Hello new to forum - Ph too low PPM too high

BuckMann

Member
Been lurking for a few days and decided to join. Looks like a good resource here.

I recently converted plants from hydroponic system to soil. Hydro system box way too small. Hard to keep cool. Not enough airflow. I had gotten my Ph and PPM correct but water temps too high 79-80 degrees F. I had what seemed to be nice white, healthy roots in hydro. But I decided to get a tent for more room and convert to soil. I had a 36x24x16.5 grow box. Now have 48x24x60 tent. Conversion seemed to go well. But have an issue with now with Ph and PPM.

I am growing Bruce Banner strain. Plants are 4 weeks old. Converted plants to soil 4 days ago. Using Vivosun 5 gallon grow bags filled with FFOF. I have read, on this forum I think, that FFOF can be "hot" at first. I had also read, don't remember where, that when converting from hydro to soil you should water a lot a first. That's because plants were used to living in and getting nutes from water only. So therefore, they needed some time to get used to getting water and nutes from soil. I watered what seemed to me to be a lot. Grow bags damp on bottom and sides. But not to runoff. Today I watered to runoff to test Ph and PPM. Here are my numbers. Tap water Ph 7 PPM 151. Runoff water Ph 4.6 PPM 1875. Can overwatering cause these numbers? Makes sense PPM elevated due to "hot" soil. But don't know why Ph dropped like it did. Also temp/humidity in tent seem good. Lights on temps 79-82 degrees F, lights off 72-74 degrees F and humidity 47%-50%. I have a 6 inch exhaust fan connected to carbon filter at top of tent and 4 inch intake fan at the bottom. Plus a small clip on fan blowing across the top of grow bags.

I hope this wasn't info overload. I thought better too much info than too little to get proper advice. Am including a pic of plants as of today. The small plants in the middle very stressed in hydro. They may not amount to much. But don't want to discard them. A little worried they may herm. But they seem to be doing better the past few days. I will have to watch them closely. Will appreciate any advice. Thanks
View attachment Soil day 4.jpg
 
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BuckMann

Member
Plants probably will go into shock regardless.
Don't over water.
1 plant 1 pot.
Ph & PPM water before feeding.

Good luck
Thanks for your reply. I have been only giving plain water since converting to soil. Should I be adding nutes? I was advised the FFOF would have what my plants need at first. My water alone is 7 Ph and PPM 151. Getting x10 PPM in runoff and lower Ph. That's confusing to me.
 

Bukvičák

Well-Known Member
Thanks for your reply. I have been only giving plain water since converting to soil. Should I be adding nutes? I was advised the FFOF would have what my plants need at first. My water alone is 7 Ph and PPM 151. Getting x10 PPM in runoff and lower Ph. That's confusing to me.
Forget about EC and pH of runoff in potting mix. Those pots are quite big, I would not feed them for sure. Give them time to establish. 4 days in “soil” is just no time to see something happening.
 

Boreal Curing

Well-Known Member
Going from hydro to soil is a huge shock. You're going from spoon feeding oxygenated water and food, to fend for yourself. So go slow and let it get acclimated to it's new environment. Water too much and you'll drown her.
 

BuckMann

Member
Forget about EC and pH of runoff in potting mix. Those pots are quite big, I would not feed them for sure. Give them time to establish. 4 days in “soil” is just no time to see something happening.
Thanks. I noticed the bottom leaves on the plant on the right have started to brown and cup. But only that one. It is closest to the fan. I wonder if I need a fan. I have an active ventilation system with the bottom intake duct angled slightly upward in the middle of the tent. Enough circulation? Maybe I should invest in an oscillating fan. Will attempt to attach pics. That got me in spam jail on the first try. :neutral: I think admin got me straight. We shall see. In one pic you can see positioning of fan in background.
 

Attachments

BuckMann

Member
Going from hydro to soil is a huge shock. You're going from spoon feeding oxygenated water and food, to fend for yourself. So go slow and let it get acclimated to it's new environment. Water too much and you'll drown her.
Thank you. Others have advised the same. Last watering was yesterday 9-25. Will wait few days before more water. I have been watering all around the pots about 2 inches or so from plants. In the hope the roots will spread out searching for water and expand root base.
 

BuckMann

Member
Interestingly, I tried my hand at growing about 30 years ago. I bought the book "Marijuana Botany" by Robert Connell Clarke. I found that book to be an excellent resource. I did fairly well following that book. But my lights were too weak. Plants grew somewhat tall. But buds were loose and airy. Now I have very good lighting. Unfortunately I lost my copy of the book after several moves. I can get it from Amazon but I figured there have been advances in knowledge since that book was published. So I started doing internet research. I think I'll go ahead a get another copy. In the book the author quoted George Washington who said "Make the most of the Indian hemp seed. Sow it everywhere." He may have just been referring to ruderalis. But it wouldn't surprise me if GW and TJ didn't enjoy a fat doobie now and again.:P
 

Three Berries

Well-Known Member
I use the FoxFarm and don't add nutes until the leaves start to shrink. Growing from seedlings in about two-three weeks they get huge leaves. When this starts to subside I start adding a weak fertilizer. I add limestone to the FoxFarm soil and presoak it but not to runoff when originally filling the bucket.

When switching from water to soil the plants need time to develop the tiny hair roots. Beware overwatering them. Might try some H2O2 for water to get some O2 down to the roots.
 

BuckMann

Member
I use the FoxFarm and don't add nutes until the leaves start to shrink. Growing from seedlings in about two-three weeks they get huge leaves. When this starts to subside I start adding a weak fertilizer. I add limestone to the FoxFarm soil and presoak it but not to runoff when originally filling the bucket.

When switching from water to soil the plants need time to develop the tiny hair roots. Beware overwatering them. Might try some H2O2 for water to get some O2 down to the roots.
Thank you. I have some UC roots I bought for hydro setup. Will that work? I also have 3% stabilized hydrogen peroxide we keep around as an antiseptic. Will that work? If so, how much?
 

myke

Well-Known Member
I just switched some coco clones from solo to 2 gallon soil.No issues, didnt water for a week.Just added some myco and away they went.
I dont think you need to keep them so wet.
 

Three Berries

Well-Known Member
You don't have a lot of roots now. I'm not familiar with the UC roots. H2O2 will disassociate into H2O and O+ immediately, then the O+ finds something to bind too or another O+ atom.. Consider it as water in that respect. O+ is aggressive but 3% is no big deal.

Make sure the pot is not sitting in water. I have not found a good way to measure the pH of potted soil. Runoff would be concentrated so I don't think it's a good indicator. I think you are better off with lower nutes. The limestone acts as a pH buffer. Different than a base or acid. It will maintain a pH of around 7-7.5 until it gets used up. When it is being used up it also releases calcium and magnesium along with CO2. My well water is buffered by the same limestone and that is what makes it hard. pH of straight well water is about 7.4.

I aim for a 6.5-7.0 fert mix, assuming a nute buildup and gradual lowering of the pH in the soil. Add a little epsom salt to each gallon. I also add iron, potassium bicarbonate for the first veg feedings. Potassium bicarbonate is a good base to add to the soil or water to bring the pH. If I just need to raise the pH of the fert mix I use ammonia.
 

BuckMann

Member
I just switched some coco clones from solo to 2 gallon soil.No issues, didnt water for a week.Just added some myco and away they went.
I dont think you need to keep them so wet.
Thank you. I read about myco AFTER the transplant.:roll: I wish I had heard about that stuff before transplanting. I suppose it's too late to use that stuff now. From what I read you put some in the hole you put the plant in. Helps kickstart root development.
 

myke

Well-Known Member
Thank you. I read about myco AFTER the transplant.:roll: I wish I had heard about that stuff before transplanting. I suppose it's too late to use that stuff now. From what I read you put some in the hole you put the plant in. Helps kickstart root development.
Yup,I use this,pretty cheap.
https://www.amazon.ca/PREMIER-HORTICULTURE-6009051NPBX-Myke-Quart/dp/B01G0YIEJS/ref=asc_df_B01G0YIEJS/?tag=googleshopc0c-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=335561451246&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=12938311243802983842&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9001342&hvtargid=pla-348901616342&psc=1
 

BuckMann

Member
You don't have a lot of roots now. I'm not familiar with the UC roots. H2O2 will disassociate into H2O and O+ immediately, then the O+ finds something to bind too or another O+ atom.. Consider it as water in that respect. O+ is aggressive but 3% is no big deal.

Make sure the pot is not sitting in water. I have not found a good way to measure the pH of potted soil. Runoff would be concentrated so I don't think it's a good indicator. I think you are better off with lower nutes. The limestone acts as a pH buffer. Different than a base or acid. It will maintain a pH of around 7-7.5 until it gets used up. When it is being used up it also releases calcium and magnesium along with CO2. My well water is buffered by the same limestone and that is what makes it hard. pH of straight well water is about 7.4.

I aim for a 6.5-7.0 fert mix, assuming a nute buildup and gradual lowering of the pH in the soil. Add a little epsom salt to each gallon. I also add iron, potassium bicarbonate for the first veg feedings. Potassium bicarbonate is a good base to add to the soil or water to bring the pH. If I just need to raise the pH of the fert mix I use ammonia.
I have my pots in saucers that have the little risers in the center. My runoff accumulates around the sides of the saucers away from the pots. I put my hand under the pots and they are damp. I use a turkey baster to get runoff out of saucer.
 

Three Berries

Well-Known Member
If you have a willow tree around the young sticks boiled in a tea makes a good rooting hormone. The two I have just starting are getting a tablespoon a day. No other watering as the 3.5 gal pot was pre wetted. It will take a couple of weeks for the plant to start to use the water up.

The Happy Frog has the myco in it already I think.
 

BuckMann

Member
I suppose it's too late to use it. Is it possible to make some holes around the plants and drop some in? I believe I read that stuff is granular not powdery. Perhaps I could get some down in there. Or is it just too dang late?
 

myke

Well-Known Member
I suppose it's too late to use it. Is it possible to make some holes around the plants and drop some in? I believe I read that stuff is granular not powdery. Perhaps I could get some down in there. Or is it just too dang late?
Never too late,good ewc as a topdress is good also.
 

myke

Well-Known Member
Dont read into ph and ppm of soil runoff,means nothing.Cover your soil or shade it.Keep the top moist so it stays alive.
 

BuckMann

Member
If you have a willow tree around the young sticks boiled in a tea makes a good rooting hormone. The two I have just starting are getting a tablespoon a day. No other watering as the 3.5 gal pot was pre wetted. It will take a couple of weeks for the plant to start to use the water up.

The Happy Frog has the myco in it already I think.
My pots are 100% FFOF. I just read that Happy Frog is "amended with soil microbes that help improve root efficiency and encourage nutrient uptake." A friend who is growing said he mixed OF & HF. His plants are doing well. All this is good info. I will be much better off on my next grow starting from scratch.
 
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