ballin jack
Well-Known Member
Also, it's for medicinal purposes, so I was trying to do a process that kept as many cannabinoids and terpenes as possible. Obviously, I have not read much about all the other methods...
How many mg of THC can be dissolved in 1 ml of ethanol?
- Thread starter ballin jack
- Start date
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
One gram of concentrate will dissolve in a very small amount of everclear. I haven't measured the ml I use since I just use the alcohol as a carrier, but when I make candy I dissolve a gram usually some times 1.5g in just a splash of alcohol and add it to the hot candy. The alcohol evaps off and the oil is left in the candy.I was hoping it would be easier to figure out than this lol. I was going to take all the variables into account by finding the "theoretical" extraction rate in perfect conditions. i.e. 190 proof, i guess absorbing pure THC. Then I was just going to assume I'll reach about 60-70% of that number because of all my factors - Using whole bud instead of just trichomes, using 151 instead of 190 proof, etc.
The way I was thinking about was akin to, "How much salt can be dissolved in 1 cup of water." Should be a pretty easy number to get, right? But I can't even find anything saying like, "in 190 proof ethanol, at 70 degrees F, with pure THC concentrate, xxxx mg of THC can be absorbed per 1ml of ethanol. So I don't even have a starting point.
Sounds like the only way to get a reliable number, from what everyone is saying, is to start with a concentrate, where I know the exact amount of THC I have. Then dissolve that in alcohol. But then it kind of gets me back to the same question. Say I have 1 gram of concentrate - how much ethanol will I need to be able to dissolve all of that? Or is the number so tiny, that the amount of alcohol it takes to cover the concentrate is more than enough to dissolve all of it?
I fully plan on just buying tinctures at the dispensaries when they are available, but I live in Ohio and the processing plants haven't opened yet. So we're looking at a good 6 months before anything but bud is available. I can't wait to not have to think about this haha.
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
Woot Fade with the science like usual!
ballin jack
Well-Known Member
Awesome, thank you everyone. Now I'll read up on better methods of making tinctures 
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
Do you have a concentrate you can start with or only flower material?
If you have a concentrate literally all you have to do is add the alcohol and stir or shake it till it dissolves. Sometimes I will put it in a hot water bath so the alcohol is warm which helps.
If you have a concentrate literally all you have to do is add the alcohol and stir or shake it till it dissolves. Sometimes I will put it in a hot water bath so the alcohol is warm which helps.
Fadedawg
Well-Known Member
There is a difference between soluble in and extracted with. As the solvent absorb more solute, it becomes less of a solvent.
Fadedawg
Well-Known Member
You can mix alcohol and concentrate at any ratio.
ballin jack
Well-Known Member
I could get some concentrate. For this though, I ground up 8g of flower, decarbed it at 200 degreesF for about 40 minutes, then put it in a mason jar and poured enough 151 to cover the bud, then put it in the freezer. Shook for a minute every day for a week. Then strained out the bud through a cheese cloth. I guess I made Green Dragon. I got about 100 ml of liquid after straining. Then I cut that 1:1 volume-wise with CBD oil, to make it more palatable and add in some CBD.
Not an exact science at all, lol. It's tolerable, but I have no idea if that was a good method or not. I took 1/4 ml under the tongue, and felt the faint beginnings of a shitty, tired high. I used to smoke a lot, but now I'm looking to just get medicinal benefits from it, without the high.
@Fadedawg there's the specifics, if you still care to look at them.
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
Tetrahydrocannabinol, and high-test concentrates, are miscible in 95% alcohol. "Miscible" means that they will mix in any ratio at all.
I am not sure how much water the mix will tolerate. I suspect that at around 80% alcohol (and below), phase-separation problems will rear their head.
Yes, he needs Everclear 95% or do an Iso 91%. So how does he rescue this?
cannabineer
Ursus marijanus
By filtering, drying, and back-extracting the botanical material with real-deal Everclear. Otherwise there will be an unknown amount of loss. In my patchy anecdotal experience, the solubility cliff is a steep one in alcohol/water mixtures.
Fadedawg
Well-Known Member
There are a couple of issues at play here. Alcohol and water are both polar, so extract the polar molecules like C-55 Chlorophyll, which is where the green appearance and greeeeeeeeeeen flavor of Green Dragon comes from.
I personally prefer Brown Dragon, which is produced using QWET techniques to avoid the Chlorophyll. You can use as is, remove some of the alcohol to make a stronger tincture, or remove all the alcohol to make a concentrate.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150707173953/http://skunkpharmresearch.com/qwet-extraction/
Note I use a 3 minute soak for QWET, but if you drop dry ice in the ethanol and take it down under -50C, you can soak and agitate it for 30 minutes or longer.
You can place Green Dragon in strong sunlight (UV) and it will deprotonate the Chlorophyll molecule by removing its magnesium ion, and turning it into Pheophytin, which is brown and non polar. Purdier to gaze upon, but all them poor dead Chlorophyll carcasses are still there.
You can remove some of the Chlorophyll by mixing your Green Dragon with equal parts Pentane (C-5) and brine (33:33:33%), shake in a separatory funnel, and allowing to stratify. The non polar elements (good shit) will go to the Pentane floating on top, while the salt water and alcohol mixture will sink to the bottom with "junk", where it can be bled off. Add more brine, shake, and repeat until the brine comes out clear.
You can filter out more chlorophyll using activated charcoal, but at the loss of some of the cannabinoids.
Distill or evaporate off the C-5 Pentane, and you will have what's left. https://web.archive.org/web/20150709064812/http://skunkpharmresearch.com/getting-the-green-and-waxes-out-afterwards
The same technique will work with Hexane and Heptane, but our livers turn Hexane into 2.5 Hexane Dione, a carcinogen, and Heptane is harder to purge due to its C-7 molecule size and high boiling point (98.42C/209.2F). Less of an issue if you have vacuum purging capabilities to drop the boiling point.
You can even redissolve the Heptane extract in Ethanol, and when you remove the Ethanol, it will take most of the remaining Heptane with it.
Moving up, short path fractional distillation will of course clean it up green extract, if you have the budget for it.
For most of us'n poor folk, it is easier and more cost effective to start with a pristine extract that doesn't require salvage.
I personally prefer Brown Dragon, which is produced using QWET techniques to avoid the Chlorophyll. You can use as is, remove some of the alcohol to make a stronger tincture, or remove all the alcohol to make a concentrate.
https://web.archive.org/web/20150707173953/http://skunkpharmresearch.com/qwet-extraction/
Note I use a 3 minute soak for QWET, but if you drop dry ice in the ethanol and take it down under -50C, you can soak and agitate it for 30 minutes or longer.
You can place Green Dragon in strong sunlight (UV) and it will deprotonate the Chlorophyll molecule by removing its magnesium ion, and turning it into Pheophytin, which is brown and non polar. Purdier to gaze upon, but all them poor dead Chlorophyll carcasses are still there.
You can remove some of the Chlorophyll by mixing your Green Dragon with equal parts Pentane (C-5) and brine (33:33:33%), shake in a separatory funnel, and allowing to stratify. The non polar elements (good shit) will go to the Pentane floating on top, while the salt water and alcohol mixture will sink to the bottom with "junk", where it can be bled off. Add more brine, shake, and repeat until the brine comes out clear.
You can filter out more chlorophyll using activated charcoal, but at the loss of some of the cannabinoids.
Distill or evaporate off the C-5 Pentane, and you will have what's left. https://web.archive.org/web/20150709064812/http://skunkpharmresearch.com/getting-the-green-and-waxes-out-afterwards
The same technique will work with Hexane and Heptane, but our livers turn Hexane into 2.5 Hexane Dione, a carcinogen, and Heptane is harder to purge due to its C-7 molecule size and high boiling point (98.42C/209.2F). Less of an issue if you have vacuum purging capabilities to drop the boiling point.
You can even redissolve the Heptane extract in Ethanol, and when you remove the Ethanol, it will take most of the remaining Heptane with it.
Moving up, short path fractional distillation will of course clean it up green extract, if you have the budget for it.
For most of us'n poor folk, it is easier and more cost effective to start with a pristine extract that doesn't require salvage.