TheYokel
Well-Known Member
Hello again.
So you've read through this thread:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/nutrients-for-noobs-making-it-through-your-first-grow.850705/
You have your dirt and your go-go juice ready. You've got twenty-four 2-gallon grow bags, and you have your grandma's antique bed lamp hanging upside down in your closet... time to pop some beans. Right?
Slow down there...
(Disclaimer*- This is not meant to be a terribly in-depth or end-all-be-all post, but I hope it helps clear up some things for the grower with zero knowledge or experience at all in growing indoors. Do your research.)
First off, granny's lamp ain't gonna do the job. Those round lights you've seen for 55 years? Yeah those don't work. At all. No, seriously... put the 55-pack you got at Sam's Club down... turning your closet into Liberace's dressing room isn't going to grow anything.
To start off, let's narrow down your choices and then we can go from there into a little more detail. Your common choices you will be dealing with are:
CFL/Tubes
HPS
MH
LED
Pick one and make sure you love it, because your lighting is probably going to be your most expensive investment aside from maybe your tent.
Each light has different pros and cons to them... and literally, each one produces a different type of light.
The "color" (or wavelength, really) of light is measured in temperature, specifically Kelvins. The higher the K number, the more blue. The lower, the more red. Each color also has certain benefits to them.
Blues tend to promote more vegetative growth, promote shorter node length (less stretching), and help promote higher resin production.
Red light tends to be better for bud production.
Either can work the whole way through. Just ask the guys that flower with MHs, or the guys that veg with HPS. It will all work, and a lot of people will start with a blue MH or CFL/Tube for vegging and then move to a more red/yellow HPS for flower. It's all growers preference.
CFLs and Tubes can be purchased in either 2700k or 6400k temperatures (or close variations of those). HPS are usually in the 2300k range, and MH can range from 4000k-5500k depending on what you buy.
Remember, the lower the number, the more red... better for flower.
The higher the number, the more blue... better for veg.
So let's see what each one has to offer...
---
CFL/Tubes
Pros:
Dirt cheap (for CFLs, tubes can get expensive, fast)
Cheap and easy to replace
Can maneuver around your plants in ways other lights can't
You can mix your spectrums easily
Awesome for seedling/clones/vegging
Aaaaand, that's about it really. They are flimsy, a pain in the ass to get around, burn the shit out of you when your are trying to check trichomes... and yet that's still what I use. I'm cheap, what's your excuse?
Cons:
All of the above
Lower yields
Less lumens per watt than any other lighting available (more on that later)
Have to stay close to the plants
Can be almost as expensive as an HID (in the case of some of the higher-priced T5 fixtures/etc)
Lose efficiency after only a few months (no, just because your lights are shining, doesn't mean the light is the same as it was 6 months ago)
Can be as hot or hotter than well-cooled HIDs
Have almost zero light penetration (light isn't getting past the first two leaves, sorry)
There's others, believe me... the list is getting long enough.
But they do work, and they work well if you know how to use them. Notice in the Cons I didn't say anything about quality. I will put my CFL buds up against anyone else's buds any day. Just don't expect huge commercial yields out of them. I get a little less than a QP every six weeks out of my 400w of CFLs that I spent $40 on. That works for me. Others want a lot more. For those that do, there is the HID route, so let's look at those.
HIDs - High Intensity Discharge
So here's the money-makers for most people. If you are going for monster commercial crops, chances are that you have looked up which 1000w HPS/MH you are going to put on your Christmas list.
We've already talked about the colors they produce, but (as you know if you have shopped around) they also come in a bajillion different watts and set-ups. And yes, I've counted, and that is a scientific number... a bajillion combinations.
HPS
The Godfather of growing ganja. The tried and true way for most commercial growers (and a lot of smaller scale growers also) to light up their lives.
Pros:
Bigger buds
Can be purchased in many different watt sizes tailored for your size
Bigger buds
One light - You won't be fighting to get around your twenty CFLs
Better penetration than CFLs or Tubes
Last longer without losing efficiency
Easy to install and maintain
One light - You will be moving one light up and down and not twenty
Bigger buds
And finally - Bigger buds.
Notice a few of those are on there twice. I felt the need to point those out a little.
Cons:
Can be hotter than CFLs or tubes - (can be, CFLs are hot as hell also, and a well-cooled and vented HPS can actually run cooler in your tent than twenty open-air CFLs...)
Can be expensive - Compared to CFLs they are expensive, but some Tube fluoros can run you almost as much as a small HPS setup
Only one spectrum
Your pictures will look like ass
Hoods can be heavy (especially small built-in-ballast types)
Light only comes from one direction
Usually need to be placed farther away from plants (more stretching)
Bigger buds... oh wait, wrong list.
As you can see, HPS have a lot going for them, and that's why a lot of people use them. Proven, and easy to maintain, these are most growers go-to light for flowering.
MH
Pros:
See HPS
Slightly better resin production
Tighter nodes on plants (less stretch)
Bigger buds than CFLs
Cons:
See HPS
Slightly smaller buds than HPS
Pictures will look slightly less like ass
The difference between MH and HPS basically boils down to the difference in the 2700k and 6400k CFLs we were talking about earlier. They are both systems that will give you great penetration, and can be used throughout the grow process. In the simplest terms: MH are better for vegging but can still flower a plant, and HPS are better for flowering a plant but can still veg one. Both will produce great bud.
LED
Pros:
Arrays and wavelengths can be tailored to your specific grow, or however you want them set up
Pictures will look like the teleport room from Star Trek.
Cons:
New technology that people are still working out. Even a decade later, you are still basically a test monkey for the newest LED array.
I don't know much about LEDs, so I am going to leave this mainly blank.
---
Now that you know a little more about the lights (and by a little, I mean go do some damn research before you lay down $200+ on your grow light...) let's look at how much light you are going to need.
Ideally, you want to be looking to hit around 10,000 lumens in every area of your canopy. What is a lumen? A lumen is a measure of the amount of visible light that something produces. I am not going to get too deep into the Lumen vs Par topic, but if you want a little more info on that, a good read can be found here:
https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/lumens-are-for-people-par-is-for-plants-and-a-lot-of-other-lighting-spectrum-info.37783/
I don't want to steal his work and it's easier to copy and paste a link anyways. Do some clicking and reading
If you are growing with CFLs... buy as much as your heat will allow. Yes, CFLs get hot. I have 400w in my tent (300w for flower, 100w to get my clones going),and it gets hot. It's not the lights I can't afford at this point, it's the heat. At the point I am at, an HID would be much better for me. Take that into account when purchasing CFLs. They are cheap, and great to start with, but don't realistically expect to run a 1000w CFL tent.
Also, be careful when buying CFLs. Those "150w equiv" lights are really about 23watts. Look on the box for the lumen output of your CFLs. Most 23watt CFLs produce about 1600 lumens. Remember though, that 1600 lumens is only good for about 3"-4" max from the bulb. After that it drops, and it drops fast.
General rule of thumb... every 100w (true watts) of CFL produce between 6000-7000 lumens. Generally, you will need about 100w of CFL per square foot, unless you get creative in your layout.
-continued-
So you've read through this thread:
https://www.rollitup.org/t/nutrients-for-noobs-making-it-through-your-first-grow.850705/
You have your dirt and your go-go juice ready. You've got twenty-four 2-gallon grow bags, and you have your grandma's antique bed lamp hanging upside down in your closet... time to pop some beans. Right?
Slow down there...
(Disclaimer*- This is not meant to be a terribly in-depth or end-all-be-all post, but I hope it helps clear up some things for the grower with zero knowledge or experience at all in growing indoors. Do your research.)
First off, granny's lamp ain't gonna do the job. Those round lights you've seen for 55 years? Yeah those don't work. At all. No, seriously... put the 55-pack you got at Sam's Club down... turning your closet into Liberace's dressing room isn't going to grow anything.
To start off, let's narrow down your choices and then we can go from there into a little more detail. Your common choices you will be dealing with are:
CFL/Tubes
HPS
MH
LED
Pick one and make sure you love it, because your lighting is probably going to be your most expensive investment aside from maybe your tent.
Each light has different pros and cons to them... and literally, each one produces a different type of light.
The "color" (or wavelength, really) of light is measured in temperature, specifically Kelvins. The higher the K number, the more blue. The lower, the more red. Each color also has certain benefits to them.
Blues tend to promote more vegetative growth, promote shorter node length (less stretching), and help promote higher resin production.
Red light tends to be better for bud production.
Either can work the whole way through. Just ask the guys that flower with MHs, or the guys that veg with HPS. It will all work, and a lot of people will start with a blue MH or CFL/Tube for vegging and then move to a more red/yellow HPS for flower. It's all growers preference.
CFLs and Tubes can be purchased in either 2700k or 6400k temperatures (or close variations of those). HPS are usually in the 2300k range, and MH can range from 4000k-5500k depending on what you buy.
Remember, the lower the number, the more red... better for flower.
The higher the number, the more blue... better for veg.
So let's see what each one has to offer...
---
CFL/Tubes
Pros:
Dirt cheap (for CFLs, tubes can get expensive, fast)
Cheap and easy to replace
Can maneuver around your plants in ways other lights can't
You can mix your spectrums easily
Awesome for seedling/clones/vegging
Aaaaand, that's about it really. They are flimsy, a pain in the ass to get around, burn the shit out of you when your are trying to check trichomes... and yet that's still what I use. I'm cheap, what's your excuse?
Cons:
All of the above
Lower yields
Less lumens per watt than any other lighting available (more on that later)
Have to stay close to the plants
Can be almost as expensive as an HID (in the case of some of the higher-priced T5 fixtures/etc)
Lose efficiency after only a few months (no, just because your lights are shining, doesn't mean the light is the same as it was 6 months ago)
Can be as hot or hotter than well-cooled HIDs
Have almost zero light penetration (light isn't getting past the first two leaves, sorry)
There's others, believe me... the list is getting long enough.
But they do work, and they work well if you know how to use them. Notice in the Cons I didn't say anything about quality. I will put my CFL buds up against anyone else's buds any day. Just don't expect huge commercial yields out of them. I get a little less than a QP every six weeks out of my 400w of CFLs that I spent $40 on. That works for me. Others want a lot more. For those that do, there is the HID route, so let's look at those.
HIDs - High Intensity Discharge
So here's the money-makers for most people. If you are going for monster commercial crops, chances are that you have looked up which 1000w HPS/MH you are going to put on your Christmas list.
We've already talked about the colors they produce, but (as you know if you have shopped around) they also come in a bajillion different watts and set-ups. And yes, I've counted, and that is a scientific number... a bajillion combinations.
HPS
The Godfather of growing ganja. The tried and true way for most commercial growers (and a lot of smaller scale growers also) to light up their lives.
Pros:
Bigger buds
Can be purchased in many different watt sizes tailored for your size
Bigger buds
One light - You won't be fighting to get around your twenty CFLs
Better penetration than CFLs or Tubes
Last longer without losing efficiency
Easy to install and maintain
One light - You will be moving one light up and down and not twenty
Bigger buds
And finally - Bigger buds.
Notice a few of those are on there twice. I felt the need to point those out a little.
Cons:
Can be hotter than CFLs or tubes - (can be, CFLs are hot as hell also, and a well-cooled and vented HPS can actually run cooler in your tent than twenty open-air CFLs...)
Can be expensive - Compared to CFLs they are expensive, but some Tube fluoros can run you almost as much as a small HPS setup
Only one spectrum
Your pictures will look like ass
Hoods can be heavy (especially small built-in-ballast types)
Light only comes from one direction
Usually need to be placed farther away from plants (more stretching)
Bigger buds... oh wait, wrong list.
As you can see, HPS have a lot going for them, and that's why a lot of people use them. Proven, and easy to maintain, these are most growers go-to light for flowering.
MH
Pros:
See HPS
Slightly better resin production
Tighter nodes on plants (less stretch)
Bigger buds than CFLs
Cons:
See HPS
Slightly smaller buds than HPS
Pictures will look slightly less like ass
The difference between MH and HPS basically boils down to the difference in the 2700k and 6400k CFLs we were talking about earlier. They are both systems that will give you great penetration, and can be used throughout the grow process. In the simplest terms: MH are better for vegging but can still flower a plant, and HPS are better for flowering a plant but can still veg one. Both will produce great bud.
LED
Pros:
Arrays and wavelengths can be tailored to your specific grow, or however you want them set up
Pictures will look like the teleport room from Star Trek.
Cons:
New technology that people are still working out. Even a decade later, you are still basically a test monkey for the newest LED array.
I don't know much about LEDs, so I am going to leave this mainly blank.
---
Now that you know a little more about the lights (and by a little, I mean go do some damn research before you lay down $200+ on your grow light...) let's look at how much light you are going to need.
Ideally, you want to be looking to hit around 10,000 lumens in every area of your canopy. What is a lumen? A lumen is a measure of the amount of visible light that something produces. I am not going to get too deep into the Lumen vs Par topic, but if you want a little more info on that, a good read can be found here:
https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/lumens-are-for-people-par-is-for-plants-and-a-lot-of-other-lighting-spectrum-info.37783/
I don't want to steal his work and it's easier to copy and paste a link anyways. Do some clicking and reading
If you are growing with CFLs... buy as much as your heat will allow. Yes, CFLs get hot. I have 400w in my tent (300w for flower, 100w to get my clones going),and it gets hot. It's not the lights I can't afford at this point, it's the heat. At the point I am at, an HID would be much better for me. Take that into account when purchasing CFLs. They are cheap, and great to start with, but don't realistically expect to run a 1000w CFL tent.
Also, be careful when buying CFLs. Those "150w equiv" lights are really about 23watts. Look on the box for the lumen output of your CFLs. Most 23watt CFLs produce about 1600 lumens. Remember though, that 1600 lumens is only good for about 3"-4" max from the bulb. After that it drops, and it drops fast.
General rule of thumb... every 100w (true watts) of CFL produce between 6000-7000 lumens. Generally, you will need about 100w of CFL per square foot, unless you get creative in your layout.
-continued-
Last edited:
