Lockout?

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mtnman2016

Well-Known Member
I have 5 plants that have been looking fantastic for almost 3 months. They are 1 month into flower and I am seeing an issue in 2 of the 5. The 2 plants are at the back of the room and do not get the same airflow from the fan blowing on them which is the only difference I can think of. The 2 plants are starting to go a lime green with dead leaves near the bottom and leaves as seen in the picture in the middle.

All are in soil with Happy Frog amended with dolomite lime, blood meal and bone meal. I use 2ml/gal of biobizz grow, 8 ml/gal biobizz bloom and 2ml/gal mammoth p once a week, straight water 2 days later, then 10ml/gal sugaree 2 days later, repeat. I use tap water sitting out for 48 hours and do not alter the PH which is around 7.2 and lowers to 5.8 after Biobizz is added. The pots are 3 gallon smart pots.

I would have expected the dolomite lime to buffer the PH but now am not so sure about this. Plus the blood meal provides abundant N so I keep the biobizz grow low dose. Any higher I was seeing N burn.

Yesterday I used Alaska Fish Fert to add some Nitrogen believing this might be the issue but the yellowing is from the veins outwards which points me more to a lockout.

Any ideas to get this in check to finish out the last 4-5 weeks?

EDIT: Just checked the runoff and have 6.57 PH and 806 PPM on TDS. In addition, fungus gnats were noticed 1 week ago so put up fly strips and used captain jacks on leaves and top of soil. Plan to run some Hydrogen Peroxide next water but will wait until I see what you all think.
 

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hibok

Well-Known Member
are setting your ph of your solution to 6.5?
also you should check your ph run off now to check if your soil is buffered to 6.5
 
Thundercat

Thundercat

Well-Known Member
mtnman2016 said:
I have 5 plants that have been looking fantastic for almost 3 months. They are 1 month into flower and I am seeing an issue in 2 of the 5. The 2 plants are at the back of the room and do not get the same airflow from the fan blowing on them which is the only difference I can think of. The 2 plants are starting to go a lime green with dead leaves near the bottom and leaves as seen in the picture in the middle.

All are in soil with Happy Frog amended with dolomite lime, blood meal and bone meal. I use 2ml/gal of biobizz grow, 8 ml/gal biobizz bloom and 2ml/gal mammoth p once a week, straight water 2 days later, then 10ml/gal sugaree 2 days later, repeat. I use tap water sitting out for 48 hours and do not alter the PH which is around 7.2 and lowers to 5.8 after Biobizz is added. The pots are 3 gallon smart pots.

I would have expected the dolomite lime to buffer the PH but now am not so sure about this. Plus the blood meal provides abundant N so I keep the biobizz grow low dose. Any higher I was seeing N burn.

Yesterday I used Alaska Fish Fert to add some Nitrogen believing this might be the issue but the yellowing is from the veins outwards which points me more to a lockout.

Any ideas to get this in check to finish out the last 4-5 weeks?

EDIT: Just checked the runoff and have 6.57 PH and 806 PPM on TDS. In addition, fungus gnats were noticed 1 week ago so put up fly strips and used captain jacks on leaves and top of soil. Plan to run some Hydrogen Peroxide next water but will wait until I see what you all think.
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Well in my experience overwatering is one of the most common lockout causes after ph issues. Seems like your ph should be fine at 6.5, and 800ppm isn't super high.

What are your temps like? Low temps, especially in the root zone will reduce uptake and slow growth.

Are these clones or seed plants? Could the 2 acting up be slightly different phenos and they are asking for slightly different care? Some plants want more food then others. There are guys that regularly feed over 1000ppm without any issues because that's what the plants want.

Situations like this are what drove me to switch to hydro. I find it easier to narrow down issues and correct them quickly. Instead of guessing games because of so many variables.
 
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mtnman2016

Well-Known Member
The Temps are between 72 and 78.

I am at the conclusion this has to do with fungus gnats. I also feel watering every 2 days is contributing to this but in 3 gallon pots, 3 days is right on the edge of too long. Used to use 5 gallon pots and 4 days was perfect. Anyway, since they were at the back, 2 different strains and planted a a week apart I suspect the minimal air flow there made it easier for the gnats to to their thing.

I plan to hit them with 1 part of the 3% h2o2 to 4 water tonight, put out more fly strip along with cups of cider vinegar and soap. As soon as I can get some bulk steel wool I'll use that as well.

If there are any other ideas let me knwi else I will update this later for future reference.
 
M

mtnman2016

Well-Known Member
Thundercat said:
Well in my experience overwatering is one of the most common lockout causes after ph issues. Seems like your ph should be fine at 6.5, and 800ppm isn't super high.

What are your temps like? Low temps, especially in the root zone will reduce uptake and slow growth.

Are these clones or seed plants? Could the 2 acting up be slightly different phenos and they are asking for slightly different care? Some plants want more food then others. There are guys that regularly feed over 1000ppm without any issues because that's what the plants want.

Situations like this are what drove me to switch to hydro. I find it easier to narrow down issues and correct them quickly. Instead of guessing games because of so many variables.
Click to expand...
Thanks. I have considered for years trying hydro but got very good at soil. I just moved and this is the first grow in this new room. My next grow I will be doing a couple DWC to learn more in hydro.
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
mtnman2016 said:
That is awesome. Based on this I am suspecting a P toxicity. I am going to post a new thread with all my attempts and seek advice there.
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I'd say its N defeciency. I think your roots are being eaten by the gnats and your plant is using its lower leaves for energy to supply the tops.

Get some Sf-nematodes and water them in with your nutes. They are cheap and kill the pests in the soil.

Top your soil with DE for the top side fuckers.

Foliar feed till your plants roots recover.

You get fungus gnats from overwatering. The water just sits and drowns your roots. Gnats love that shit and moved in and ate your root tips I'm guessing. Wait till your soil is dry to water, not less wet. Stick your finger in all the way and if its dry then water. Otherwise its got plenty.
 
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mtnman2016

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
I'd say its N defeciency. I think your roots are being eaten by the gnats and your plant is using its lower leaves for energy to supply the tops.

Get some Sf-nematodes and water them in with your nutes. They are cheap and kill the pests in the soil.

Top your soil with DE for the top side fuckers.

Foliar feed till your plants roots recover.

You get fungus gnats from overwatering. The water just sits and drowning your roots. Gnats love that shit and moved in and ate your root tips I'm guessing. Wait till your soil is dry to water, not less wet. Stick your finger in all the way and if its dry then water. Otherwise its got plenty.
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Thanks Chief. The gnats are gone and I watered with h2o2 for the larvae but it is just getting worse. I posted a new thread since I am thinking P toxicity or maybe root bound now after more diagnosis. Also put potatoe slices in the soil and see nothing on them after 4 days.

Never heard of the Nematodes until a few days ago so will go that route if I see them again.
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
mtnman2016 said:
Thanks Chief. The gnats are gone and I watered with h2o2 for the larvae but it is just getting worse. I posted a new thread since I am thinking P toxicity or maybe root bound now after more diagnosis. Also put potatoe slices in the soil and see nothing on them after 4 days.

Never heard of the Nematodes until a few days ago so will go that route if I see them again.
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Sounds like your gnats are gone. Good work.

Because your symptoms started at the bottom and moved up I suspected N def from roots being eaten by gnats, but idk.
marijuana-deficiency-chart-jorge-cervantes.jpg

I think Fe def starts at the top but has that vein-al chlorosis that you're describing, possibly S def is like that too.
Iron-Graphic.jpg LEaf.jpg

According to the chart excess P doesn't block N or Fe but does fuck with S.
Screenshot_2019-02-08-04-58-47_2.png

Another common diagnosis chart..
KRuFnY4-1022x1024.jpg

I'd re-pot with more perlite and feed lightly but with fulvic acids till she started to come back, I'd pick all yellow or dead leaves off and increase time inbetween watering. But those are only ideas, good luck!
 
M

mtnman2016

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
Sounds like your gnats are gone. Good work.

Because your symptoms started at the bottom and moved up I suspected N def from roots being eaten by gnats, but idk.
View attachment 4279201

I think Fe def starts at the top but has that vein-al chlorosis that you're describing, possibly S def is like that too.
View attachment 4279208 View attachment 4279219

According to the chart excess P doesn't block N or Fe but does fuck with S.
View attachment 4279209

Another common diagnosis chart..
View attachment 4279203

I'd re-pot with more perlite and feed lightly but with fulvic acids till she started to come back, I'd pick all yellow or dead leaves off and increase time inbetween watering. But those are only ideas, good luck!
Click to expand...
Chief, can you take a look at my new post. It has good pics and everything I have tried so far. Re-pot sounds scary due to their size which you'll see in the new post

https://www.rollitup.org/t/cant-seem-to-figure-this-out.984339/
 
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