• Here is a link to the full explanation: https://rollitup.org/t/welcome-back-did-you-try-turning-it-off-and-on-again.1104810/

HELP!!!!!! Can anybody tell me if this system is worth me buying??



Hey world this is my first post, first grow, first everything............. Lol i kno i'm going to need alot of help from you guys but first things first can somebody tell me if this system is good or should i keep looking , i was thinkin bout buying the bigger daddy system today heres the link www.bigdaddyshydro.com any feedback is good feedback thanks and keep on smoking
http://www.bigdaddyshydro.com:bigjoint:
 

CLOSETGROWTH

Well-Known Member
Hey world this is my first post, first grow, first everything............. Lol i kno i'm going to need alot of help from you guys but first things first can somebody tell me if this system is good or should i keep looking , i was thinkin bout buying the bigger daddy system today heres the link www.bigdaddyshydro.com any feedback is good feedback thanks and keep on smoking
http://www.bigdaddyshydro.com:bigjoint:
If ya got the cash to put out, then what the heck ya know... Its all there, and complete. :mrgreen:

But, if you wanna build it yourself, and can find the plans..save some money and start researching.
 

justparanoid

Well-Known Member
I didn't account for its a complete 12 bucket system, they are not as over priced as i thought. I wonder what shipping a 55 gallon drum costs tho??
 

justparanoid

Well-Known Member
even better no shipping charges. If you have the money to spend on it, it looks like a complete system to me. I would be interested to see it all setup and running.
 

RyanTheRhino

Well-Known Member
Well stay tuned paranoid i need all the help i can get with this

well in my opinion that type of hydroponics is very complicated. i mean they all work the same but those have somany more parts, tubes, ect...

what u have there is a capped ebb&flow

do they have a reg ebb&flow or a drip system. tey are a little easier on new guys


and are u going to be placing ikt outside or under HID grow lights


go her to see

how reg ebb and flow works

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMvoXRDCeC8
 

Attachments

morrisgreenberg

Well-Known Member
CAP Ebb and Grow is what you want if your interested in that junk, they wont show the control buckets because theres mnothing there, its flood and drain via 2 timers, float valves are used only for overflow. plus the CAP system is $399 at plantlighting.com and its aces
 

fatman7574

New Member
You can build either a chamber or large tube medium pressure aero system as cheaply that will easily out perform the bucket system. Very very simple. Tubes are just made with either polypropylene sheets or sheets of FRP plastic from Home Depot, Lowe's or any other large g hardware store. A 4' by 8' sheet will make a tube 6 inches wide, 20 inches tall and 8 foot long. The polypropylene costs about $15 per sheet or the FRP panels are about $30 each. Use plastic or stainless steel pop rivets to hold the seam together on the rolled tubes. Put the tubes in a trough made of 1/2" plywood with inside measurements of your combined tun be widths and heights,. IE for four tubes make the trough just short of 8' long and with inside measurements of 24" wide and 20 inches tall. With the left over plywood cut some 1" wide cross pieces to hold the squeezed to shape tubes in the trough and to keep the trough from spreading out.

Use an Iwaki MD-30RLZ pump from ebay and some common sprayers. With plants 6" apart. Using 90 watts the Iwaki pump will easily deliver 15 to 20 psi at a rate of 270 gph. That means at least 27 sprayers. At one sprayer between each plants root you will need 28. The pump can easily handle that with a delivery of 9.64 gph from each sprayer Rather then the maximum rated 10 gph per sprayer. The end caps from the tube are just made by draw ing a 13.75 inch rectangle with a 6 inch diameter half circle added to each end. Cut on the inside of your pencil lines to make them a bit smaller than the tubes. cover the inside of the tubes with some sheet plastic held with a few stainless steel screws. Use some silicone on the plywood edges. Cut the bottom inch or so from the drain end of the tun bes and let those just be held in place by friction. Use a piece of plastic gutter and a down spout to catch the drainage.

With a vertical height of 20 inches you will have very few roots laying in low do water so little worry about root rot and great root oxygenation with the medium pressure spray versus the typical dismal low pressure spray used by most behind the curve aero growers.

That means up to 56 plants in a 2" by 8" aero trough. Beats the cheezy bucket system. A simple largerubber n maid through will work without any need for an air pump and your temperature will be based upomn CO2 avilability not some blowm out of proportion high reervoir DO in the reservoir through low temp Myths. Sprayig the nutrients assures high DO water delivery regardless of resrvoir DO levels. Even 100 degree F water delivers ample DO to a good system where the water is spraed and large root masses do not lay in water in the bottom of small tubes, troughs or in small pots. Roots also grow better suspended entirely in air than in inert media grows, even those in large pots.
 
See now that sounds complicated as hell, i'm not good wit my hands at all. see i'm just trying to get the quickest most efficient system that i can buy without having it shipped to my house you kno what i'm saying? Lol............. how big of a yield do you guys think i can get with this? Do i need a co2 added on? And what lights do ya'll think would be the best ones to get? Any and all feedback is valued thank ya'll so much
 

jayjaytuner

Active Member
You can build either a chamber or large tube medium pressure aero system as cheaply that will easily out perform the bucket system. Very very simple. Tubes are just made with either polypropylene sheets or sheets of FRP plastic from Home Depot, Lowe's or any other large g hardware store. A 4' by 8' sheet will make a tube 6 inches wide, 20 inches tall and 8 foot long. The polypropylene costs about $15 per sheet or the FRP panels are about $30 each. Use plastic or stainless steel pop rivets to hold the seam together on the rolled tubes. Put the tubes in a trough made of 1/2" plywood with inside measurements of your combined tun be widths and heights,. IE for four tubes make the trough just short of 8' long and with inside measurements of 24" wide and 20 inches tall. With the left over plywood cut some 1" wide cross pieces to hold the squeezed to shape tubes in the trough and to keep the trough from spreading out.

Use an Iwaki MD-30RLZ pump from ebay and some common sprayers. With plants 6" apart. Using 90 watts the Iwaki pump will easily deliver 15 to 20 psi at a rate of 270 gph. That means at least 27 sprayers. At one sprayer between each plants root you will need 28. The pump can easily handle that with a delivery of 9.64 gph from each sprayer Rather then the maximum rated 10 gph per sprayer. The end caps from the tube are just made by draw ing a 13.75 inch rectangle with a 6 inch diameter half circle added to each end. Cut on the inside of your pencil lines to make them a bit smaller than the tubes. cover the inside of the tubes with some sheet plastic held with a few stainless steel screws. Use some silicone on the plywood edges. Cut the bottom inch or so from the drain end of the tun bes and let those just be held in place by friction. Use a piece of plastic gutter and a down spout to catch the drainage.

With a vertical height of 20 inches you will have very few roots laying in low do water so little worry about root rot and great root oxygenation with the medium pressure spray versus the typical dismal low pressure spray used by most behind the curve aero growers.

That means up to 56 plants in a 2" by 8" aero trough. Beats the cheezy bucket system. A simple largerubber n maid through will work without any need for an air pump and your temperature will be based upomn CO2 avilability not some blowm out of proportion high reervoir DO in the reservoir through low temp Myths. Sprayig the nutrients assures high DO water delivery regardless of resrvoir DO levels. Even 100 degree F water delivers ample DO to a good system where the water is spraed and large root masses do not lay in water in the bottom of small tubes, troughs or in small pots. Roots also grow better suspended entirely in air than in inert media grows, even those in large pots.

so this is like a combination between a NFT and a has the sprayers like a aeroponic??


Also, Is there is system very close to what you decribed available to purchase, or is this only done by home building...
 

fatman7574

New Member
so this is like a combination between a NFT and a has the sprayers like a aeroponic??


Also, Is there is system very close to what you decribed available to purchase, or is this only done by home building...

Not that I know of.

No a small tube aero is really more of a NTF than an aero system once its root mass gains any size. With a NTF the entire root mass is laying in a trough and the roots are spread out over a broad flat trough bottom. IE troughs 10" to 12: wide. Then water enters at one end of the trough and additional spaces in between. The water is typically not even sprayer but instead it just enters through a simple pipe. The high DO water hits the leading edge ge of the plant mass and spreads out across the full trough and by way of gravity and water pushing it though effects of gravity, the high DO water flow s through the thin mass of roots giving up a portion of its DO. The logic is that the water can make it all the way through the root masses and still have some DO left at the end of the trough.


Now the dim wit Maj growers and makers of crap growing systems for mj growers took this methodology and bastardized it in to a very poor system and shoved all the roots of a large mj root mass into a 3" or 4" wide through where most of the water just runs over the top of the roots mass and little actually penetrates into and though the rest of the root mass. As the root masses tend to grow together the water that makes it into the root masses (once they obtain a large size) does not provide enough DO as little water flows through the root n mass and what does flows very slowly so it gives up all its DO. IE NTF systems that are made with small tubes and narrow troughs have lots of root rot problems.

NTF was developed for growing vegetables that have very small root systems, (specifically lettuce) even then they use wide troughs so the roots are spread out, not piled on top of each other. There are huge commercial lettuce green houses lined up inn rows through out this country just growing lettuce by NTF methods. Typically you see those plants sold in a clear plastic box with their roots still attached.

Now the bastardization of aero with small tubes. Aero is a methodology where the roots are all hanging in air. That means plants like mj with large long roots systems need either tall tubes, tall chambers, tall tents with slits for the plant stems with a bar to hold up the net pot under the slits and a plastic sheet as a tent enclosing the whole of the system top and the sides. Dim wit growers like Earl shove grow all this in little tubes. This means once the plant masses roots grow down to the tube bottom the roots in the tube bottom are now growing in an NTF system and only a inch or tow is growing aero. Have you ever noticed Earls and others low presure small tube aero roots are always dieing of root rot before harvets time unless they are very quick short grows like 1 week or zere veg clone grow of indica dominant strains thar produce small root masses in a v short bud cycle. Even Sogs produce root masses that are too large for small tubes and troughs. so root rot becomes a problem even wit low temphigh DO reservoirs. Go figure.

Now give this a few more weeks and the tubes is full of roots and the whole system is really just a bastardized NTF system. The problem also lies in that the small tube aero has a round bottom usually so the roots have no flat horizontal surface for spreading out. Instead they almost immediately start piling up. As the water flows through the root ts slowly all the Do is used y up and the roots lay in very low to zero DO water and root rot sets in. Of course this starts really becoming a problem when the root mass is the largest. IE right after the beginning budding stretch. IE most aero roots are dead or near dead at harvest time.

This sorta problem and the wide use of DWC reservoirs with large root masses and poor circulation of high DO water into the root mass center s and the mass of roots laying in reservoir bottoms where the roots at the bottom of the pile lay in near to or x zero do water lead to the perpetuation of the old myth that reservoir water temps have to be low so reservoir DO levels will be high. With crap systems like small tube aeros, small tube or narrow trough NTF thick masses of roots stacked up or poorly circulated DWCs the added 25% DO between possible with 65 degree F water and 90 degree F water makes negligible difference.

Now also consider the bastardized Aero systems are usually run with cheap plastic miniature spray heads that are designed for use with 15 to 25 psi of water pressure. IE medium pressure. But dimwits like Earl and others have threads where they claim using cheap low pressure high flow pumps "work well enough"and they are cheaper than a pump such as a 15 to 40 psi Iwaki RZT pump. However the spray (water streams) coming from sprayers designed for 15 to 25 psi minimum do not oxygenate the water flow ing from them so unless you have higher DO in your reservoir you can not expect it from the sprayer.

A medium pressure pumps causes the spray to be fully saturated with DO even if the reservoir water had low DO water in it. It is not amazing so same goofs with such systems that are poorly designed or operated also insist the t temps in reservoirs must be kept low as low temp water contains more potential to hold more DO. Most of them claim the reservoir water should stay below 70 degrees F. at 80 Degree F water at an EC of 1.0 contains only about 12% less DO when fully saturated. Considering that a plants roots do not need nearly as mi much DO as is present at either temps if just shows there are a lot of dim wits that are behind the curve and just perpetuating Myths and have truths.

Tall tube or deep chamber grows have no or very minimal roots laying in water at the bottom of the tubes or chambers. Those that are there are just a thin layer and the water quickly flows trough them without losing or giving up all its DO. DWC is a MJ bastardized system mimicking DW aquaculture. However in lakes, ponds and oceans where this method is commonly used there the full body of the water is not filled with roots, nor is the bottom covered with roots. There is also a much better circulation of water in a commercial aqua culture or a DW aquaculture system then the poorly designed and operated DWC systems common to most mj DWC grows.
 
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