to be used as an exhaust fan.

Tip garnered from the sight - Old christmas light fittings were used to hang more 6700k lights, works a treat!! ( I think I read about this from MasterHemp in the Aussie Growers Forum).

One Love, Jah Bles.

Day 21
Not alot to do with the girls over the last few days excpet monitor their progress and water them. Keep an eye on the Tempretures because it's been very very hot here.
Gave a little yesterday and a little more today. They've certainly grown a bit but they are so short, with the nodes so tightly packed that I'm not confident enough to fimm or Top.
Lucy (Day 21):



Ruby (Day 21):





Henrietta (Day 7):



Plan: Maintain the rage!! Be patient, feed water with a touch of the "plant starter" formula for the roots to become super strong.
After Day 28 I will recommence with nute feeding at 1/4 strength.
Points to note: Awaiting delivery of some stores which will help, digital PH meter, larger fan for exhaust , and some good grow lights.

Questions for those visiting this grow journal:
Can I start with the 1/4 or 1/2 nutes? The one I have is Miracle grow (see Pic for contents):

Miracle grow:




Jah Bless,
Yarndi

Day 22
Plants are starting to have an "aroma".
Henrietta is really putting in some strides.
Ruby is looking like a war horse.
Lucy is struggling.
The lower leaves are yellow and she doesn't seem to be stretching at all.
Lucy Day 22 - I'd appeciate some guidance/advice on this one - she's stunted and yellowing.



Here's Ruby:



Henrietta Day 8

Update on the Yellowing Leaves

After some profound things inside my head, and some reading, I believe that the trouble with Lucy may be Nitrogen Deficiency. See link: http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688
Tomorrow I will mix a weak solution of the Miracle grow and foliar feed her.
I hope this works. I will check back here before I commence the procedure just in case anyone has read this and considers this a radical idea not worth pursuing.

Day 24 Morning
Crickey. This morning I mixed a mild dose of Miracle Grow fertiliser, this wasn't an exact science but I believe it to be a little less than 1/4 strength.
I mist-sprayed Lucy and ruby (Foliar feeding)and then watered the girls 1.5 litres between them.
Within minutes Lucy had perked right up!!!
I'll update again this afternoon to see how things are going.
Tempretures are ranging between 31 Celsius right now, and as low as 15 degress over night.
Comments/guidance/advice are welcome.
Cheers,
Yarndi.

31 sounds a lil hot man but im pretty new to this so could be wrong lol

odlaw said:

31 sounds a lil hot man but im pretty new to this so could be wrong lol

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Yeah you're probably right, but at 31 degrees celsius we're actually looking for jackets and jumpers we're I'm from.
It's very difficult to maintain the temps throughout the day.
What about the plan for the nutrients? Too early? Too much? Not enough? Wrong composition?

Thanks for coming back,

Yarndi.

Day 24 Afternoon

Lucy
Two Folage feeds today, my research shows that the affected keaves will not recover, however there is new growth.
I will maintain the new regime with lucy of foliar feeding twice a day at two more times this week, then recommence with the 1/4 strength nutes from day 28.
I'd love for some advice/guidance/observations/recommendations.



Ruby, is looking really good. Nice colouration throughout good new growth and getting some height too.
She is responding well to the 1/4 strength nutes today and I will also foliar feed her until day 28.
There is some spotting and discolouration on the bottom leaf (Bottom Right hand side of picture), however I am not too concerned about it. I will monitor it to see if there is deterioration.



Henrietta:
Going great guns so far. She will benefit from the lessons learnt with Lucy and Betty.



Comments?
I'd love for some advice/guidance/observations/recommendations.

Cheers, thanks for viewing.

Yarndiyarns

Lucy's leaves may not recover but they are still green and still doing their job so your loss was minimal and the knowledge gained valuable

Th eonly advice that I can give you would be to back off and let them grow a little - your soil should have everything that they need for a while yet, just ease off on the water and they will be fine.

They yellowing is nute burn. I have spouted seedlings and grew them for over 5 weeks before giving them nutes. They grew to about 6 inches then you could tell they were wanting some real food(slowly killing off older leaves). I would just feed the seedling water untill u start seeing the new growth coming in green. The seedlings that are all green are great the other ones the food is too strong. Kush is ppm sensative

Hey Yarndi. I am about to set sail on my first Stealth Cabinet Soil/Cfl voyage also so I am subbed to help learn. Thanks for taking me along for the ride.

Hey Yarndi, are you letting Lucy's soil dry out a little before watering again, she seems to be over-watered to me with the drooping of leaves, the last pic i saw the soil seemed wet and it still does in the newest pics, but there looking good aslong as the new growth is nice and healthy your good

Grumpy Old Dreamer said:

Lucy's leaves may not recover but they are still green and still doing their job so your loss was minimal and the knowledge gained valuable

Th eonly advice that I can give you would be to back off and let them grow a little - your soil should have everything that they need for a while yet, just ease off on the water and they will be fine.

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Thanks Mr. G, I appreciate your return. Good advice that.

smokedup12 said:

They yellowing is nute burn. I have spouted seedlings and grew them for over 5 weeks before giving them nutes. They grew to about 6 inches then you could tell they were wanting some real food(slowly killing off older leaves). I would just feed the seedling water untill u start seeing the new growth coming in green. The seedlings that are all green are great the other ones the food is too strong. Kush is ppm sensative

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Smokedup, thanks for coming back.
From my reading/research I discovered that both nute burn and nute deficiency have similar signs in the initial stage , that being the yellowing of the leaves, however the other indications of nute burn are not there. 1. I have been careful with the amount of nutrition, 2. The leaf tips are not browning after more than one week, and have not shrivelled up at all.
I did suspect it at first (nute burn) but after further reading and observation I deduce that it is Nitrogen deficiency (see link - http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688 ) .
What I am going to do is start to measure the PH of the run-off at it's next feeding (once my digital Ph meter arrives) to get a better indication of what is going on there.
I have been lucky enoguh to get the great man "Riddleme" to have a look and he offered some pearlers - it only took him five or six lines - Poor soil (peat additive which requires some dolomite lime) temps (waiting on delivery of additional fan for exhaust-bloody hard here with really hot climate), and over-watering.
Not sure what to do about the dolomite , may have to wait a few days before I head back in to town for a shopping trip (we have to consider the costs with fuel, can make it an expensive bit of lime!!)
Just on 'Riddleme" - After his short message I re-read his work, lots and lots of pages that he has produced, and I understand that I have most probably locked out the nitrogen from Lucy with the peat.
Lucy started to exhibit this yellowing after about one week and whilst on the first day of what i thought was recovery I though it was over...WRONG!! what has been happening is that with the watering the peat is actually lowering the soils Ph and thus negating my nutrient feeds and effectively I have 'lock-out'. I believe the foliar feeding is assisting to over-come some of this but it may be just a band-aid solution until I get the lime.

The other thing I read and now understand is the "make it rain" thread. I shall be applying this technique (which is pretty simple really, once you understand what is going on with plant energy production), once the plant has recovered.

Reason that Ruby is doing better is because the soil she lives in has less peat in it.

Thanks for your input, I appreciate it.

wannasmokeweed said:

Hey Yarndi. I am about to set sail on my first Stealth Cabinet Soil/Cfl voyage also so I am subbed to help learn. Thanks for taking me along for the ride.

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Hey man, that's kewl. we can be BUD Brothers!! It'll be a joint adventure, send me the link when you can

MasterHemp said:

Hey Yarndi, are you letting Lucy's soil dry out a little before watering again, she seems to be over-watered to me with the drooping of leaves, the last pic i saw the soil seemed wet and it still does in the newest pics, but there looking good aslong as the new growth is nice and healthy your good

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MH, you're spot on again. I guess I am guilty og the two most common Noob mistakes - over wtering and over doing it with the nutes.
The pics are usually taken after I water the plants but I have been getting better at drowning them with 'love'.
Been following your grow too, I wished I had started a 60 day wonder myself after that.

Plan for today:
Just watch and observe. fine mist feed Lucy, and monitor the temperatures.

Yarndi.

Generally nute burn can cause the tip of the leaf to brown or stay a bit yellow. A strong indication of nute burn is tips of new growth are browning and yellowing which is present in your picture.
During a deficiency you would see the lower leafs go yellow then brown, this is because the plant is sucking the energy from lower leaves and using it on the new growth.
Now during a PH fluctuation i have seen entire plant go yellow and slowly go brown and die. I have only seen this type of issue in hydro. Soil is usually pretty good for ph stability. But depending on what your soil additives were orginaly in the mix and such this can defenitly be the issue.

Keep in mid if your using just cfls your soil is going to take a while to dry. HPS a day or two , CFLs a week +.