NFT drowned roots/ early transplanting. Advice on best ways to remedy the situation.

Hello

I have been on and off RIU for 5 years but never posted before only read. Used to use soil on Autopots switched to NFT had some good and some bad results.

I have Cheese growing in a 6ft NFT trays with two HPS lights above each tray. I had cuttings in 1' rockwell cubes transplanted into 4' cubes. hand fed (0.8 EC Canna Vega A+B and Roots accellerator. 0.6ish straight out the tap) on vermiculite for two weeks whilst under a combo of 250w CFL then 600w MH as they looked strong enough for MH.

So far so good.

Decided to transplant into NFT as the roots looked strong enough and the time constraints in the setting I am in. As I began to transplant them I could see that some of the cubes had roots that needed longer to grow before transplanting to NFT but had no time to do this.

Also I switched to using a stronger pump for each NFT tray (MJ1000 instead of the MJ500), from the last grow due to nute circulation problems in the past.

The upshot is that after two weeks in NFT the roots are not looking, good stubby off-white color at best and tiny little brown things at worst. Usually I would expect a lot more height increase for first two weeks of flower but whilst some have stretched OK others look really stunted. I think the combination of not letting them get root bound before transplanting and the raised water level with the new pump has suffocated my ladies badly . I've switched to 15min on 15min off the nute pump during light cycle and off completely at night as of this morning to try give them more air to root zone (usually I run nute pump 24/7). I've already got air stones in the res and a good strong pump for general nute mix in the res.

another contributing factor may be that in one res the E.C. spiked at 1.6 at the end of the first week. After starting at about 1.0-1.2 but I've been using a E.C. of 0.8.-1.0 this week in that res to try flush them a bit.

Feed: Canna A+B vega, roots accellerator, multi-zyme, dash of liquid oxygen (1.0-1.2 EC) Generally using a 50% feed of everything except roots accelerator which I am using 100% recommended. Weekly change

P.H. 5.5-6.3

Temps 68-84F / 20-29C (Bit wild I know trying to tame)

Res temp 62.5-69.8F / 17-21C

RH% 30-40 (This is about as humid as I can seem to get)

I hope this is enough information
I cannot post picks unfortunately but the info provided should be enough

What I really would like to know is:

• Advice on how best to try encourage root growth.
• Could a stronger pump and raised water level in the NFT tray be doing more harm than good, should I switch back to the weaker pump?

• After 2 weeks of 12-12 should I try go back to 16-8 to encourage more growth for a couple of weeks or will that upset them even more.

Thanks in advance for any feedback I am feeling very upset for the poor girls.

You mentioned some of them are browning. Nute stain or are they slimy?

2 weeks of 12/12 has already stimulated the plants hormones to start flowering. Switching back now would have pretty bad results given my personal experience in doing this. My plant just stopped doing anything for about 3 weeks, and when new shoots started growing they were strange looking/deformed. Highly recommend against it.

I Will have a look and let you know. Can not look at them untill the lights switch again.

Thanks buddy.

Pretty sure the brown is nute stain. I cant see any slime.

The roots seem to be growing well to the edge of the 4" rockwell cubes but not out of the cubes and onto the NFT spreader mat except the odd tap root. They look happier since I've put the nute pump onto 15 on/15 off but still not great. I thinking about switching back to the old nute pumps or use one of the more powerful pumps to feed two trays?

Also, I'm going to stick on 12/12. I've tried to reverse before and had weird deformed growth after weeeks of waiting.

Grateful for any more advice.

I wish I had some more advice for you bud, but it looks like you have everything in good shape. Even your spike to 1.6 EC isn't going to be enough to seriously stunt growth. I've had slowed growth from early transplanting so maybe that is the case here.

PetFlora said:

Not an NFT fan. Your issues are not unusual. Roots need a little 'me' time. Most growers wind up abandoning NFT for easier to control set ups. I have developed my own hybrid system based on 4 different hydro systems. If interested, you can click on my sig...

Anyway, I saw no mention of what size AIR Pump you are using to keep rez saturated with DO. AP size will depend on Rez Volume- another thing I did not see in your post

I use a 35 lpm air pump + 4 large oxy cylinders good for ~ 5, and MAYBE 10 gallons. Larger rez, just double the pumps. There are more powerful pumps but they run HOT and are NOISY

Click to expand...

NFT does not require any air pumps
the motion of the shallow flowing solution provides excellent oxygen levels and very fast growth
i have used these systems for around 20 years they are very simple less complex than DWC and flood n drain imo
no noisy pumps the systems run silent
Of course your mileage may vary

peace

Get a mazzei air injector 1078 and mag drive 9.5 pump and put it in your reservoir. Problem solved and stop using air stones and air pumps. Air stones clog and air pumps sux. I run this in a 16 gallon reservoir and my dissolved oxygen is at 9.10 run off 8.90 that is max saturation my roots are fish bones on top of fish bones on top of fish bones etc. It's all about maxing oxygen in your nutes. If you do use tubes with sprayers get some egg crate (light diffuser) cut to size wrap in silk screen and install in the bottom of your tubes this gives the roots something to lay on and gives drainage prevents roots damming the water also gives more space for oxygen to be absorbed. Good luck

Hammer's experience is contrary to mine.

I am using the same 35 lpm air pump ($20) for several years. Totally quiet. I am 10 ft away as I write this, and all I hear is the bubbles breaking the surface. Also Oxystones (@ $4) don't clog or deteriorate. Hammer, how about a link to the Mazzei

hammer21 said:

Get a mazzei air injector 1078 and mag drive 9.5 pump and put it in your reservoir. Problem solved and stop using air stones and air pumps. Air stones clog and air pumps sux. I run this in a 16 gallon reservoir and my dissolved oxygen is at 9.10 run off 8.90 that is max saturation my roots are fish bones on top of fish bones on top of fish bones etc. It's all about maxing oxygen in your nutes. If you do use tubes get some egg crate (light diffuser) cut to size wrap in silk screen and install in the bottom of your tubes this gives the roots something to lay on and also gives more space for oxygen to be absorbed. Good luck

Click to expand...

http://www.bigbrandwater.com/mazzei40.html here you go

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4czczYnuM_w

1078 is about 4 to 5 times larger than in the video

I'm getting better results than any high pressure aero I have done in the past.

Holy Crap. Gotta get me the small one

hammer21 said:

http://www.bigbrandwater.com/mazzei40.html here you go

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4czczYnuM_w

1078 is about 4 to 5 times larger than in the video

Click to expand...

I think the whole scenario looks like a case of better luck next time.

PetFlora I have been considering to switching to some kind of bucket bubbler system for some time. I cant check the air pump capacity right now as they are sleeping but my res is 800L.

Mr Ganja I agree that you can run NFT without air supplementation but it cant hurt to play-safe particularly whilst the poor girls appear to be suffocating. LDN

Hammer21 I'm looking at those air injectors and they look the business. I'm not using a tube system but what you suggested with egg crates makes perfect sense. (Stop!.... Hammer time)

Thanks for the advice so far guys. Hope you are having a better season than me.

The company link has smaller mazzei heads for smaller pumps. Looks like a pump is still required. I then watched the YT video, and found a YT DIY venturi http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZMjDgM3LaU

How about doing a thread?

hammer21 said:

I'm getting better results than any high pressure aero I have done in the past.

Click to expand...

PetFlora said:

The company link has smaller mazzei heads for smaller pumps. Looks like a pump is still required. I then watched the YT video, and found a YT DIY venturi http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZMjDgM3LaU

How about doing a thread?

Click to expand...

I should do it because my current system really does a great job and after all the different modifications things are dialed in. I will remove a end cap today and post some pics.

Thanks for the advice Scarlet your plants look happy.

Can I ask you how many stems per m2 you've got and under what bulb (600w/1000w)?

I'm asking because it looks like a nice setup

2 Blue cheese girls in NFT 4 weeks left to finish should yield well





peace

SkunkD0c
Plants look great with 4 weeks left. You are not running any aeration other than the nutes falling off the tray into the res is that right?
Are you using Rockwool cubes cuttings from 1' to 3'/4' before transplanting?
Do you have any advice on how best to go through the different size cubes to the NFT tray smoothly (e.g. how long for each phase, how often do you water, using what light, temps and RH% etc.)? It's always the transplanting process i find tricky. Sometimes I have no problems other times it really slows the plants down.

Thanks in advance for any more advice. (Based in the big smoke myself)