Marijuana Bloom with 504W LED

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overmyhead

Well-Known Member
LEDGirl said:
Yes, I am familiar with them. Solaroasis was the company who did all the research behind those lights, and if my memory serves me correctly, they are the ones NASA tried out in space. The original design used 660nm, 612nm, and 465nm, with 15 degree and 30 degree, extremely low wattage (like 1/10th watt?) LED's, and produced some of the worst results of any LED grow light on the market, at the highest cost per watt (results at www.Greenpinelane.com). I don't know what development they've done since then, but they still use low wattage LED's, which don't have the power to grow/bloom our plants at an effective rate. The last time I spoke to LED-Grow-Master, I was told that their bars are not stand-alone lighting, that they are supplemental lighting, and you still need to use HID. Again, I don't know if this has changed since then, but I do see that you have supplemental lighting, which is probably supplying you with the majority of your growth.

If I can offer you 1 major piece of advice, since you already have the lights, use them at 3" above your plants. I know you're not going to get a ton of spread from them at that distance, but those low wattage LED's have very little light energy. Using them so high (even though the MFR tells you to do so), they're unable to penetrate your plants, which is vital for growth. Anyhow, best of luck!
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Hey LED girl, kudos for sticking in here and showing your stuff. However, I have to dissagree with you on the lgm bar issue. As I mentioned before, I used them (six but I have added two more since) in conjunction with two 600w hids on my first grow ever and did really well. Especially when you consider that:

1. Off and on during both veg and flower I toyed with the mfg's concept of having led's on for the whole photo period but only having the hids on for 30 minutes every 3 or 4 hours

2. while doing that and at other points I dimmed my hid's to 75 and sometimes 50% (dimmable ballast)

3. both of my 600's were out of commission for two weeks in the middle of flowering! I did have an old school 400 that I found in the garage that I used off and on during that time but still . . . .

So, when it was all said and done, in a sunhut xxl with 7 plants from seed and numerous newbe mistakes and other issues the total yield was just under 2 of amazing medicine.

When I look back at everything that happened - those little bars kicked ass! Here are some pics of the setup and my prize chocolope that had 172 on it and a pure power that had 120. By the way, if any of you get the pure power freebee seeds, it is easy to grow and is great to use to mix in with extreme sativas to get differing effects.

Also, on the distance thing, they market and sell these things mostly to greenhouse operations for supplemental lighting so they might be anywhere from 5-20' from the cannopy and still get results.
 

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LEDGirl

LEDGirl

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Wait, did you say 2 ounces off of 7 plants under a 1200W HPS??? If so, those are really, really poor results. If it's 2 pounds, show me the dried photo. So you're running 2, 600W units, and what, 6 of those $300, 9W grow bars? I see they've gone down to $260 each now...still a joke.

All in all, you have OVER $1600 worth of low-power LED grow bars as SUPPLEMENTAL light. OF COURSE you're going to want to attribute growth to them. You don't want to feel like you completely wasted your money lol. That's gotta be a hard one to chew...
 
potlike

potlike

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LEDGirl said:
Wait, did you say 2 ounces off of 7 plants under a 600W HPS??? I'm not saying this to be mean, but those are really, really poor results. That means you yielded only 8 grams per plant on average. And to me, it looks like 2, 600W units, and what, 6 of those $400, 9W grow bars?
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he didn't say ounces... probably meant 2 pounds.

-potlike
 
LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
potlike said:
he didn't say ounces... probably meant 2 pounds.

-potlike
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If it's pounds, show it on a scale, or the whole crop chopped up. When you say nearly 2, or just under 2, that could be 1.5 or anything close to it. And Again, take out the HID all together and see how much he yields...

You've gotta be able to make a justification somewhere for $1600 of supplemental lighting, when you only get 54W of total LED... The 63W unit I have puts out more total light than all 6 of your bars, works as a stand-alone light source, and it only costs $225... ($40 less than 1 of their 9w bars)
 
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cruzer101

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Hi LEDgirl,

Nice to see someone with enough money and experience to grow with LEDs and get a decent yield. Not everyone has Thousands of dollars to spend on grow lights. I have read most of your posts and got a pretty good idea where you are coming from, I wish you and your girlfriend success in selling your lights.

I have done a bit of research myself and bought a couple low power kits and ten one watt luxeon stars, made an array with them to supplement my lighting.

I see your lights do cover both reds and both blues as well as white (3000k) not sure about the 740 nm I really don't know where the infra red comes into play. I understand the difference between 120° and 60° penetration power and see how that would be beneficial.
Are these Cree LEDs?

Seeing as you have owned a hydro shop in the past I would assume you have a bit of an edge on others when it comes to knowledge of the available products on the market. So I ask you to please explain something to me.

How do several small lights get the penetration power of a large one?
Are you saying it is all in the lens?

Take 10 100 watt bulbs put them together and lite them up.
Compare that to a thousand watt bulb. I assume you would agree the actual light from a 1000 watt bulb will be brighter and carry further. That would lead me to believe it would penetrate further.

Back to LEDs, with a very narrow lens, like a pointer has. Thats like a laser right? We all know that those carry a great distance but my guess is that are using more then one or three watts.

My current grow was going to be an LED grow but at $800 for two lights I figured it would take over two years to recoup the investment and I don't know if I will still be growing by then. Instead I am testing Phillips new Ceramic metal Halide to flower with. What a swing eh? I went from supplying small amounts of the perfect spectrum to bombarding them with it all with the assumption they will just use what they need.

I have two cabinets, side by side that I intend to compare lighting with.
Same strain, same res, same environmental conditions the only difference will be the lighting. Right now its CMH vs. T5 But will one day be HPS vs. LED I just need to see it for myself.

Oh, and thanks for sharing all this info with us here at rollitup.


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cruzer101

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I just payed a visit to your site and got my answers. Creating a sheet of light over the canopy thats focused better makes some sense to me. What I didn't get is you use 126 watts of led at optimum distance to compare to a 400 watt MH 2 feet away. Don't you think the MH should have been closer to get a better comparison?

Then in your purchase link again you state your LED is equivalent to 400 w HPS Yet your test was compared to a 150 watt HPS, in the seedling state I might add.

My 400 watt is in a cool tube eight inches away from my buds. I do this to get a yield of a 600 watt bulb. Optimum use of the existing equipment.

What I would like to see and plan on doing at some point is a fair comparison.
Looks like you have a good product there. I may take you up on a challenge, 400 watt CMH cool tube VS. 126 Watt LED

Both lights at optimum distance, aero, same res. no CO2 just same ventilation. I think that is what most people would like to see so they can truly make an informed decision.
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overmyhead

Well-Known Member
LEDGirl said:
Wait, did you say 2 ounces off of 7 plants under a 1200W HPS??? If so, those are really, really poor results. If it's 2 pounds, show me the dried photo. So you're running 2, 600W units, and what, 6 of those $300, 9W grow bars? I see they've gone down to $260 each now...still a joke.

All in all, you have OVER $1600 worth of low-power LED grow bars as SUPPLEMENTAL light. OF COURSE you're going to want to attribute growth to them. You don't want to feel like you completely wasted your money lol. That's gotta be a hard one to chew...
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Wow, so you just ripped into me for just giving my experience in regard to the distance the lgms should be from the plants and whether or not they are effective that far away? Did you read all of the facts that I stated? Funny joke about the two oz - especially when there's pics that are obviously more than that per. I didn't rely on the HIDs in fact they were completely out (save an old 400 that I had all the way on one side of the tent for a few days) for two weeks in the middle of flower and then rest of the time they were off/on and dimmed. From everything I've seen it was a pretty good show for a 100% greenhorn.

As far as a picture of a scale - I didn't take one, and why would I? It just seems silly as I'm not trying to sell something and have nothing to prove here. Even if I did, how would you know it came from that tent? For that matter, how do we know you're not moving plants from one room to another to take pictures. I know I wouldn't go through the trouble but who knows if someone would? It was just under two pounds, there are pictures of two of seven plants (those are 18 gal rubbermaid totes to give you an idea of the overall plant size) that yielded over ten o. There were two others that did about 6 ea, one 5 and 2 others that did 4 combined.

Obviously, I felt that the lights sucked enough to get two more bars.

One thing I can tell you for sure is that I will continue to experiment with LED lighting but will not be purchasing any from you. You see, when I started looking into them, there were lots of people making incredible claims with respect to potential and I felt like Jon at LGM was the only person who was giving me the real scoop and not some crazy sales pitch about how their lights could totally replace conventional lighting.

Anyway, good luck and I hope that the technology continues to progress.
 
LEDGirl

LEDGirl

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For Everyone currently posting references:

I am NOT here to sell lights, that is not my purpose on this forum. My only purpose is to post results of my own grow, and my friends grow, and to answer any questions that people might have regarding the lights we used, plants, etc... It doesn't matter who you buy your light from, I just care that you're able to learn something or be entertained via the information I can provide.

Please, and this goes to everyone, stop making references to my website, especially in any sort of a sales type manner. Sales and forums are two separate things to me. If you want to talk sales, send me an email or a PM if you don't have it. If you have a question you feel would benefit everyone on the forum, and not just yourself, please feel free to ask.
 
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SupaDupa

Member
I really like how beautiful the plants look under those LED's, aesthetically pleasing. I have to back track to read the rest. Just wanted to say kudos
 
LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
cruzer101 said:
Are these Cree LEDs?
How do several small lights get the penetration power of a large one?
Are you saying it is all in the lens?

Take 10 100 watt bulbs put them together and lite them up. Compare that to a thousand watt bulb. I assume you would agree the actual light from a 1000 watt bulb will be brighter and carry further. That would lead me to believe it would penetrate further.

Back to LEDs, with a very narrow lens, like a pointer has. Thats like a laser right? We all know that those carry a great distance but my guess is that are using more then one or three watts.​
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No, we are not currently using Cree LED's (although we may incorporate them in the future).

As far as penetration power, yes it is all in the lens. Each 1W source has only 10lm - 110lm depending on spectrum, so in order for that light to be effective, it needs to be driven via a narrow beam. Anyhow, adding multiple 1W LED's together, doesn't increase your ability to penetrate like a larger, 1000W bulb, it just creates multiple penetration sources. I really don't like to compare HID to LED, as they are two completely different technologies operating on very different platforms to create light. What it comes down to, is that you don't need as much light as you think, in order for the plants to go wild with it, you just need the proper spectrum, at a high enough intensity.
 
LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
cruzer101 said:
What I didn't get is you use 126 watts of led at optimum distance to compare to a 400 watt MH 2 feet away. Don't you think the MH should have been closer to get a better comparison?
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Considering my friend produced pound after pound after pound under her 3800W, and none of the lights were any closer than 2' away, not really (although I ran my own lights at about 12"). You said so yourself, a 400W light source has way more ability than a 1W LED to carry light energy over a distance. The LED was at 10", the MH at 24", not to mention the space is only 15" x 15" and lined in 97% reflective mylar. Aside from that, if I were to run the light any closer, the tomatoes would literally be fried. For bloom, I'm taking 1 LED plant, putting it under the MH, and then adding in the ventilation on the MH, as well as the glass.

cruzer101 said:
you state your LED is equivalent to 400 w HPS Yet your test was compared to a 150 watt HPS, in the seedling state I might add.
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Actually, it beats a 400W HPS, but I'd rather people have better results than I rate them at, rather than worse ones. My test was a 119W Beta light (16" x 8"), vs a 150W HPS, which grew at more than 3x the rate. The 126W is a much-improved version of the 119W beta light. If you want to see the bloom results, just pay attention to what the 126W is doing in my friend's grow. I'm about to post some images to show you just how the lights work.



cruzer101 said:
What I would like to see and plan on doing at some point is a fair comparison.
Looks like you have a good product there. I may take you up on a challenge, 400 watt CMH cool tube VS. 126 Watt LED
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Feel free to make it happen. Be the one who can give others on here another un-biased grow comparison if you'd like. That's kinda why I got Ed in the first place, but the more the merrier.
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LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
So I visited my friend's garden last night, and have to repeat it: OH MY GOD her buds feel like ROCKS. I can honestly say, I've never felt a plant so dense before, as that AK47. :eek: After she harvests, we'll find out just how much more dense they are, as she has a few ounces left over of the last batch of AK47 that she grew under the 3800W HID. I found a few decent size nugs that I set aside so that we can make a comparison in a few weeks, to buds of the same size/shape grown under LED with her current AK. :D

Anyhow, of course I took some pictures, and they are posted below. I want to first CLEAR something up, as there have been claims going around, that the only reason my friend's buds are so big, is because "she's using 504W LED to grow them". This is simply not true, as you'll see in the pictures. Our units have a narrow spread at 60 degrees, especially when placed within 6" of your plants. In the first photo, you'll see a picture with 4, 126W lights turned on. In the second photo, you'll see the back left light turned off. In the third photo, you'll see both back lights turned off. In the fourth photo, you'll see all but the front left light, turned off. In the fifth photo, you see much of the same that you saw in the 4th photo, but from a different angle. After you get the pictures loaded once through, flip back and forth through the first 4 several times, and you'll see how dark those plants get once the lights go out.

These images clearly display, that each 126W has a narrow area of coverage, and does not blend much at all, with the lights beside it. In the last image, you notice that the row of buds, are growing under a light that is higher than the other, making it IMPOSSIBLE for the light from the opposite 126W unit, to reach any of the upper buds. So what you are seeing, is buds grown under single, 126W light sources, except multiple plants, multiple bud sets, and therefore multiple lights. At MOST, any bud in the garden receives light from 1 unit, and another PARTIAL unit. This is important to keep in mind when looking at the results, as we are most certainly NOT using 504W LED, aimed at 1 plant, to produce buds of this size. On that note, enjoy the pictures!
 

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LEDGirl

LEDGirl

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And here is a comparison shot of an AK bud, in front of a quart sized Hydrogen Peroxide bottle. It's so big, it blocks out the bottle.
 

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cruzer101

Well-Known Member
LEDGirl said:
For Everyone currently posting references:

I am NOT here to sell lights, that is not my purpose on this forum. My only purpose is to post results of my own grow, and my friends grow, and to answer any questions that people might have regarding the lights we used, plants, etc... It doesn't matter who you buy your light from, I just care that you're able to learn something or be entertained via the information I can provide.

Please, and this goes to everyone, stop making references to my website, especially in any sort of a sales type manner. Sales and forums are two separate things to me. If you want to talk sales, send me an email or a PM if you don't have it. If you have a question you feel would benefit everyone on the forum, and not just yourself, please feel free to ask.
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Oh, I saw one of your posts yesterday and looked you up today to find it.
I searched your name and found these posts in support forum, I just assumed.


LEDGirl said:
Advertising
permalink

I might be interested in advertising on this site, depending on how things go with different threads I begin. I would like to know what you guys offer.
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LEDGirl said:
And how do I go about PM'ing rollitup? I'm not familiar with all of the controls on this forum. My intention right now is not to advertise, it's simply to gauge how responsive the forum is to areas I specialize. So far, it seems pretty responsive and the people here are really cool. Depending on the cost of it, I may be interested in something soon, in the way of actually advertising.
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LEDGirl said:
Thanks, I contacted him. You can close the thread now if you'd like, as it won't be of any real use to me anymore...
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I am sorry I guess I was mistaken.

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LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
cruzer101 said:
Oh, I saw one of your posts yesterday and looked you up today to find it.
I searched your name and found these posts in support forum, I just assumed.

I am sorry I guess I was mistaken.​
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Just because I emailed the forum administrator for information about advertising, does not mean I am a paid advertiser on this forum. I am a standard user, just as anyone else, and don't expect to operate any differently. Should I choose to go the route of paid advertising in the future, as I personally believe this forum is a great place to do so, then I would run ads like the many you already see. Until then, I'm just here to provide pictures and answer questions. So again, if you have something business related, please don't ask it on here. If I become a paid advertiser, this may change, but for now keep this thread sales free please.

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jats

jats

Well-Known Member
now I'm confused.....have you just been bagging your competitors ,,such as solar oasis..? and getting all intense on the people who own those and other lights..? ... its a touchy enough topic around here as it is... one reason for that is, it is such a new technology and so many company's trying to develop their lights competing for not so many paying customers... how can you say product marketing is not taking place ? that gives the haters more ammo.....
I know that ed is going try out your lights so that's probably why you keep saying we have to wait for his results before we all go ga ga about them... fair enough... your friends plants look lovely how many weeks into flower are they??
 
LEDGirl

LEDGirl

Active Member
jats said:
now I'm confused.....have you just been bagging your competitors ,,such as solar oasis..? and getting all intense on the people who own those and other lights..? ... its a touchy enough topic around here as it is... one reason for that is, it is such a new technology and so many company's trying to develop their lights competing for not so many paying customers... how can you say product marketing is not taking place ? that gives the haters more ammo.....
I know that ed is going try out your lights so that's probably why you keep saying we have to wait for his results before we all go ga ga about them... fair enough... your friends plants look lovely how many weeks into flower are they??
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Over 2 years ago I began researching LED's. I started off by talking to several of the companies who made them, one of which was LED Grow Master. That is what led me to find SolarOasis Research as well, and get started in my quest for information. One of my first stops back then was greenpinelane, who did a grow using the LGM grow bar, and was unable to get the plants to flower, so he put in a 90W UFO instead, and he began getting results. I also looked to Theoreme Innovations, Procyon, and several others back then, and found the things between the lights that were all similar (IE wavelengths, viewing angle, etc...). I learned from LGM later, that their lights were not meant as a primary light source, only supplemental, so I immediately crossed them off my list as feasible, due to the cost of their units and the fact that I'd still be running HID. My goal was to get away from HID.

So what I do is provide information. When I'm asked for my opinion, I provide it. When asked for an evaluation of anyone else's light from a technical standpoint, I lay it out there so it's easy to understand why their light produces the results it does, or what it would need in order to be more efficient. The principles I discuss (light intensity=viewing angle), are very simple for most people to understand, and it makes me scratch my head as to why other MFR's who have been building these lights for years, didn't think of these things already. I don't really bag on anyone, except ProSource, as I have a personal issue with them. Anyhow, I'm happy for anyone who is using LED, regardless of who they bought it from. It's because of you, that people like me got involved, and it's because of you that the technology is able to move forward, as new companies and old alike, continue to be funded by more people wanting to try the technology. But it's unfair for someone (like the guy before) to attribute his good results to 54W of low-power LED, vs the 1200W of HID he was running. You can see what the 126W panels do on these buds, so if I spread 54W out over a 4' x 4' area, with way less intensity, do you really think it will do much?

Lastly, the oldest plants in the photos are 6 weeks.
 
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overmyhead

Well-Known Member
The 54 w were spread out over a 5 x 9 area, and if you read my notes the hids were not on all of the time - they were really the supplemental lighting but whatever - I'm not here to argue but it drives me crazy when people only look at the facts that support their argument and ignore the others.
 
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