It's A Fuct World

Highhopes99

Active Member
Al,
thanks for the reponse. I was wondering what one should expect there roots to look like? Are your roots bright white all along the pipeline or does the Cana nutes stain them slightly brown/red? My res is kinda redish from the part b. Also wondering if you have made any gains in production? Still about an oz per plant? Pk13/14 still in your week 5 and 6 tray? I was thinking of changing my set up 12" square pots instead of 6 " round, then toping the rooted clones in order to shoot out two colas instead of one. With double the root space wouldn't the topped plant have the same production as two singles? This would be have legal advantages and also I would only have to cut 30 or so clones biweekly instead of 60. Thanks for your time al, I know it's limited!
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Hey al how many clones do you think i can do sog style under a 150w hps in hempy buckets? Without sacrificing yield of course. How about under a 250w?
Rethink the hempy buckets. The hempy design leaves roots submerged in water- I'm not a fan. Flood tray based systems are not much more complex and don't have this design fault.

A good rule of thumb for HPS is 50W/sq ft. You can do up to 4 plants per sq ft IF you diligently prune off all branching on the lower 1/3 of the plant and any that are more than 1" long, in typical SoG fashion. Prune off branching at end of wk2 & 4 or more if needed. I don't think I'd mess around with a 150W HPS. You can get OK results with a 250 but a 400 is much preferred for a small grow. Bud density is dependent on light intensity and a 400 has a lot more of it.

im droping the night feeding, was just hard for me to understand they could go that long without. and there in RW cubes
when these signs started i was on a basic GH feeding program and the burn apperence started my ppm was 1000
and it was sugested to try lucas, problem seemed to go away but as you see its still there im at 800ppms now.
il put up some new pics
The plants stop transpiring water when lights are off. If you water during lights off, water in the rootzone can stagnate (lose all dissolved O2) before the plant starts to shift it again at lights-on. Burned leaves are never going to repair, in case you're not aware of that, but if roots recover, the plant may begin growing again. It's pretty close to dead now and probably won't yield well. Doff the Lucas stuff, go back to GH instructions for flowering for your next batch.

i would not trust my city to provide me with the right amount of nutrients for my plants. if u use an RO system, u KNOW u have a baseline of zero(or very close), and can add however much nutes u NEED accordingly. if i were to add nutes to my regular tap water, wouldnt it have a ton of Ca and Mg in it?
What city are we talking about? Mexico City? US & CDN muni tapwater is universally of a high standard. I can't think of any exceptions.

Ca & Mg are essential micronutes and if they weren't there, you'd have to put them in.

basically what im saying is regular tap water isnt that reliable. u dont know exactly how much is in it. so adding more could cause problems
Not true at all, if we're talking about 1st world municipal water treatment systems. Conspiracy theories about water quality don't count. If you're curious about what's in your water, have it tested and know for sure.

View attachment 1375701View attachment 1375700View attachment 1375699
so they do look better but theres still this issue with the tips curling up
and the edges yellowing/browning?
OK, those pix look better. Any reason why you didn't post your latest pix in your last post? The tip curl and margin burn still suggests some NPK ratio problems.

Al,
thanks for the reponse. I was wondering what one should expect there roots to look like? Are your roots bright white all along the pipeline or does the Cana nutes stain them slightly brown/red? My res is kinda redish from the part b.
Roots should be bright white. Tan or brown roots are dead. There shouldn't be enough vegetable dye in Canna to stain roots. The Canna product I use in Aus has no label beyond 'Vega' and 'Flores' but I suspect the Nth American equivalent is Substra. The Aus version has some yellow dye in the red-capped Part B, but no red dye.

Also wondering if you have made any gains in production? Still about an oz per plant?
Thereabouts, yes.

Pk13/14 still in your week 5 and 6 tray?
Nope, haven't used PK in about a year or more.

I was thinking of changing my set up 12" square pots instead of 6 " round, then toping the rooted clones in order to shoot out two colas instead of one.
I wouldn't do that. The plant naturally produces largest & most dense colas on a single terminal. If you top the plant, it'll bush out and produce 2 smaller, less dense top colas. If you want more tops, grow more plants, up to 4/sq ft.

With double the root space wouldn't the topped plant have the same production as two singles? This would be have legal advantages and also I would only have to cut 30 or so clones biweekly instead of 60. Thanks for your time al, I know it's limited!
If your local cultivation laws make a big distinction between 30 & 60 plants, it may be a compromise you should investigate, but if the penalties are the same in either direction, I wouldn't do it.
 

The Waiter

Active Member
In regards to the question about the 150w and 250w hps do you think it would be feasible to do a sog setup where i use a 96w ho t5 for clones, 150w for first 2 weeks of flower, 250w for second 2 weeks and 400w for the last 4 weeks. What i wanna do is harvest 2 plants every 2 weeks. So there will always be 2 plants under each light besides the 400w which will have 4 plants under it at all times. Would it be smarter to just do the last 6 weeks under the 400w and always have 6 plants under the 400? Im asking cause i already have a 150w and im wondering if the 250w would even be necessary to purchase, or if it would be better to just invest in a 400w
 

Mike Young

Well-Known Member
Al b. I was hoping to get a little more info on feeding in the dark? Does that apply to aero as well? The system I run is all aero, and the roots don't come in contact w/standing water. I'd like to be able to cycle my pump 1/2 the time during flower???

Thanks!
 

Pross

Active Member
Sup Al I have a question about adding H202 to the reservoir. I'm using the Kangaroots and microbrew from Fox Farm. Wouldn't adding H202 kill everything in the reservoir? So all the Voodoo Juice and Kangaroots and like additives are not necessary to building a good root mass and plant? I don't have a ounce or milliliter of xp thats why I'm asking.
 

sparkafire

Well-Known Member
Hey Brother Al!!

Good to see you are still alive and growing.

I thought bleach and urine were made for Hydroponics they are both liquid right?

Good to have you back man!

Wanna be WEED BARON

Sparky
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
In regards to the question about the 150w and 250w hps do you think it would be feasible to do a sog setup where i use a 96w ho t5 for clones, 150w for first 2 weeks of flower, 250w for second 2 weeks and 400w for the last 4 weeks. What i wanna do is harvest 2 plants every 2 weeks. So there will always be 2 plants under each light besides the 400w which will have 4 plants under it at all times. Would it be smarter to just do the last 6 weeks under the 400w and always have 6 plants under the 400? Im asking cause i already have a 150w and im wondering if the 250w would even be necessary to purchase, or if it would be better to just invest in a 400w
HO fluoros are not really necessary for clones. Plain old shoplight fluoros will do fine. As regards the HPS for flowering, just go with a 400 from go to whoa. The 150HPS you already have would make a nice light for mother plants.

Al b. I was hoping to get a little more info on feeding in the dark? Does that apply to aero as well? The system I run is all aero, and the roots don't come in contact w/standing water. I'd like to be able to cycle my pump 1/2 the time during flower???
The plants are not transpiring any water during lights off. In an aero system, the roots are contained in a confined space so they generally won't dry out, but you can do a couple of 1 min sprays during lights-off to be sure. If your system config allows roots to grow down into a rez, the 1-min spritzes won't be needed, but an airstone in the res will be.

Sup Al I have a question about adding H202 to the reservoir. I'm using the Kangaroots and microbrew from Fox Farm. Wouldn't adding H202 kill everything in the reservoir? So all the Voodoo Juice and Kangaroots and like additives are not necessary to building a good root mass and plant? I don't have a ounce or milliliter of xp thats why I'm asking.
Don't use organic-based nutes in hydroponics. Problem solved.

G'day Al - what part of Straya are you from?

You under water yet?
I'm in NSW. No flooding here, but thanks for asking. If you're moved to do so, there's flood relief fund donation information here.
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Hey Brother Al!!

Good to see you are still alive and growing.
Hay sparky, good to see you too. :)

I thought bleach and urine were made for Hydroponics they are both liquid right?
Too right, but only use bleach & urine if also using liquid nitrogen.

Good to have you back man!
only for a couple of days, then I'm back to the old grind.

Wanna be WEED BARON
Dood, you ARE a w33d b4R0n! The w33di3st! xD

cheers!

Al.b
 

Grumpy Old Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Beautiful and sunny here in Brisbane - weird that hell is comming and it is such a nice day.

I don't know what would be worst, getting flooded without warning or knowing, waiting and watching everything go under.
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Beautiful and sunny here in Brisbane - weird that hell is coming and it is such a nice day.

I don't know what would be worst, getting flooded without warning or knowing, waiting and watching everything go under.
Getting hit with a several metre tall wall of water without warning would be a LOT worse. Ask the folks in Grantham.
 

gumball

Well-Known Member
darn, cant think of a question to ask! but i am subbed to read everyone elses : hope you get to stay around a while, no matter the frequency :D
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
darn, cant think of a question to ask! but i am subbed to read everyone elses : hope you get to stay around a while, no matter the frequency :D
Thanks.

However, I am reliably informed that the frequency is Kenneth. ;)

There are no folk in Grantham, not really sure that there is a Grantham anymore.

As you say ... it's a fuct world.
I think there will be a Grantham again. In fact, I'm really quite confident of it.
 

wannaquickee

Well-Known Member
Getting hit with a several metre tall wall of water without warning would be a LOT worse. Ask the folks in Grantham.

you really dont use cannazym or rhizotonic no pk 13/14?? just the A+B? boost?

i use

A+B, Cannazym, rhizotonic, pk 13/14..i dont use their boost..i replaced it with gh bloom 1-1-1 and botanicares sweet,calmag../shrugs seems to work well...
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
you really dont use cannazym or rhizotonic no pk 13/14?? just the A+B? boost?

i use

A+B, Cannazym, rhizotonic, pk 13/14..i dont use their boost..i replaced it with gh bloom 1-1-1 and botanicares sweet,calmag../shrugs seems to work well...
Yep, I use ONLY the Canna Vega & Flores A&B, H2O2 @ 1ml/L every 3-4 days and phosphoric acid based pH Down if I top the tanks with plain tapwater. However, I don't usually have to top up the tanks; my 125L tanks are fairly well matched to the water consumption of the plants. This is to say that the TDS/EC of the nute solns remains constant as the water level drops over the 14 days between tank dumps.

Enzymes are proteins. H2O2 breaks down enzymes on contact, so I have no use for Cannazym.

Rhizotonic is hugely expensive, stinks to high heaven and I never noted any difference with or without the stuff. If you don't overwater and apply H2O2 to nute solns regularly every 3-4 days, tanks and rootzones will be free of pathogens, so no remedies are needed for root problems.

I have had PK13-14 nute burn a lot of plants, even at the mfr's recommended dosage, so I put it aside about 12-18 mos ago and haven't used it since. I may give it a go sometime in the future as it's one of the few 'bloom booster' products that has a ghost of a chance of actually doing something, based in botanical science.

Most Botanicare products are either organic-based (which I have no use whatsoever for) or are silly rubbish that does nothing- and 'Sweet' is on the top of my 'does nothing' magic sauce list. It's a sugar solution; plants can't eat sugars and if you've ever inhaled burning sugar smoke, you'd wonder why anyone would put sugar (or worse, molasses) in a hydroponic nute soln which is feeding plants you're going to smoke.

Cal-Mag is largely unnecessary since most tapwater has enough Ca & Mg to suit the micronutrient needs of cannabis plants.

Around 95% of the stuff you find in a hydro shop is designed to make a profit for the shop whilst doing little or nothing for the grower. There's a lot of word-of-mouth 'advertising' for a lot of magic sauces- and not many of those words are coming from people who have a good understanding of botanical science nor have done actual side-by-side comparisons of with/without 'Brand X's' magic sauce.

When in doubt, leave it out.
 

don2009

Well-Known Member
Hey all what do you think of aeroponics? In a similar SOG set up im trying that what you think? I like the thoght of having the roots get that extra air for 15min on 15 min off Thanks man your threads is like a bible to me.
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Hey all what do you think of aeroponics? In a similar SOG set up im trying that what you think? I like the thoght of having the roots get that extra air for 15min on 15 min off
I love aeroponics- in theory. In practise, whenever you run a solution with a lot of dissolved salts/minerals through a small orifice, it's going to clog. Aeroponic systems normally require a lot of maintenance, specifically, cleaning sprayers. I have admitted since day 1 on this board that I'm a stoned slacker and I don't like to work very hard. I want to be able to ignore my op for several days at a time, if that's what mood I'm in. Flood aka Ebb & Flow systems allow me to do that if I feel like it.

Thanks man your threads is like a bible to me.
OMFSM! Bibles are full of violence and faerie tales! I avoid 'em, myself- but the compliment is well taken. ;)
 

Highhopes99

Active Member
Al, how long does it take to flood your tables? My 4' by 8' tables are taking about 7 min to fill 1/3 the way up the pots. And about 10 min to drain. Is this causing my root rot? Also if you could not get fytocell and had to go with a difrent media would you go back to rockwool flock? I can't seem to track down either of them locally , so I just buy the rockwool logs about 8" by 3' and cut em open and rip the rockwool up to stuff the pots with but that shits so itchy! Thx
 

Al B. Fuct

once had a dog named
Al, how long does it take to flood your tables? My 4' by 8' tables are taking about 7 min to fill 1/3 the way up the pots. And about 10 min to drain. Is this causing my root rot?
It might be. I have rather high capacity pumps in my system that only take about 3 mins to flood about 1/3 of the way up the pot, about 5-6mins to drain... but that's functionally not a lot different to your situation. Are you using H2O2? Aerating your rez with an air pump & stone?

Also if you could not get fytocell and had to go with a difrent media would you go back to rockwool flock?
I do use pots stuffed with only floc for my mother plants, since they get rather large and consume a lot of water. Floc holds more water than Fytocell- too much for flowering plants, which don't generally use as much water as ones aggressively vegging under 24/7 HPS light.
I can't seem to track down either of them locally , so I just buy the rockwool logs about 8" by 3' and cut em open and rip the rockwool up to stuff the pots with but that shits so itchy! Thx
I see what you mean. Use rubber gloves when breaking up the RW blocks- would probably be sensible to wear a dust mask when doing that job as well. Inhaling loose RW fibres doesn't sound like a particularly good idea. I'm rather surprised you're having trouble finding floc- it's fairly common stuff. On the other hand, it doesn't surprise me that you're unable to find Fytocell- a bit more esoteric & Australian made. You can always ask your local hydro shop to order in some bales of floc for you.
 
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