How can i induce stretch?

Doing a 4 plant 5x5 dwc scrog, bruce banner #3. Height is a limitation so i really wanted to get branching started early to spread the plants as low as possible. Maybe over did it. Started with lots of light to get them bushy and topped at 5 nodes. Pulled main stalk over to get 10 tops coming up. Also pulling the 10 tops outward from eachother. Problem is it just wants to keep stacking nodes tight and be an over crowded bush. Ive been removing all growth tips from the 10 branches to try and direct energy into the tips. Growth is happening fast, but mostly just dense overlapping leaves. I need to get the footprint to widen so i can increase leaf area without so much overlapping, then growth can really take off. Started off with metal halide pretty close, last few days i thought i might try switching to hps and raising light to get some stretch, but it hasnt made much difference. Here 2 pics 3 days apart. First pic was right after cleaning out middle of plant and pulling everything outward. Second pic is 3 days later. Didnt seem to spread much, just more explosive overlapping growth that needs trimmed out. Making progress, but wondering what else i can do to induce a bit of stretch and help the plant gain some area. In the future im thinking maybe start with only like 4 tops, let it spread a bit, then top them all again later, or just supercrop the 4 branches. Seems that 10 branches in a small plant is just too much too early.

I've never heard anyone wanting their plants to stretch, but give them less light.

Stretch is internode length, not branch count/length.

Just pinch the top off when you don't want more nodes on the main stem, then it will kinda be stunted and quit growing nodes on the main stem...Then the side branches will catch up over time. Actually, the highest side branch will try to become the new top.

If you accidentally fim it, it will still be stunted and grow at the rate of the side branches that you are wanting.

PizzaMan5000 said:

Stretch is internode length, not branch count/length.

Just pinch the top off when you don't want more nodes on the main stem, then it will kinda be stunted and quit growing nodes on the main stem...Then the side branches will catch up over time. Actually, the highest side branch will try to become the new top.

If you accidentally fim it, it will still be stunted and grow at the rate of the side branches that you are wanting.

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Yes, i understand. When i say stretch, i mean stretch. No it does not mean branch count, yes it does mean branch length. If a plant stretches, the length of the branches increase, which is what i want. I absolutely don't want more branches. I have already topped after 5 nodes to make 10 tops and i want them to stretch, as in start growing with more distance between nodes. Currently it is still stacking nodes closely and overcrowding. I want it to stretch so the existing 10 main growth tips reach out. Ive never had this issue before and i fully realize that 99% of the time, we are making an effort to get nodes closer. In this case its too much and the plant is too bushy to make progress. Its just making dense overlapping foliage and not increasing in size very quickly

Stretch is good if you need to fill a 4x4 with 1 plant early on.

DWCgrower406 said:

Yes, i understand. When i say stretch, i mean stretch. No it does not mean branch count, yes it does mean branch length. If a plant stretches, the length of the branches increase, which is what i want. I absolutely don't want more branches. I have already topped after 5 nodes to make 10 tops and i want them to stretch, as in start growing with more distance between nodes. Currently it is still stacking nodes closely and overcrowding. I want it to stretch so the existing 10 main growth tips reach out. Ive never had this issue before and i fully realize that 99% of the time, we are making an effort to get nodes closer. In this case its too much and the plant is too bushy to make progress. Its just making dense overlapping foliage and not increasing in size very quickly

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so you want tall stretchy plants that yield less?
makes sence

Raise or dim your lights....cooler lights off temps promote some stretch as well.
Hths
FF

Reduce nutrients slightly and increase light distance.

feeding lighter N helps to increase internodal distance.

increasing light distance or intensity increase internodal distance.

Ok, sounds good. Thanks guys. I think im a tad heavy on the nitrogen anyway, looking a bit dark green. Ill raise lights and cut back on nutes a bit. This is just a temporary thing that i want. Once i can get some distance between the 10 tops so they have room to grow, ill smack the light back down and get it back to nice tight nodes for a while before flowering.

I'd just let it grow. It keeps stacking leaves cause you keep chopping them off. The plant is trying to increase the surface area.

I jam a net on top of the plants when they are 5" tall and spread it all out.

Let it grow and once it is big and bushy then you can start to trim and decide which branches to keep and which need to go.

If you have that hps in there during the pre flower stretch the node spacing will get huge.

Failmore said:

I'd just let it grow. It keeps stacking leaves cause you keep chopping them off. The plant is trying to increase the surface area.

I jam a net on top of the plants when they are 5" tall and spread it all out.

Let it grow and once it is big and bushy then you can start to trim and decide which branches to keep and which need to go.

If you have that hps in there during the pre flower stretch the node spacing will get huge.

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The reason for trimming the undergrowth is to direct energy to the tips. Is the shaded foliage not just wasted energy that is preventing air flow? On the last pruning i did, i carefully removed just lower growth tips that were branching off of the 10 main branches and left all the leaves. There is a ton of shaded foliage, but i guess ill just leave it and let it go. I guess one advantage of not rushing it is that im growing the root system and beefing up stems this whole time. The plant in the pic is not much larger than a square foot and maybe 8 inches tall, but the main stalk is already a half inch at least. Root system also getting pretty impressive for such a small plant. Ill just let it go and be patient. Im just not used to a plant structure like this. Back in the day when i did this i always had the opposite problem. Probably from not giving them enough light in veg.

DWCgrower406 said:

The reason for trimming the undergrowth is to direct energy to the tips. Is the shaded foliage not just wasted energy that is preventing air flow? On the last pruning i did, i carefully removed just lower growth tips that were branching off of the 10 main branches and left all the leaves. There is a ton of shaded foliage, but i guess ill just leave it and let it go. I guess one advantage of not rushing it is that im growing the root system and beefing up stems this whole time. The plant in the pic is not much larger than a square foot and maybe 8 inches tall, but the main stalk is already a half inch at least. Root system also getting pretty impressive for such a small plant. Ill just let it go and be patient. Im just not used to a plant structure like this. Back in the day when i did this i always had the opposite problem. Probably from not giving them enough light in veg.

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Trimming and directing energy is more for flower than veg. And I do agree with trimming to promote bud development.

But during veg I think it is best to just let the plant go. The more surface area the faster they grow. The faster it grows the faster you fill the entire space.

Even shaded leaves are photosynthesizing. You want the plant to stretch? Flip it to flower. Nothing wrong with short plants in veg.

twentyeight.threefive said:

Even shaded leaves are photosynthesizing. You want the plant to stretch? Flip it to flower. Nothing wrong with short plants in veg.

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I dont think im nearly there yet though. Im aiming to fill 2.5 foot square with each plant. If you had to guess, judging by the pic (currently about a foot square), how much canopy area do you think this plant could fill if switching to flower now? Its bruce banner #3, roughly 9 week flower, growing in dwc. I know thats hugely dependent on my grow, but lets say i nail the conditions pretty well, optimal temp, humidity, light, airflow.

Failmore said:

Trimming and directing energy is more for flower than veg. And I do agree with trimming to promote bud development.

But during veg I think it is best to just let the plant go. The more surface area the faster they grow. The faster it grows the faster you fill the entire space.

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Heres an example of pretty extreme defoliating in veg and this guy built the perfect monster. Pretty much exactly what i did to mine, but he waited much longer. Probably removed 80% of his foliage, opened up the center of the plant and directed energy to tops by eliminating lower growth. This was done at least a couple weeks before flipping to flower.

You will need to top her at least twice...

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To encourage upward growth clean the leaves and sucker branches out of the bottom of the plant - lollipop.

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Hobbes said:

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To encourage upward growth clean the leaves and sucker branches out of the bottom of the plant - lollipop.

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Thats been my strategy so far, but others are telling me the opposite and to not defoliate until flower. I guess thats the internet for you lol. Makes the most sense to me to remove undergrowth to concentrate energy at tops. Im gonna take a slightly different approach and take out just lower growth tips and leave most of the leaves even if they are shaded. The growth tips underneath are doing most of the energy sucking.