Much better luck the simpler I make organic soils.

VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
Just thought I'd throw this out there. I see so many super convoluted organic super soil mixes these days, and tried a few with nothing but issues.

I've moved on to an incredibly simple mix that lasted over 100 days on tap water last run, and this run is at day 50 something with no issues. The difference was night and day compared to the convoluted mixes I have tried in the past.

*Yard soil/Coco/pumice 40:40:20 (50L)
*1 cup combination rock dust (oyster shell, gypsum, lime, magnesite, basalt, palagonite, volcanic, glacial and diatomaceous earth)
*10L fresh vermicompost

There is no npk amendments bar the vermicompost at first. I run the medium in 2.5L pots for the first three weeks and then up pot into 5 gallon pots, where I then top dress with 2tbsp organic (B-Green) 3:1:3 slow release which gets me through until harvest.
IMG_20221204_131339.jpgIMG_20221204_131204.jpgIMG_20221204_131404.jpg
Heres two going ATM in 5 gallon pots, around day 54 so far, without a single leaf blemish. Don't know how it would go with long veg as these were done 12/12 from seed, but seems to fit the bill for short runs around 90 days.

Just thought this might come in handy for some, as adding a thousand amendments seemed to fail miserably for me the first few times I tried organic.

Each run I have simplified, and results have been better and better as I go.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
Hotrod2 said:
Thank you for sharing. I veg and Bloom in the same 5 gallon. Do you think your recipe would work if I top dressed during bloom?
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should do. If I have issues this run, I'll be top dressing some organic 4-6-8 mid bloom as I have only completed one previous run with this medium, and it could have been a fluke with less demanding plants.

The medium should do well with added top dress as it is far less laden with nutrients compared to other mixes I tried in the past. The issue with this mix is that everyone's yard soil will vary (greatly). I have nice Sandy Loam which sits under a large portion of trees.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
I have planted a few Nepalese and a strawberry cough in some bagged organic mix (Dr Greenthumb's Greenspace), and I'll be looking forward to putting the yard soil to the test beside a decent bagged organic mix.
 
Hotrod2

Hotrod2

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
I have planted a few Nepalese and a strawberry cough in some bagged organic mix (Dr Greenthumb's Greenspace), and I'll be looking forward to putting the yard soil to the test beside a decent bagged organic mix.
Click to expand...
My soil is custom made for me. I have always had good luck and frosty buds. Now I'm trying to have larger more compact buds. I like the idea of simple.
 
Week4@inCharge

Week4@inCharge

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
Just thought I'd throw this out there. I see so many super convoluted organic super soil mixes these days, and tried a few with nothing but issues.

I've moved on to an incredibly simple mix that lasted over 100 days on tap water last run, and this run is at day 50 something with no issues. The difference was night and day compared to the convoluted mixes I have tried in the past.

*Yard soil/Coco/pumice 40:40:20 (50L)
*1 cup combination rock dust (oyster shell, gypsum, lime, magnesite, basalt, palagonite, volcanic, glacial and diatomaceous earth)
*10L fresh vermicompost

There is no npk amendments bar the vermicompost at first. I run the medium in 2.5L pots for the first three weeks and then up pot into 5 gallon pots, where I then top dress with 2tbsp organic (B-Green) 3:1:3 slow release which gets me through until harvest.
View attachment 5233661View attachment 5233662View attachment 5233663
Heres two going ATM in 5 gallon pots, around day 54 so far, without a single leaf blemish. Don't know how it would go with long veg as these were done 12/12 from seed, but seems to fit the bill for short runs around 90 days.

Just thought this might come in handy for some, as adding a thousand amendments seemed to fail miserably for me the first few times I tried organic.

Each run I have simplified, and results have been better and better as I go.
Click to expand...
What were you using before that didn't work out for you? I'm betting the yard soil is the secret ingredient here. Were you using the yard soil before the new recipe? I'm reading lot of controversial stuff concerning this rock dust, I'm glad your grow is doing great. What pH is your soil? I have 5 pounds of this proprietary blend (Craft Blend) I'm on the fence now because of the rock dust in it. There's a thread here somewhere that asks..what 3 amendments would you only use in a grow.. I'm really tempted to just try three amendments this next wave. Your plants look super healthy, so not getting this anti rock dust out there, all I could think of is maybe you got some very nice yard soil.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
Week4@inCharge said:
What were you using before that didn't work out for you? I'm betting the yard soil is the secret ingredient here. Were you using the yard soil before the new recipe? I'm reading lot of controversial stuff concerning this rock dust, I'm glad your grow is doing great. What pH is your soil? I have 5 pounds of this proprietary blend (Craft Blend) I'm on the fence now because of the rock dust in it. There's a thread here somewhere that asks..what 3 amendments would you only use in a grow.. I'm really tempted to just try three amendments this next wave. Your plants look super healthy, so not getting this anti rock dust out there, all I could think of is maybe you got some very nice yard soil.
Click to expand...
I was using peat, propagation sand/horticultural charcoal, perlite and compost mix with Neem, kelp, alfalfa, coconut, barley , phosphate and soybean meals (Dr greenthumbs go/grow and bud/bloom mixes) and dolomite and calcitic lime instead of the combination rock dust (below). 5L propagation sand, 2.5L charcoal and 1/2 cup lime per 40L medium.

I'm pretty sure I just couldn't time top dress for the life of me, and the meals weren't as slow release as the organic beads I'm using.
16702940924795604935372703776305.jpg
From what I can see, I have a far more viable microbe population, plus thousands of hypoaspis miles using yard soil which is alive.

I always ended up with low pH and gnats with the last few runs. The current medium sits at 6.6 with a slurry test.
 
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VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
@Week4@inCharge

When it comes to a go to amendment trio, Tbh, it's a hard one this time as the only amendments were fresh vermicompost, the combo rock dust and the organic 3:1:3.

I'm so new to organics that I can't really recommend three solid amendments as these two runs are the only ones that have actually worked organically.

I'm pretty sure I've been over liming my organic mixes previously.
 
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Week4@inCharge

Week4@inCharge

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
I was using peat, propagation sand/horticultural charcoal, perlite and compost mix with Neem, kelp, alfalfa, coconut, barley , phosphate and soybean meals (Dr greenthumbs go/grow and bud/bloom mixes) and dolomite and calcitic lime instead of the combination rock dust (below). 5L propagation sand, 2.5L charcoal and 1/2 cup lime per 40L medium.

I'm pretty sure I just couldn't time top dress for the life of me, and the meals weren't as slow release as the organic beads I'm using.
View attachment 5234323
From what I can see, I have a far more viable microbe population, plus thousands of hypoaspis miles using yard soil which is alive.

I always ended up with low pH and gnats with the last few runs. The current medium sits at 6.6 with a slurry test.
Click to expand...
If it's working for you....keep doing it. Man I wish I had some descent yard soil here. Less is more sometimes. Thanks for sharing.
 
Week4@inCharge

Week4@inCharge

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
@Week4@inCharge

When it comes to a go to amendment trio, Tbh, it's a hard one this time as the only amendments were fresh vermicompost, the combo rock dust and the organic 3:1:3.

I'm so new to organics that I can't really recommend three solid amendments as these two runs are the only ones that have actually worked organically.

I'm pretty sure I've been over liming my organic mixes previously.
Click to expand...
Dolomite Limestone (Down To Earth) has been my go to, won't mess with the pH of your soil as it caps at 7Ph... few tablespoons a pot. (7-10 gallon) Its a good combo with peat based soil. Offsets the acidity. I'm starting to think top dressing a little every two weeks is the way to go, not all the way sure yet, maybe someone will chime in about it.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
2x Nepali on the left, day 3.
1x strawberry cough day 11 back right
1x Chem #4 (just germed up the front)
And a bag seed yet to germ in the little starter, no idea what it is just in case the Chem fails as it's looking a bit off. All in 180Wx160H pots (roughly 2.5L) bar the orange pot which is 170x125mm.
IMG20221206164858.jpg
These are all in Dr Greenthumbs Greenspace potting mix cut 80:20 with extra perlite. We'll see how a basic bagged mix goes. Bloody $60 for 54L. Better be worth it. The strawberry cough not looking too good so far as it holds so much water compared to my mix.

Will be thrown into a 3x3 with 2x150w qb's when up potted to 3 or 5 gallon pots.
 
go go kid

go go kid

Well-Known Member
i had 4 go over 100 days on just organic soil from the local tip, all green waste gets turned into soil/ptting compost.
chicken shit (literaly just the composted shit from our chickens)/seaweed meal/fish blood n bone/bone meal/ chicken shit granules and super phosphate powder. could have done with more nitrogen come the end, but all other minerals and trace elemets were presant. nice n easy. will wor wonders for my clones.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
go go kid said:
i had 4 go over 100 days on just organic soil from the local tip, all green waste gets turned into soil/ptting compost.
chicken shit (literaly just the composted shit from our chickens)/seaweed meal/fish blood n bone/bone meal/ chicken shit granules and super phosphate powder. could have done with more nitrogen come the end, but all other minerals and trace elemets were presant. nice n easy. will wor wonders for my clones.
Click to expand...
My first attempt organic I got to roughly 45 days from germination and the plant fully imploded. Like literally. I'll see if I have pics.

Right. Day 44 from germ, had top dressed 2 tbsp go/grow and 4tbsp bud/bloom five days beforehand.
Screenshot_2022-12-06-18-22-10-02.png
4 weeks later lol.
Screenshot_2022-12-06-18-23-08-52.png
In that timeframe I top dressed dr greenthumbs bud/bloom twice more, fed 2-2-4 organic bloom at 1.5ec twice a week and it just never came back.

Second run was better, but I hit a solid wall around week 6 of flower again. No necrosis, but pH was 5.8 and the plant went a perfectly uniform yellow again with pink tips and serrations like last time.

I was like the worst at organics ever the first few runs. They were all peat, compost, perlite mixes with dr greenthumbs go/grow and bud/bloom (different blends of Neem, kelp, alfalfa, coconut, soybean, barley, phosphate and rock dust mixes, 4-2-3 grow and 0.5-2-3 bloom).

I went from pulling 5-7oz autos in Coco to completely butchering my first two plants in organic medium. It nearly broke me.
 
GreenestBasterd

GreenestBasterd

Well-Known Member
Great post Vince! And plants look fantastic!

I recently changed from a homemade coots mix, to 60% peat 30% homemade Worm castings and 10% re-used coots mix.
No topdress just a weekly fish hydrosalate (cap full in 20 litres) from dr greenthumbs and aerated barley tea, then just water.
I’m betting like your yard soil, the castings are where the magic is in a mix like this.
 
Week4@inCharge

Week4@inCharge

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
My first attempt organic I got to roughly 45 days from germination and the plant fully imploded. Like literally. I'll see if I have pics.

Right. Day 44 from germ, had top dressed 2 tbsp go/grow and 4tbsp bud/bloom five days beforehand.
View attachment 5234387
4 weeks later lol.
View attachment 5234388
In that timeframe I top dressed dr greenthumbs bud/bloom twice more, fed 2-2-4 organic bloom at 1.5ec twice a week and it just never came back.

Second run was better, but I hit a solid wall around week 6 of flower again. No necrosis, but pH was 5.8 and the plant went a perfectly uniform yellow again with pink tips and serrations like last time.

I was like the worst at organics ever the first few runs. They were all peat, compost, perlite mixes with dr greenthumbs go/grow and bud/bloom (different blends of Neem, kelp, alfalfa, coconut, soybean, barley, phosphate and rock dust mixes, 4-2-3 grow and 0.5-2-3 bloom).

I went from pulling 5-7oz autos in Coco to completely butchering my first two plants in organic medium. It nearly broke me.
Click to expand...
what was/is your water source? (Nice fat nug there) I'm asking because my tap water is high in calcium carbonate. been going through a lot for 2 years wondering what the heck is going on with some of my flowers. Now I'm almost sure it's the calcium carbonate build up in my soil. It seems like a calcium toxicity will block out phosphorous and magnesium.
 
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Greenman71

Greenman71

Active Member
Simpler is better. I have extended that to topping and training as well. Used to, I would veg my plants for weeks and weeks, topping and training them. Now I just top them once at node 8 or 9 or 10, and toss them in flower. Very little training, and just defoliation once or twice when they get bushy. I've found that they still produce ample tops, and just naturally even out at the canopy, and seem much more vigorous when budding, with crazy trichomes and terpenes. The few times i didn't top at all, I still got a pretty even canopy, only with a big central spire top cola. The longer I grow, the more I realize we have complicated this whole process way way way too much.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
Week4@inCharge said:
what was/is your water source? (Nice fat nug there) I'm asking because my tap water is high in calcium carbonate. been going through a lot for 2 years wondering what the heck is going on with some of my flowers. Now I'm almost sure it's the calcium carbonate build up in my soil. It seems like a calcium toxicity will block out phosphorous and magnesium.
Click to expand...
Haven't had a good breakdown of our tap water, but it averages around 7.8ph and 200-250ppm, but has been as high as 450 after the floods. I've had issues similar beforehand when I used garden lime too heavily.
 
VincenzioVonHook

VincenzioVonHook

Well-Known Member
At around day 71 on tap water and the hue is starting to lighten a wee bit. Do have some burn so it could be lockout. I'm running slow release prills so excess could be building up as I don't run off much. Could just be hungry but I'm going to leave it on tap water and see what the medium lacks.
IMG_20221221_080728.jpg
 
Week4@inCharge

Week4@inCharge

Well-Known Member
VincenzioVonHook said:
At around day 71 on tap water and the hue is starting to lighten a wee bit. Do have some burn so it could be lockout. I'm running slow release prills so excess could be building up as I don't run off much. Could just be hungry but I'm going to leave it on tap water and see what the medium lacks.
View attachment 5240001
Click to expand...
If you have a soil EC meter it could help measure if they're eating or not. I measure mine daily and see a small drop, that tells me they are eating.
 
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