Is it possible for one pinch of epsom salts in a gallon of water to cause calcium lockout?

TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
Hi, quick noob question. Is it possible for a single pinch of epsom salts in a gallon of what I usually feed to cause lockout? I am wondering because I have 1 plant out of three genetically identical ones that started showing calcium deficiency only the week after I added a pinch (~1/4 tsp?) of epsom. I didn't do it again and it got better. Sometime later I figured it wasn't related and tried again, and the deficiency came back worse.

Why I think the epsom salts are unrelated is that it is only 2 feedings, and it is only 1 plant out of 3. I am feeding about 100ppm ca and 40 ppm mg before the pinch of epsom salts, and my water is usually between 140 and 180 ppm hardness.
 
TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
PadawanWarrior said:
A pinch of epsom salt isn't gonna cause a Ca definitely. I would suspect something else. And you know epsom salt is just Mg and S.
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Thanks, I added the epsom salts because my feed is really low in sulphur. I thought excess mg could cause a ca lockout because they are both +2 cations. I read that they should be in a 4:1 or 3:1 ratio, a pinch of epsom salts (1-2g) should be like 25-50ppm in a gallon so I didn't think it would be too far off the ideal ratio but wasn't sure if it would be enough to cause problems.
 
PadawanWarrior

PadawanWarrior

Well-Known Member
TrippleDip said:
Thanks, I added the epsom salts because my feed is really low in sulphur. I thought excess mg could cause a ca lockout because they are both +2 cations. I read that they should be in a 4:1 or 3:1 ratio, a pinch of epsom salts (1-2g) should be like 25-50ppm in a gallon so I didn't think it would be too far off the ideal ratio but wasn't sure if it would be enough to cause problems.
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I've heard some about the ratio, but I guess it's kinda a debated topic. Anyways, 1/4 tsp isn't much at all. Most of the things I've read said 1 Tbls for foliar and 2 Tbls for a soil drench. The foliar spray is more quickly available to the plants. I've done both.
 
Wangdoodler

Wangdoodler

Member
TrippleDip said:
Thanks, I added the epsom salts because my feed is really low in sulphur. I thought excess mg could cause a ca lockout because they are both +2 cations. I read that they should be in a 4:1 or 3:1 ratio, a pinch of epsom salts (1-2g) should be like 25-50ppm in a gallon so I didn't think it would be too far off the ideal ratio but wasn't sure if it would be enough to cause problems.
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Why do you think it’s a calcium deficiency. I have to assume the other genetically identical plants are getting the same identical nutes and are not suffering. Correct?
 
Renfro

Renfro

Well-Known Member
Honestly from looking at the image I don't think you have a calcium problem. It looks more like a potassium issue although not a classic presentation. What is your feed comprised of? What medium? pH? PPM?
 
TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
Renfro said:
Honestly from looking at the image I don't think you have a calcium problem. It looks more like a potassium issue although not a classic presentation. What is your feed comprised of? What medium? pH? PPM?
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I am running ph 6.0 in pro-mix hp. My feed is gh 3 part right now, but I was running my own calcium nitrate, micronutrient mix instead of the micro until I saw the problem but the numbers are the same. I don't know the ppms but it is the least I've ever fed plants because they are autos and smaller than usual. The other two genetically identical plants are fine.

I am feeding 80 ppm N, 55 ppm P, and 160 ppm K. I actually thought the soil ph was off so I checked it and it was 6.0 too.
 
TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
Wangdoodler said:
Why do you think it’s a calcium deficiency. I have to assume the other genetically identical plants are getting the same identical nutes and are not suffering. Correct?
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Yep. There is some very minor yellowing on the bottom fan leaves but I was thinking minor N def because I usually feed about 100 ppm of N in flower not 80.

Re lights, this is the shortest plant, and it happened from the bottom up.

Edit, I also usually feed around 130ppm of Ca instead of 90, this is why my mind went there first.
 
Renfro

Renfro

Well-Known Member
TrippleDip said:
I am running ph 6.0 in pro-mix hp. My feed is gh 3 part right now, but I was running my own calcium nitrate, micronutrient mix instead of the micro until I saw the problem but the numbers are the same. I don't know the ppms but it is the least I've ever fed plants because they are autos and smaller than usual. The other two genetically identical plants are fine.

I am feeding 80 ppm N, 55 ppm P, and 160 ppm K. I actually thought the soil ph was off so I checked it and it was 6.0 too.
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Whats the total PPM? Sounds like you have a weak feed perhaps? I would want to be around 1000 PPM (EC 2.0) I would get the soil pH up to 6.5, lower than 6.3 and I see issues with magnesium uptake.
 
TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
Renfro said:
Whats the total PPM? Sounds like you have a weak feed perhaps? I would want to be around 1000 PPM (EC 2.0) I would get the soil pH up to 6.5, lower than 6.3 and I see issues with magnesium uptake.
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700, which is less than I thought (assuming the meter is still calibrated) 1.5 EC. I will increase everything. Thanks for your help.


Wangdoodler said:
How many weeks are left
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I figure about two on that plant. The only one showing deficiencies is two weeks ahead of the others for whatever reason.
 
TrippleDip

TrippleDip

Well-Known Member
xtsho said:
It can but it's going to take more than a pinch.

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Interesting that both Ca and Mg are antagonistic to K. I am assuming @Renfro that the reason you believe that it's uncharacteristic K def is the large amounts of intervenal yellowing? There are also some burnt tips all twisted upwards too.
 
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