Is Gay Marriage Really That Big Deal?

What I do not agree with is them ramming their lifestyle down the throats of others. I personally find Gays affable and amusing in general, but I am also respectful of those that don't. If the term "marriage" is redefined, that is what will necessarily follow.

The one thing I will never support is the adoption of children. The APA is an ultra left organization and I remember when they insisted that divorce was not harmful to children. Now we have studies to show what rubbish this was. In fact, recently a massive Government sponsored study was released that showed that children from traditional households scored significantly higher in all areas of mental and social health than did children from all other backgrounds. I think the fact that boys especially, need fathers is a no brainer.

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"ramming their lifestyle down the throats of others" - I'd like you to define what you mean with that statement. Do you feel as if our dominantly heterosexual society rams our lifestyle down the throats of homosexuals? Think about how many times a day you witness one form of heterosexual sexual encounter or another... now think about how many times a day you witness the same thing happen between homosexual people. Quite the big gap in ratios there wouldn't you agree? You think your justified in saying that the homosexual rights movement is to ram their lifestyle down our throats? Where is your evidence of this?

"a massive government sponsored study"?? wtf? Give me the link so I can check it for myself.

The truth is, there is not enough information available to say whether or not raising a child in a homosexual household will do anything to that childs development, but to be honest, even if it was, your sitting there saying you have the right to tell another human being how to raise their own adopted child (which they most likely love, otherwise why would they have actively went and adopted it?). Hopefully you realize how insane that is. What if I felt like your kids performance was reflecting your parenting skills and I thought little Timmy wasn't doing such a great job in school? By your own logic, I should be allowed to remove that kid from your household because I think you lack what society has deemed necessary parenting skills...

There are plenty of men today who grew up perfectly fine without a father. Again, using your own logic, we should remove all male children from the care of their single mother, simply because the household lacks the father...

That shit is retarded Rick... The state should not have the authority to tell me, based on something as trivial and shallow as my sexuality, what I may or may not be able to do in a "free" society.

doobnVA said:

I didn't change the subject, perhaps you lost a contact lens and can't see clearly?

Either way, your argument is invalid.

Good day.

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Invalid. LOL!

If you can't prove it, just state it anyway. That'll learn me.

CrackerJax said:

To the right only means they understand that destroying the business sector ruins everything for all. That's a good thing.
We could use a serious swing to the right here in the USA, unless you don't value the standard of living.

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A bit more to it than that but I do agree that governments do need some right wing ideals, just not to much. Same can be said for the left, thats why we can have a middle ground, just seems no-one has the balance right. Cant' comment on your standard of living in the US i'm afraid, i'm from little ol' England.

PadawanBater said:

"ramming their lifestyle down the throats of others" - I'd like you to define what you mean with that statement. Do you feel as if our dominantly heterosexual society rams our lifestyle down the throats of homosexuals? Think about how many times a day you witness one form of heterosexual sexual encounter or another... now think about how many times a day you witness the same thing happen between homosexual people. Quite the big gap in ratios there wouldn't you agree? You think your justified in saying that the homosexual rights movement is to ram their lifestyle down our throats? Where is your evidence of this?

"a massive government sponsored study"?? wtf? Give me the link so I can check it for myself.

The truth is, there is not enough information available to say whether or not raising a child in a homosexual household will do anything to that childs development, but to be honest, even if it was, your sitting there saying you have the right to tell another human being how to raise their own adopted child (which they most likely love, otherwise why would they have actively went and adopted it?). Hopefully you realize how insane that is. What if I felt like your kids performance was reflecting your parenting skills and I thought little Timmy wasn't doing such a great job in school? By your own logic, I should be allowed to remove that kid from your household because I think you lack what society has deemed necessary parenting skills...

There are plenty of men today who grew up perfectly fine without a father. Again, using your own logic, we should remove all male children from the care of their single mother, simply because the household lacks the father...

That shit is retarded Rick... The state should not have the authority to tell me, based on something as trivial and shallow as my sexuality, what I may or may not be able to do in a "free" society.

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You answered your own question; unless you're unaware that in homes where a father is absent the kids are more likely to use drugs, and not finish school? I have sources if you'd like them, but It seems like the gay community cares more about what they want (what hetro's have) than the children who will end up damaged... there are consequences to your care-free lifestyle, that shouldn't be passed on to a helpless child. You have the choice... a child doesn't.

And children are smarter than you give them credit for. Ask them if they'd like 2 daddy's instead of a mother.

PadawanBater said:

"ramming their lifestyle down the throats of others" - I'd like you to define what you mean with that statement. Do you feel as if our dominantly heterosexual society rams our lifestyle down the throats of homosexuals? Think about how many times a day you witness one form of heterosexual sexual encounter or another... now think about how many times a day you witness the same thing happen between homosexual people. Quite the big gap in ratios there wouldn't you agree? You think your justified in saying that the homosexual rights movement is to ram their lifestyle down our throats? Where is your evidence of this?

"a massive government sponsored study"?? wtf? Give me the link so I can check it for myself.

The truth is, there is not enough information available to say whether or not raising a child in a homosexual household will do anything to that childs development, but to be honest, even if it was, your sitting there saying you have the right to tell another human being how to raise their own adopted child (which they most likely love, otherwise why would they have actively went and adopted it?). Hopefully you realize how insane that is. What if I felt like your kids performance was reflecting your parenting skills and I thought little Timmy wasn't doing such a great job in school? By your own logic, I should be allowed to remove that kid from your household because I think you lack what society has deemed necessary parenting skills...

There are plenty of men today who grew up perfectly fine without a father. Again, using your own logic, we should remove all male children from the care of their single mother, simply because the household lacks the father...

That shit is retarded Rick... The state should not have the authority to tell me, based on something as trivial and shallow as my sexuality, what I may or may not be able to do in a "free" society.

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Evidence that Gays want to ram their lifestyle down the throats of others is evident in their desire to redefine marriage.

If I am wrong, why will they not be happy having civil unions that give them the same exact rights?

If the rights are the same, what is the difference? There is only one answer to this question. The answer is that simply having the same rights is not enough and not all they want. What they want is to manipulate how others PERCEIVE them.

Another way their lifestyle would be rammed down the throats of others is through the legal system which, by way of lawsuits, would force schools to treat the gay lifestyle as normal and mainstream. The result, will be that children will be indoctrinated and such indoctrination will be mandated by law. If you can't see this happening, you probably aren't familiar with our legal system.

As far as adoption is concerned; nobody has a RIGHT to adopt a child. Adoptions may be granted to people that the adopting agency deems fit. However, once again, once we make Gays a protected class, they will be in a unique position to sue for discrimination if the adopting agency denies the adoption. This is why the Catholic Church is no longer in the adoption business in states with gay marriage. This has already happened.

I state again that I think Gays should have the same rights as everyone else. I just think that redefining marriage and giving them special protected status will open up a Pandora's box that you really don't want to see opened.

I know this argument is a bit complex but it really is quite logical if you focus on what I am saying.

As far as the meta-study, I'm looking for it. If you search the website of the Heritage Foundation they have all kinds of data about domestic violence in gay relationships and what not. Very interesting stuff.

I hope this helps clarify things. I wouldn't want you to think "this shit is retarded."

PadawanBater said:

"ramming their lifestyle down the throats of others" - I'd like you to define what you mean with that statement. Do you feel as if our dominantly heterosexual society rams our lifestyle down the throats of homosexuals? Think about how many times a day you witness one form of heterosexual sexual encounter or another... now think about how many times a day you witness the same thing happen between homosexual people. Quite the big gap in ratios there wouldn't you agree? You think your justified in saying that the homosexual rights movement is to ram their lifestyle down our throats? Where is your evidence of this?

"a massive government sponsored study"?? wtf? Give me the link so I can check it for myself.

The truth is, there is not enough information available to say whether or not raising a child in a homosexual household will do anything to that childs development, but to be honest, even if it was, your sitting there saying you have the right to tell another human being how to raise their own adopted child (which they most likely love, otherwise why would they have actively went and adopted it?). Hopefully you realize how insane that is. What if I felt like your kids performance was reflecting your parenting skills and I thought little Timmy wasn't doing such a great job in school? By your own logic, I should be allowed to remove that kid from your household because I think you lack what society has deemed necessary parenting skills...

There are plenty of men today who grew up perfectly fine without a father. Again, using your own logic, we should remove all male children from the care of their single mother, simply because the household lacks the father...

That shit is retarded Rick... The state should not have the authority to tell me, based on something as trivial and shallow as my sexuality, what I may or may not be able to do in a "free" society.

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I'd quit engaging him if I were you. He only argues for the sake of arguing. See how he claims he's not against gays having the same rights as straight people, yet goes off on a tangent about how they shouldn't be allowed to get married or adopt children? I don't see how that's advocating equal rights. In fact, it seems to be pretty contradictory to his supposed "belief" that they should have the same rights.

At any rate, adoption isn't the only way that gay couples can have children. Should they also be disallowed the right to seek a surrogate, or IVF in the case of lesbians? I'll bet Rick thinks they should.

Hmm.. so his source is the Heritage Foundation, a self-proclaimed "conservative thinktank". Yeah, no bias there...

"civil unions" are the modern day equivalent of "colored" restrooms, water fountains, etc.

In short, it is advocating a return to the days of "separate but equal". Think about the pandora's box THAT would open.

A normal child would say they want a mother and father, a child in an orphanage might have a different opinion, however, and might not care whether the parents are mother father, mother mother, or father father... It REALLY depends on the circumstances. A child with an affectionate mother and an abusive father might want to mother's for parents, or just a single mother, and vise versa.... Me personally, if gays wanna be married, who are we to pass judgement on how they wanna live? Who are we to dictate their lives for them?.. I personally find homosexuality to be unnatural, and I'm disgusted anytime I see affection between two gay partners, but I'm not in any position to dictate to them how they want to live, even if I disagree, just as they aren't in a position to tell me how to live my life if I smoke weed, and they disagree.

Smoker Toker

Lets call it narriage.

We all know that hetero marriage is the way to go, because there are no child abuse cases in the USA.

natrone23 said:

Lets call it narriage.

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Or garriage.

CrackerJax said:

We all know that hetero marriage is the way to go, because there are no child abuse cases in the USA.

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Probably the smartest thing I've ever seen CJ type.

If two lesbians adopt a boy, which one can teach him what it means to be a man? Who will the boy emulate? Where will he get his identity as a man?

RickWhite said:

If two lesbians adopt a boy, which one can teach him what it means to be a man? Who will the boy emulate? Where will he get his identity as a man?

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Then you can pose the same questions to a single mother.

I think most would agree that growing up with a mother and father is probably the best way, probably. But consider the child in a care home, no mother figure, no father figure, not bought up in the enviroment of a loving family. Would you say that they should stay in the care system or be bought up by loving guardians, regardless of sexual orientation, single or not.

Calif governor signs gay marriage recognition bill
................... http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h1SFF5gEOYylAKKeVF9oyFEh-UQQD9B9QV0G1 ..................

You're assuming that lesbians have no fathers, brothers, or male friends who can serve as a role model for their child.

this is an awfully big assumption.

A child needs a male role model, not necessarily a "father".

I have no idea why this is a big deal, only positives can come from it. Lets all compromise, marriage was created by the church and because the church says same sex marriages shouldn't happen lets use a different word. I'm all for allowing civil unions with the same benefits as a married couple can enjoy. This way you wont piss off the religious nuts AND can appease the homo rights groups.

Marriage actually predates the church.... just as a FYI.

Marriage was all about passing down land estates. Business was always first...love was secondary.

Calif governor signs gay marriage recognition bill
................... http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...h-UQQD9B9QV0G1 ..................